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Forums - Politics Discussion - Santa Barbara Massacre: To Hell With Facts

NobleTeam360 said:
Luck said:
NobleTeam360 said:
If the gun control nuts think crime is bad now just wait when all the guns are gone from civilians, and only the criminals have them. Our neighbor to the south is a pretty good example of what awaits.

Yeah, good job not talking about your neighbor to the north. You wouldn't want to discredit the whole of your argument. I mean, seriously ? 

What? Why would I even say to the North? As far as I know Canada has similar gun laws to the United States. I could be wrong about that, any Canadians want to tell me what the general gun laws in Canada are?

As much as I despise anyone that owns a gun, and as much as I cannot comprehend that a completely sane person would even think about killing another human being, let alone actually doing it, I must, on a greater level, agree that more guns actually deters violence.

As na example I'll just broaden the scope to entire countries. US Army had no real doubts when it came to attacking Afghanistan, because they knew that Afghanis are generally disorganized and have no real weapons to pose a threat to the Americans. So they attacked them.

But, Americans believe North Korea has nuclear weapons, and that those nuclear weapons migh tbe used to defend themselves, so the Army is scared shitless of attacking Koreans. And Koreans strut around with their weapons, taunt Americans, but Americans do nothing. Because guns scare people. And they are scared that the Koreans might actually be that crazy 11th grader who has stashed away 5 rifles, 10 shotguns and 20 pistols and might take them to school.

That's why it's good that all Americans have weapons. Makes them scared of each other. And fear is the best deterrent.



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Burek said:

As much as I despise anyone that owns a gun, and as much as I cannot comprehend that a completely sane person would even think about killing another human being, let alone actually doing it, I must, on a greater level, agree that more guns actually deters violence.

As na example I'll just broaden the scope to entire countries. US Army had no real doubts when it came to attacking Afghanistan, because they knew that Afghanis are generally disorganized and have no real weapons to pose a threat to the Americans. So they attacked them.

But, Americans believe North Korea has nuclear weapons, and that those nuclear weapons migh tbe used to defend themselves, so the Army is scared shitless of attacking Koreans. And Koreans strut around with their weapons, taunt Americans, but Americans do nothing. Because guns scare people. And they are scared that the Koreans might actually be that crazy 11th grader who has stashed away 5 rifles, 10 shotguns and 20 pistols and might take them to school.

That's why it's good that all Americans have weapons. Makes them scared of each other. And fear is the best deterrent.

Yes, give every household a nuke, that would really help :).



Now you're being silly :)

I was thinking more about giving each of them a tank and a few grenade launchers. It would at least make waiting in line for a new iPhone much more exciting.



So, do some people here even realise that it takes just an instant to pull a trigger and kill someone? It doesn't even matter if that person has even a RPG, you saw him first, and he is as good as dead from that instant, especially in close range.
Now tell me that its the same with knife and other "weapons".

In the end, I realise that I come from a part of world where guns are prohibited to civilians, and people who disagree are maybe gun owners who come from other parts. However, I prefer a world where you don't have to carry a gun with you and constantly pray that you and your dear ones never come across a psychopath with a gun. Its a needless fear I am glad I live without, thanks to the rules in the society I live.



ganoncrotch said:
Luck said:

You might want to re-read what he said earlier:

Case 1 - Give a psychopath a knife/sharp object and see how many people he could kill before being apprehended.
Case 2 - Now give him a gun (any lethal gun would do) and see how many people he could kill.

When you respond ''do you want to ban water because we can drown in it?'', you are missing the point of his argument and using faulty logic.

Did I reply to his earlier comments or just this one? This person in fact has 141 posts on this forum, I replied to one of them, if you enjoyed his earlier posts that is fine but those are not reflected in what I replied to.

Besides your 2 cases are rather weak here, you suggest that if I was mental enough I couldn't go into a local school / hospital / store where there would be no one prepared for any sort of attack and not kill more people with a knife than a round of bullets for most guns would hold? I assure you in the wrong hands any weapon will kill a lot of people. What is needed is a lot more reportability from people who deal with those who are mentally unwell, right now in Ireland there is a lot of cases where husbands have killed their familys and during investigations it's turned out that they had confessed desires to do that to their doctors / psychiachchrist in confidence.

Only thing sadder than hearing about children being murdered is to find out that it could have been avoided if people were aware of what was known about a persons mental health.

Thinking more about the case in point btw, he used a car to kill one of six of the people, you can't try to impose car control based on this one case tho.

Uh, no. You quoted that part of my comment too.



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Dragon246 said:
So, do some people here even realise that it takes just an instant to pull a trigger and kill someone? It doesn't even matter if that person has even a RPG, you saw him first, and he is as good as dead from that instant, especially in close range.
Now tell me that its the same with knife and other "weapons".

In the end, I realise that I come from a part of world where guns are prohibited to civilians, and people who disagree are maybe gun owners who come from other parts. However, I prefer a world where you don't have to carry a gun with you and constantly pray that you and your dear ones never come across a psychopath with a gun. Its a needless fear I am glad I live without, thanks to the rules in the society I live.

