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Forums - Gaming Discussion - The inflection point for diminishing returns appears to be the PS3/360 generation

fallen said:

I never believed in diminishing returns, but then next gen came out and I'm just not seeing a huge leap. Take Killzone Shadowfall. It didn't garner near the massive graphics hype of the original Killzone on PS3. Why? Because it looks like just something we'd already seen on PC, or not really THAT much better than a good Xbox 360 shooter like Halo 4, or hell even Crysis 3 on 360.

Now, I know that next gen will produce better things once engines are built from the ground up for them. But to my shock and surprise, next gen games so far look like really good PS3/360 games, not another world.

You couldn't say that for any prior gen. every gen was a HUGGGGEEE leap on the one before. Ps3/360 was a HUGE leap over Ps2. PS2 was a HUGE leap over PS1. And all the way back.

 

Um is this your first gen transition? People always say next gen games look like polished current gen games. Don't you remember xbox 1.5? Heck just go read all the old forums out there. If you dig deep enough, there are people even claiming diminishing returns for the ps2 launch.



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My take on this is related to screen size. When the PS360 came out, the most common screen size was 32-40 inches ion a larger screen in a home. Now, an average large screen tv is 55 inches or even 65 inches. The graphics change is much more obvious on a large tv. I have a 70 inch tv that my XB1/PS3 are hooked up to. When I switch between them, there is an obvious difference.



It is near the end of the end....

Thats because the GPU power went into getting good resolutions and frame-rates.
At the same res and frame rate, PS4 would kill the PS3 on graphical effects.



HylianSwordsman said:
SvennoJ said:

8K is targeted for the end of consumer resolution which is near indistinguishable from real life. It will be most useful for VR anyway.
This gen is struggling with a jump from 720p to 1080p, 4k 60fps is at least another whole generation away.

Anyway yes the end of output resolution is in sight. Draw distance, lighting, object detail still has a long way to go. There is always consumer demand for better looking graphics. People can still tell the diference in movies and obviously care considering the success of Gravity, which can be summed up as grieving mother rediscovers will to live after facing certain death.


Well you sound like you're a lot more familiar with this. We do have more generations to come of improvements, but I think we'll soon start caring about new sorts of improvements, not just graphical ones. I haven't heard of Gravity, I'll have to check it out.

It's just the latest cgi bonanza with cutting edge techniques to reach photo realism. In the line of Avatar, Inception, Hugo, Life of Pi, Gravity. The success of those movies does not seem to correlate with the quality of the story telling.

New sorts of improvements start with a powerful cpu, lots of headroom to experiment. Unfortunately the cpu is the part that got the smallest upgrade this gen. Natural speech recognition and generation, with AI to support actual conversations with game characters will be a game changer. cpu's are still too weak for that atm, and unlike graphical improvements, the game industry will have to figure that out themselves instead of copying the movie industry.
I'm already happy sound is getting some new love with MADDER. Hearing the same environmental effect filters for generations was getting stale.



It's not hard to understand, launch games and near launch games aren't going to look that great as say a game 3 years from now.



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We're at the start of the generation. What did you expect? X360 games were not very impressive, at all, until Gears. PS2 gen 1 games looked awful, and the last few games on the original Xbox and Gamecube looked marvelous (even GOW2 on PS2). Give this gen some time.



Do people even remember how early PS3/360 games looked? Aside from a few exceptions most of them looked like upscaled PS2 titles.



Sigs are dumb. And so are you!

Fusioncode said:
Do people even remember how early PS3/360 games looked? Aside from a few exceptions most of them looked like upscaled PS2 titles.

yep, I was just playing this again on 360


Or to compare two launch exclusive turds (by general opinion, not mine)







I didn't think Kameo was bad.

I have also yet to play Knack so I'll reserve judgment until then.



In this day and age, with the Internet, ignorance is a choice! And they're still choosing Ignorance! - Dr. Filthy Frank

Diminishing returns is very real, it is also a gradual effect. Luckily processing power increases exponentially not linearly so we are good for a fare few years yet. Once you can't easily distinguish between real-time and current pre-rendered visuals then we will have hit the wall. Give devs 2-3 years to update their engines and production pipelines before you judge. What you have seen so far is mostly old techniques at a higher fidelity with a few gimmicks on top. When games are built from the ground up from art direction to tech to production pipeline to optimization we will see much better results. So far we have seen last gen art tech and production with next gen polish, as devs didn't have modern hardware when they started development 2-4 years ago.



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