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Forums - Gaming Discussion - MS preys on Consumer Ignorance with Xbox 360/One

Cant disagree.

A 2014 product that has no rechargeable batteries is a just a money grab joke, and having to buy a special adapter to use my own headset is a major fuck you to their user base. Such is the case so I'm only garbing exclusives on X1, not even bothering with the crap deal that is Gold compared to Plus so they best have awesome single player. That on top of forcing a unwanted camera on everyone and charging more then 100 then their superior competition. Lots of shady shit from them this gen for sure.



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TheSting said:

Lol oh my. Man just buy what you want. Why are you so concerned about ppl being misinformed(which seems to me that it means they didnt pick what you think is best value)? You think ppl havent had fun with their choice regardless of this stance? No one cares. This is iphone vs android Nfl vs Nba etc etc... Reskinned.

Because when people buy things, the stockholders don't think to themselves "hmmm....people must have bought this in droves because they are misinformed". They're gonna think "whatever we're doing, it's right". And that can result in a detriment. Why do you think Microsoft start putting out a bunch of Kinect crap? Instead of getting great new games, you got games like Kinect Disneyland and Just Dance, and the like for the last 3+ years and nothing else compelling.

So them thinking "this is where we should head" resulted in Xbox 360 sales stagnating, allowing the PS3 to pass it, but Kinect was "successful" enough for them to think it was a good idea to pack it into the XBone, thus jacking up the price, adding a bunch of features that no one wants, etc. You sure you're not concerned about people being misinformed? Think about the fact that you could have gotten a much cheaper XBone, and it would have higher sales, meaning more and more support for the console down the road. You can pretend that it only matters that "people have fun with their choice regardless of your stance", but in the long run, it affects consumers, at large.



LivingMetal said:
sales2099 said:
I forgot which corporation said to work two jobs just to be able to afford a certain console.

Please remind me which corporation said that? :p


That "corporation" was Katuragi, and he was essentially fired for it.  And Sony has been making ammends since.  ;)

Never heard of that company...... oh you mean Sony ok nevermind. 



Machiavellian said:

I am sorry but Sony did not learn anything from MS.  If anything they have projected the cost and benefits long before MS even put such policy into place.  They chose to do it because it makes more money.  Trying to push the blame and spin it any different is really showing your colors.  Hell, Sony even made a statement a long time ago that they will not charge for MP and look at us today.  Corporations make choices just like any individual.  The fact you want to ignore your preferred corporation doing someting for pure profit doesn't look good for your argument.  What other things Sony is going to do that you will push the blame to some other competitor because it helps you to sleep at night.

You keep talking but you have yet to do the one thing I asked, provide an example. You're making all these wild claims and conjectures, prove your reasoning. Because I have been giving evidence of Microsoft's shit. 

You mean to tell me that Sony was able to see into the future and predict that there would be no backlash from charging for multiplayer, or that DRM would be unfavorable with the consumers? You mean to tell me that Sony knew this and MS did not? Give me an example of pushing the blame on to competitors and spinning from Sony, the only one making PR statement to clean up their own shit is Microsoft.

Since Feb 22, PS4 has had the same exact stance, no 180's no back tracks, everytime a negative rumor comes out about PS4, it just gets disproved by reality.

Like I said, whenever, MS's bs is exposed fans like you will downplay and damage control to try and equate the playing field.

Prove your claims or you're just creating FUD.

The most idiotic thing about your rant is that you have obviously confused my intentions, this is not some stupid fanboy dribble.

I've said countless times, I like Xbox's games just as much as Like PlayStation's, or Nintendo's, my problem was the what MS gets away with, and thats why I've never subscribed to Live. But my problem is with, is the defense and advocacy of MS's anticonsumer polices, with reasoning's like I only care about myself and its not that serious. But it is actively harming console gaming, because the standards for MS are lower despite the fact that they are by far the most capable.

PSN and PS+ have exsisted long before the start of this generation, but clearly paying for netflix, youtube, ie, ads, multiplayer, and xbl marketplace was "no big deal", so its ludicrous to claim that Sony wasn't prompted by MS to make PS+ mandatory for multiplayer cause XBl has been getting away with it since its inception, especially after 8+ years.