I'd take a wild guess that the rules you live in also say not to kill someone? They do in Santa Barbara as well, I don't know what makes you think that someone who doesn't listen to rules like "don't kill people" will also stick to rules like "don't own a gun"



Why not check me out on youtube and help me on the way to 2k subs over at www.youtube.com/stormcloudlive

ganoncrotch said:
Dragon246 said:
So, do some people here even realise that it takes just an instant to pull a trigger and kill someone? It doesn't even matter if that person has even a RPG, you saw him first, and he is as good as dead from that instant, especially in close range.
Now tell me that its the same with knife and other "weapons".

In the end, I realise that I come from a part of world where guns are prohibited to civilians, and people who disagree are maybe gun owners who come from other parts. However, I prefer a world where you don't have to carry a gun with you and constantly pray that you and your dear ones never come across a psychopath with a gun. Its a needless fear I am glad I live without, thanks to the rules in the society I live.

I'd take a wild guess that the rules you live in also say not to kill someone? They do in Santa Barbara as well, I don't know what makes you think that someone who doesn't listen to rules like "don't kill people" will also stick to rules like "don't own a gun"

Let me guess, by making gun industry go boom? No guns to buy for general civilians, no seller. Psychopath doesnt get his gun, everybody lives happily.

I know, too much to ask from American society.



Dragon246 said:
ganoncrotch said:
Dragon246 said:
So, do some people here even realise that it takes just an instant to pull a trigger and kill someone? It doesn't even matter if that person has even a RPG, you saw him first, and he is as good as dead from that instant, especially in close range.
Now tell me that its the same with knife and other "weapons".

In the end, I realise that I come from a part of world where guns are prohibited to civilians, and people who disagree are maybe gun owners who come from other parts. However, I prefer a world where you don't have to carry a gun with you and constantly pray that you and your dear ones never come across a psychopath with a gun. Its a needless fear I am glad I live without, thanks to the rules in the society I live.

I'd take a wild guess that the rules you live in also say not to kill someone? They do in Santa Barbara as well, I don't know what makes you think that someone who doesn't listen to rules like "don't kill people" will also stick to rules like "don't own a gun"

Let me guess, by making gun industry go boom? No guns to buy for general civilians, no seller. Psychopath doesnt get his gun, everybody lives happily.

I know, too much to ask from American society.

how do you purpose the US do that, with over 400 million legal guns already in circulation, and a complete open border to the south which contributes greatly to the illegal gun trafficing.



 

NobleTeam360 said:

What? Why would I even say to the North? As far as I know Canada has similar gun laws to the United States. I could be wrong about that, any Canadians want to tell me what the general gun laws in Canada are?


I'll fill this in. Guns are much more restricted here than in the States. You need to own a gun license, and there are different ones based on the firearm you own. There are different classes but in general, if you don't have a license for a restricted weapon then you can't own that weapon period. You also HAVE to register restricted firearms, before this applied to all weaposn but the long gun registration was destroyed not too long ago. The types of guns are also more strict, as far as I know AKs, AR15s and other (but not all) semiautos are banned, I don't know the full list but you can find it online.

What is a restricted firearm? This bascially http://www.rcmp-grc.gc.ca/cfp-pcaf/fs-fd/restr-eng.htm. Most of the time, it's handguns. You are also not allowed to have open or concealed carry, unless you live in the wilderness where you need to carry around a gun in the open so you don't get mauled by a bear.

Most importantly, firearms are not a constitutional right here, so yeah that's pretty self explanatory.

Canada has about 30 guns per 100 residents, about 3 times less than the US, so while it's not uncommon to find people with firearms here. Most of the time it's county folk, hunters or hobbiests that do own guns.



Leadified said:
NobleTeam360 said:

What? Why would I even say to the North? As far as I know Canada has similar gun laws to the United States. I could be wrong about that, any Canadians want to tell me what the general gun laws in Canada are?


I'll fill this in. Guns are much more restricted here than in the States. You need to own a gun license, and there are different ones based on the firearm you own. There are different classes but in general, if you don't have a license for a restricted weapon then you can't own that weapon period. You also HAVE to register restricted firearms, before this applied to all weaposn but the long gun registration was destroyed not too long ago. The types of guns are also more strict, as far as I know AKs, AR15s and other (but not all) semiautos are banned, I don't know the full list but you can find it online.

What is a restricted firearm? This bascially http://www.rcmp-grc.gc.ca/cfp-pcaf/fs-fd/restr-eng.htm. Most of the time, it's handguns. You are also not allowed to have open or concealed carry, unless you live in the wilderness where you need to carry around a gun in the open so you don't get mauled by a bear.

Most importantly, firearms are not a constitutional right here, so yeah that's pretty self explanatory.

Canada has about 30 guns per 100 residents, about 3 times less than the US, so while it's not uncommon to find people with firearms here. Most of the time it's county folk, hunters or hobbiests that do own guns.

Ah ok thanks for the info :),