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Forums - Gaming Discussion - Nintendo Made The Biggest Leap of The Big Three With Wii U

zippy said:
d21lewis said:
And they're still behind the Xbox 360 in most areas.


My Wii U  hasnt died on me yet, i need to get through at least 3 before i can say its on par with the 360 ;)


It can't die on you if there are no games to play on it! Just trolling!! LOL



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SubiyaCryolite said:
MDMAlliance said:
SubiyaCryolite said:

I dont consider it to be a leap when they where and still are failry behind to begin with. What does this large leap even mean to game developers or consumers who are already exposed to the PS4 and X1?

That point doesn't even matter, look at your original comment.  It is one that tries to deny the jump from Wii to Wii U by saying that it's offset by the GC to Wii jump.  There was no point in saying that, especially given that it was already mentioned in the video.  Whether the guy in the video has a real point or not is irrelevant given how you made your response.

I dont buy the small gap argument either, it will show and when it does it'll blow peoples minds. Heck it already is. People said the the same thing about the PS2 and PS3. Hell, I said that. And yet today the difference between a PS2 and a PS3 game is beyond night and day.The Wii was barely pushed above the Gamecube even with Nintendos own titles. But when you compare launch PS3 and 360 games to what they do now, and then look at the sheer raw power inside both the PS4 and X1 things wont look good at all.

I don't even get what your point here is.  This is about Wii to Wii U, not Gamecube to Wii.  It's like you entirely missed the point.

NFS Rivals on PS4 is already leagues above NFS MW on U. If you look at NFS Carbon (a launch PS3 game) and Rivals on the PS3 and apply that to scale the PS4 then its going to be nothing short of a visual massacre.

That is 100% irrelevant given that the thread isn't comparing Wii U to PS4 graphics.  You're just ranting to make it seem like you have a point.  You don't.  No one is arguing Wii U vs PS4 graphics.  No one.

If Nintendo hopes to release a gen 9 system on par with the PS5 and XBoxTwo for example it will basically have to make TWO jumps in one go.

 

  • 1st jump, match the PS4/X1.
  • 2nd jump close to the PS5/X2 as possible.

 

That wont do them any favours, given how they are struggling with the U. They basically shot themselves in the foot, twice. 

That doesn't even make any sense.  How does making two jumps equate to not doing them any favors?  You're making a logical jump, and coming to a conclusion without even elaborating on your thought process.  Making two jumps when you're a "jump" behind doesn't take twice as much effort FYI.

 I dont put the U down, I own one for petes sake. That said I dont defend it either, not in the slightest. Truth is the Wii U has tons of things about it worth criticising. Just like the launch PS3 I call a spade a spade, not a big spoon. This system has serious issues.

No, I have seen the repeated amount of comments you make on threads.  I don't know if you even actually own one.  If you do, it doesn't mean you're exempt from being "anti-Wii U."  I don't normally respond to your comments because I usually let you have your opinions. But this time, it was just trying to take a cheap-shot at the Wii U by trying to state that the jump between Wii and Wii U is somehow taken away by the jump between GC and Wii.  Like I have said multiple times before, it is irrelevant to the topic here.  There was no reason to say it unless you wanted to keep beating a dead horse.

I dont approve of its hardware at all. Nintendo had the money and resources to make something truly decent. 2GHz quad core. 2GB GDDR5 unified memory shared with a 5670HD equivalent GPU. But nope. They set the bar low, far too low. I feel Nintendo has backed itself into a corner. I dont see gen 8 being salvaged and gen 9 will be a deciding moment in regards Nintendos future in the home console business.

Just so you know, putting better hardware into the Wii U does NOT guarantee it to do better.  The Gamecube did this, and failed.  People are comparing the Wii U to the Gamecube, but people like you need to be reminded that Nintendo did what you're thinking Nintendo should do now with the Gamecube.  The market isn't so predictable, and it is only in hindsight that you can claim it is so obvious.  

There are multiple "problems" with the Wii U, but if you look through the history of videogame console sales, you will realize that some of those "mistakes" you think is making the Wii U fail now were also present in previous consoles as well.  The issue here is much less about Wii U's hardware, and much more about Wii U's marketing and possibly software and online integration.  



