About 2 hours and world will know what he wants.
What is his end state | |||
Annex Ukraine As a whole | 337 | 40.60% | |
Annex Crimea | 286 | 34.46% | |
Defend Russian People Fro... | 184 | 22.17% | |
Total: | 807 |
About 2 hours and world will know what he wants.
kitler53 said: i was just asking myself this same question yesterday... ...if putin/russia has anything to gain from this i don't see it. seems risky with too many bad outcomes to me. |
Russia has a naval base in Crimea where they keep their fleet... and it's pretty much the only place Russia can keep their western navy as northern ports freeze over too often to be reliable.
Basically to lose Crimea is to lose all western europeon naval capabilties.
haxxiy said: Seems like the EU and the US instigated Ukrainian revolt in the hopes the country would join the EU / NATO and quietly drift away from Russian influence. The Western leaders didn't predict either the influence of the ultra-nationalists of the Right Sector, or the willingness of Russia to protect their interests. |
Seems awful conspiracy theoristish, espiecally considering just how much of a disaster the Ukraine has been.
There were plenty of reasons for revolution without the need for provocation.
It's been no secret the Ukraine was about to default hard. Meanwhile, the president was skimming off the top pretty heavily.
DamnTastic said:
I wouldn't exactly call EU a military superpower and putin knows this. |
I mean... it is if you count all the US troops stationed in it.
Christ, the US Military wastes so much money.
There are rumours that Ukrainan and Russian soldiers have engaged outside of Crimea. Don't know if those are true or not.
Lumikki said: Putin's biggest dream is to establish the Eurasian Economic Union. The current possible members for that union are naturally Belarus, Kazakhstan and Russia itself. The other member candidates are Armenia, Kyrgyzstan and Tajikistan. |
The analysis of Putin's general objective is correct, it's just that in this case, it's not what's trying to be achieved... at least, not directly.
After thinking about it a bit, it seems to be more of a pre-emptive strike in an attempt to secure Crimea as a naval base in the black sea. You can be sure that the fascists in the Kiev Rada will want to cancel that agreement - and who knows how soon. The secondary objective is to incite unrest in pro-Russian parts of Ukraine - so far it seems to be successful (but ultimately gainless for the people doing it, or Russia). Odessa and Donetsk Radas have been taken over, both have Russian flags hanging over them now.
However, for current Ukraine, going the way of the EU or association with it, means a Bosnian or Moldavian scenario, so honestly, whichever government, whichever president, it always seems to be a lose-lose situation, really... one is a spineless fuckup (Yanukovich), the forthcoming ones are just suicidal.
JEMC said:
I agree, Russia getting in the way not only doesn't help, but increases the internal problems making the needed elections far more difficult. They should have stood aside and let the the police or army do their job with the illegal militia. |
As the Nazi-groups are part of the new Maidan-government, thepolice and army is doing nothing against them. Europe should pressure the Ukraine, to make fair and free elections possible. And yes, the russian invasion isn't helping.
Kasz216 said:
Russia has a naval base in Crimea where they keep their fleet... and it's pretty much the only place Russia can keep their western navy as northern ports freeze over too often to be reliable.
|
Not totally correct because the new goverment (the one from last week) accepted that the Russia naval fleet can stay their.
GamechaserBE said:
Not totally correct because the new goverment (the one from last week) accepted that the Russia naval fleet can stay their. |
Sure at the moment... but it's not like Russia can just take their word for it.
Eventually the new elected goverment would force the fleet to leave, since they aren't in Russia's pocket like Yanu.
Probably right after they agreed to a full Nato integration.
Kasz216 said:
There were plenty of reasons for revolution without the need for provocation. It's been no secret the Ukraine was about to default hard. Meanwhile, the president was skimming off the top pretty heavily. |
Janukowitsch did that all the time. But protest started, as he decided that the offers from Russia about avoiding the default seem better than the one from the EU. And we already know, that the Konrad-Adenauer-Stiftung (a foundation linked to the governing german party CDU) financed some groups at the Maidan.