You claim to have a "counter argument" when you don't even have an argument let alone any evidence to support it.

You keep attempting to reduce everything to cost and benefits, which ultimately is the purpose of a buisness, but you are blantaly ignoring the vast difference between how these companies approach it.

You can be profitable by valuing the consumers and coaxing them to pay you rather than forcing them to pay you. XBL vs PS+ is a fundamental example. PS+ gives you free games that are accessible with the service, the more games you have the more incentive you have to subscribe, similar to the gamerscore with XBl. Now PS+ requires payment for multiplayer to make the service more valuable by taking value away from the console. Its a shitty practice, but XBL has this problem in spades. Rather than just multiplayer, practically the entire feature set of the console requires XBL, stealing value away from the console to make itself look like a premium service, but of course it should have ads because MS is bleeding money from every oriffice.

Leave you conjecture at the door, the only reason you think all companies act like this is because Microsoft Xbox has indoctirnated you.



In this day and age, with the Internet, ignorance is a choice! And they're still choosing Ignorance! - Dr. Filthy Frank

S.T.A.G.E. said:

Keep your blind faith in MS. No ones advocating it or putting it down but rather talking about Microsoft as a corporation and their practices which ARE detrimental to the industry (which can affect consumers).


I agree with that statement 100%.
However, I also consider Sony to be a detriment to the industry.

They have done some pretty shocking anti-consumer practices in the past.

Then again, you almost need to expect such things when it comes to public for-profit non-charitable companies whose sole purpose is to sell you a product for monetary gain, they aren't going to send you cake and flowers for your Birthday as they don't care about the indivudual on a personal basis. :P

I wish Microsoft and Sony would take notice of the PC more and especially Steam, which has done some great things for the PC landscape, Valve being a private company not answering to shareholders helps a ton.



--::{PC Gaming Master Race}::--

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S.T.A.G.E. said:
J_Allard said:
Breaking news: Huge corporation enjoys making money.

All 3 of these game companies do thus. To try and rate them is a waste of time. Whoever you put #1, if the other 2 guys could be #1 they'd do it in a heartbeat.

This gen MS and Sony have both tried to pull one over on me. MS by "repairing" my RROD 360 burn it died agin the same night I got it back. Told them they have one more shot to fix it right or they lose my business and my last returned Xbox was a new unit with an updated chip set.

Sony has released games they knew were broken in terms of online MP hoping to capitalize on uninformed gamers, have charged my card multiple times for shit I didn't sign up for, tried to pull wool over our eyes with Killzone 6 resolution, and of course PSN hacked. Plus they have that fucking stupid 12GB console that is worthless if you wanna play many games. Do they warn people that some games will take almost all of that space? No. They don't care so long as you buy.

Article reads like it was written by a bitter GameFAQs poster.

No one denies corporations like to make money, but since Microsoft has joined...

Forcing people to pay for online.

Almost succeeded in ramming DRM down peoples throats until the whistle was blown on them after E3. 

Nickel and diming on accessories

Set a record for faulty hardware.

Pays to keep games away from competitors and then complains when they don't have parity (hypocrisy in its finest).

Flip flops because their ignorant approach in dealing with customers and indie devs. 

Admits to lack of first party at the end of the generation and talks about focusing on "quality" as an excuse for why they don't have new IP's.  They literally had to answer to the media for the last two years about it. They make a  new first party IP and then drop it to focus on buying Gears of War. Just shows you their undying devotion to testing new waters.

 

I enjoy the "Bitter MS FUD" section of your playbook as much as the next guy, but how is most of that post relevant to my post? Do I care that you think the RROD sucks, or that buying up content sucks (unless Sony does it), or that their stance on indie devs or 1st party quality sucks to you? That has nothing to do with capitalizing on the ignorant gamer.