Theres your proof. Every single 3rd party in that game up there runs better on the 360. Every single firts party game there is not leaps and bounds above the 3rd party games. Owning a Wii U doesnt make me blind to the fact that it has outdated technology. My original comment doesnt deny the Wii to Wii U jump, it STATES the obvious fact that the jump is insignificant when its base was so low to begin with.  My second comment was to point out how pointless it is to act like Nintendos jump is some achievement that should be lauded because it isnt, they are and will be playing cath up for the forseeable future. 


Honestly that isn't "proof" as it's simply a picture of Wii U games.  However, I do not care whether or not you have a Wii U.  It seems like you still don't understand what I'm saying.  I am saying that just because you have a Wii U doesn't mean you are suddenly unbiased and know what you're talking about in regards to the Wii U.  

Also, your original comment does deny the "jump" by saying it is "offset."  That is by definition trying to argue that the jump doesn't matter (while in context with this thread) as standalone.  What happened the previous generation should have no bearing on the difference from Wii to Wii U.  

You're still not getting it.  The video wasn't about saying "Wii U is so powerful."  It's making a rather pointless argument that the Wii to Wii U jump is actually substantial.  If you paid any attention to the video or had anything worth saying, you would know this already.  

Your second comment was also pointless because it's completely off topic.  It has nothing to do with the video or what I was saying.  It's like you're trying to change the argument so you can win, but we aren't even arguing about that.  I am simply stating the truth about what you said with your original comment pretty much trying to put the Wii U down by being off topic.  

Do us all a favor and actually pay attention next time so you will actually see that the video wasn't about Wii U winning this generation, but rather that Nintendo made the biggest improvement within their own line of hardware for this generation.  Like I have said so many times already, I'm not saying it's a good argument.  Your comment just simply isn't talking about the same thing.



But they made the smallest leap between the GC and the Wii. Meaning they had a lot of room for improvement this gen.



I am the Playstation Avenger.

   

They also use the least amount of energy



Bet reminder: I bet with Tboned51 that Splatoon won't reach the 1 million shipped mark by the end of 2015. I win if he loses and I lose if I lost.

Conina said:
Why are they showing footage of Resident Evil Revelation when talking about a graphical leap?

That game has sub-par graphics on every platform it was realesed except the 3DS. It looks like a HD-remastered 6th generation game... PS3, 360 and WiiU can all deliver a much better performance, even with multiplatform titles.


well for all intents purpsose it kinda is, we are talking about an up rezzed 3ds game.



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MDMAlliance said:
SubiyaCryolite said:
MDMAlliance said:
SubiyaCryolite said:

I dont consider it to be a leap when they where and still are failry behind to begin with. What does this large leap even mean to game developers or consumers who are already exposed to the PS4 and X1?

That point doesn't even matter, look at your original comment.  It is one that tries to deny the jump from Wii to Wii U by saying that it's offset by the GC to Wii jump.  There was no point in saying that, especially given that it was already mentioned in the video.  Whether the guy in the video has a real point or not is irrelevant given how you made your response.

I dont buy the small gap argument either, it will show and when it does it'll blow peoples minds. Heck it already is. People said the the same thing about the PS2 and PS3. Hell, I said that. And yet today the difference between a PS2 and a PS3 game is beyond night and day.The Wii was barely pushed above the Gamecube even with Nintendos own titles. But when you compare launch PS3 and 360 games to what they do now, and then look at the sheer raw power inside both the PS4 and X1 things wont look good at all.

I don't even get what your point here is.  This is about Wii to Wii U, not Gamecube to Wii.  It's like you entirely missed the point.

NFS Rivals on PS4 is already leagues above NFS MW on U. If you look at NFS Carbon (a launch PS3 game) and Rivals on the PS3 and apply that to scale the PS4 then its going to be nothing short of a visual massacre.

That is 100% irrelevant given that the thread isn't comparing Wii U to PS4 graphics.  You're just ranting to make it seem like you have a point.  You don't.  No one is arguing Wii U vs PS4 graphics.  No one.

If Nintendo hopes to release a gen 9 system on par with the PS5 and XBoxTwo for example it will basically have to make TWO jumps in one go.

 

  • 1st jump, match the PS4/X1.
  • 2nd jump close to the PS5/X2 as possible.

 

That wont do them any favours, given how they are struggling with the U. They basically shot themselves in the foot, twice. 

That doesn't even make any sense.  How does making two jumps equate to not doing them any favors?  You're making a logical jump, and coming to a conclusion without even elaborating on your thought process.  Making two jumps when you're a "jump" behind doesn't take twice as much effort FYI.

 I dont put the U down, I own one for petes sake. That said I dont defend it either, not in the slightest. Truth is the Wii U has tons of things about it worth criticising. Just like the launch PS3 I call a spade a spade, not a big spoon. This system has serious issues.

No, I have seen the repeated amount of comments you make on threads.  I don't know if you even actually own one.  If you do, it doesn't mean you're exempt from being "anti-Wii U."  I don't normally respond to your comments because I usually let you have your opinions. But this time, it was just trying to take a cheap-shot at the Wii U by trying to state that the jump between Wii and Wii U is somehow taken away by the jump between GC and Wii.  Like I have said multiple times before, it is irrelevant to the topic here.  There was no reason to say it unless you wanted to keep beating a dead horse.

I dont approve of its hardware at all. Nintendo had the money and resources to make something truly decent. 2GHz quad core. 2GB GDDR5 unified memory shared with a 5670HD equivalent GPU. But nope. They set the bar low, far too low. I feel Nintendo has backed itself into a corner. I dont see gen 8 being salvaged and gen 9 will be a deciding moment in regards Nintendos future in the home console business.

Just so you know, putting better hardware into the Wii U does NOT guarantee it to do better.  The Gamecube did this, and failed.  People are comparing the Wii U to the Gamecube, but people like you need to be reminded that Nintendo did what you're thinking Nintendo should do now with the Gamecube.  The market isn't so predictable, and it is only in hindsight that you can claim it is so obvious.  

There are multiple "problems" with the Wii U, but if you look through the history of videogame console sales, you will realize that some of those "mistakes" you think is making the Wii U fail now were also present in previous consoles as well.  The issue here is much less about Wii U's hardware, and much more about Wii U's marketing and possibly software and online integration.  



Theres your proof. Every single 3rd party in that game up there runs better on the 360. Every single firts party game there is not leaps and bounds above the 3rd party games. Owning a Wii U doesnt make me blind to the fact that it has outdated technology. My original comment doesnt deny the Wii to Wii U jump, it STATES the obvious fact that the jump is insignificant when its base was so low to begin with.  My second comment was to point out how pointless it is to act like Nintendos jump is some achievement that should be lauded because it isnt, they are and will be playing cath up for the forseeable future. 


1 Honestly that isn't "proof" as it's simply a picture of Wii U games.  However, I do not care whether or not you have a Wii U.  It seems like you still don't understand what I'm saying.  I am saying that just because you have a Wii U doesn't mean you are suddenly 2. unbiased and 3. know what you're talking about in regards to the Wii U.  

1. Indeed, just a pic on MY domain with games matching MY collection.

2. I guess unbaised means not criticising a console I own, noted.

3. Owning one gives me a clue to what Im talking about thank you very much.


Also, your original comment does deny the "jump" by saying it is 1 "offset."  That is by definition trying to argue that the 2 jump doesn't matter (while in context with this thread) as standalone.  3. What happened the previous generation should have no bearing on the difference from Wii to Wii U.  

1. Where I come from, offset doesnt mean deny.

2. The jump happened but its effect on consumers and the industry is minimal because the rest of it made the jump in 2005. The Wii U wont do anything that hasnt been done already in the console space.

 3. Convenient new rule youve made up, which doesnt really make any sense. Of cousre it serves you to leave that out so that the Wii Us so called "leap" cant be put into context.

You're still not getting it.  The video wasn't about saying "Wii U is so powerful."  It's making a rather pointless argument that the Wii to Wii U jump is actually 1. substantial.  If you paid any attention to the video or 2. had anything worth saying, you would know this already.  

1. Again, how is matching 2005 era technology in 2013 substantial? If Nintendo operated in a vacuum maybe.

2. My point that leap is offeset by the Wiis low base is perfectly valid. Its a big jump but thats 8 years overdue. I dont see whats wrong with what I said, consideringat leat 3 other people here have said the exact same thing.

1. Your second comment was also pointless because it's completely off topic.  It has nothing to do with the video or what 2. I was saying.  It's like you're trying to change the argument so you can win,  but we aren't even arguing about that. 3. I am simply stating the truth about what you said with your original comment pretty much trying to put the Wii U down by being off topic.  