I listed things MS and Sony have actually done directly to me as a consumer because they hoped I'd be complacent enough to not bat an eye. You're basically complaining about some policies and strategies they employ or even used to employ. The moral of the story remains, all companies try to capitalize on willing customers. Ranking them is stupid imho. You're basically saying businesses love money.



Pemalite said:
S.T.A.G.E. said:

Keep your blind faith in MS. No ones advocating it or putting it down but rather talking about Microsoft as a corporation and their practices which ARE detrimental to the industry (which can affect consumers).


I agree with that statement 100%.
However, I also consider Sony to be a detriment to the industry.

They have done some pretty shocking anti-consumer practices in the past.

Then again, you almost need to expect such things when it comes to public for-profit non-charitable companies whose sole purpose is to sell you a product for monetary gain, they aren't going to send you cake and flowers for your Birthday as they don't care about the indivudual on a personal basis. :P

I wish Microsoft and Sony would take notice of the PC more and especially Steam, which has done some great things for the PC landscape, Valve being a private company not answering to shareholders helps a ton.


Sony has no excuse for their mistakes, but unlike Microsoft they're pushing the consoles in tech and visual nature. Unlike Microsoft its becoming their bread and butter so they will do what it takes to survive where they are strongest. 



d21lewis said:

 Microsoft is a bunch of demons.  Sony are a bunch of saints.


Finally. Someone who has the balls to come out and say what we're all thinking.



J_Allard said:
S.T.A.G.E. said:
J_Allard said:
Breaking news: Huge corporation enjoys making money.

All 3 of these game companies do thus. To try and rate them is a waste of time. Whoever you put #1, if the other 2 guys could be #1 they'd do it in a heartbeat.

This gen MS and Sony have both tried to pull one over on me. MS by "repairing" my RROD 360 burn it died agin the same night I got it back. Told them they have one more shot to fix it right or they lose my business and my last returned Xbox was a new unit with an updated chip set.

Sony has released games they knew were broken in terms of online MP hoping to capitalize on uninformed gamers, have charged my card multiple times for shit I didn't sign up for, tried to pull wool over our eyes with Killzone 6 resolution, and of course PSN hacked. Plus they have that fucking stupid 12GB console that is worthless if you wanna play many games. Do they warn people that some games will take almost all of that space? No. They don't care so long as you buy.

Article reads like it was written by a bitter GameFAQs poster.

No one denies corporations like to make money, but since Microsoft has joined...

Forcing people to pay for online.

Almost succeeded in ramming DRM down peoples throats until the whistle was blown on them after E3. 

Nickel and diming on accessories

Set a record for faulty hardware.

Pays to keep games away from competitors and then complains when they don't have parity (hypocrisy in its finest).

Flip flops because their ignorant approach in dealing with customers and indie devs. 

Admits to lack of first party at the end of the generation and talks about focusing on "quality" as an excuse for why they don't have new IP's.  They literally had to answer to the media for the last two years about it. They make a  new first party IP and then drop it to focus on buying Gears of War. Just shows you their undying devotion to testing new waters.

 

I enjoy the "Bitter MS FUD" section of your playbook as much as the next guy, but how is most of that post relevant to my post? Do I care that you think the RROD sucks, or that buying up content sucks (unless Sony does it), or that their stance on indie devs or 1st party quality sucks to you? That has nothing to do with capitalizing on the ignorant gamer.

I listed things MS and Sony have actually done directly to me as a consumer because they hoped I'd be complacent enough to not bat an eye. You're basically complaining about some policies and strategies they employ or even used to employ. The moral of the story remains, all companies try to capitalize on willing customers. Ranking them is stupid imho. You're basically saying businesses love money.

No hes saying different businesses go to different extents to make money.



forevercloud3000 said:
EpicRandy said:
Seems to me that the writer prays more on reader's ignorance than Ms prays on consumers' ignorance.

care to elaborate?


Because it is full of twisted and/or nitpicked pieces of information that do not show the big picture. Opinion stated as a fact does not make a truth. and the article is based on the concept that the reader will not look further for more information that will debunk many if not all its point. That's why I said that the writter prays more on reader's ignorance thant ms prays on consumer's ignorance.