1. I was trying to explain how to the consumer and the industry, the Wii U s jump will largely go unnoticed because of the PS4 and X1 own technological advances. Of course choose to ignore that. And the 3 other people who have said the exact same thing I did in this thread, who you also choose to ignore. I dont why Ive upset you so much

2. It was explaining my offset stance further

3. Again, I was not off-topic, its just something you dont want to hear clearly.

Do us all a favor and actually pay attention next time so you will actually see that the video wasn't about Wii U winning this generation, but rather that Nintendo made the biggest improvement within their 1. own line of hardware for this generation.  Like I have said so many times already, I'm not saying it's a good argument.  Your comment just simply isn't talking about the same thing.

1. Again, even within the Nintendo vacuum that holds no water as its offset the low base of the Wii. I dont know why this basic logical fact is so hard for you to understand.

If I tried to sell the Wii U to my friends or a customer by saying "Its made the biggest leap of the three" I would be flat out lying because that isnt true when put in context. I guess thats another "cheap shot" in your eyes, whatever. 

At least 3 other people have said the exact same thing Ive said in this very thread and I dont see you targetting them for being "off topic". If I am offtopic then Id like a mod to tell me so.



I predict that the Wii U will sell a total of 18 million units in its lifetime. 

The NX will be a 900p machine

SubiyaCryolite said:
MDMAlliance said:

1 Honestly that isn't "proof" as it's simply a picture of Wii U games.  However, I do not care whether or not you have a Wii U.  It seems like you still don't understand what I'm saying.  I am saying that just because you have a Wii U doesn't mean you are suddenly 2. unbiased and 3. know what you're talking about in regards to the Wii U.  

1. Indeed, just a pic on MY domain with games matching MY collection.

I was simply saying that showing a picture of a collection of Wii U games does not constitute as proof.  Anyone can take a collection from online and reupload it.  I wasn't trying to say I don't believe you, I was just countering the fact that it's not proof.  I was only leaving that option on the table, but you clearly didn't see that and want to seem victimized.

2. I guess unbaised means not criticising a console I own, noted.

You're doing it again.  I am saying that claiming you have a Wii U doesn't make you unbiased against the Wii U.  It's just like seeing a person say "PS Vita sucks because the games suck" and they say they have a PS Vita, therefore they aren't biased against it.  It doesn't work like that.  That was all I was saying with that statement.  Either you're trolling or you simply aren't as smart as you think you are.

3. Owning one gives me a clue to what Im talking about thank you very much.

Not really.  Owning something doesn't automatically mean you know everything about that product.  All it gives you is credibility to its experience.  That's all. 


Also, your original comment does deny the "jump" by saying it is 1 "offset."  That is by definition trying to argue that the 2 jump doesn't matter (while in context with this thread) as standalone.  3. What happened the previous generation should have no bearing on the difference from Wii to Wii U.  

1. Where I come from, offset doesnt mean deny.

I didn't say they meant the same thing.  In the context of the sentence, it is what it's implicitly doing.

2. The jump happened but its effect on consumers and the industry is minimal because the rest of it made the jump in 2005. The Wii U wont do anything that hasnt been done already in the console space.

Again, you are off topic.  The thread is NOT about sales or consumers.  It is about Wii vs Wii U compared to PS3/360 vs PS4/XBO.  I have been telling you that over and over again, but you never seem to get the message.

 3. Convenient new rule youve made up, which doesnt really make any sense. Of cousre it serves you to leave that out so that the Wii Us so called "leap" cant be put into context.

I didn't come up with this "new rule."  I have been talking about it this entire time.  Rewatch the video.  This thread is about the video.  The video is, for some reason, thinking that the Wii vs Wii U leap is significant.  I already told you myself that I don't think there's much point to the video.  However, you keep going off topic and talking about something else entirely.  It doesn't even make sense to bring it up, given what he said in the video.  For the 100th time, watch the video.  Pay attention.  Maybe you still have some hope of understanding what it means.  

You're still not getting it.  The video wasn't about saying "Wii U is so powerful."  It's making a rather pointless argument that the Wii to Wii U jump is actually 1. substantial.  If you paid any attention to the video or 2. had anything worth saying, you would know this already.  

1. Again, how is matching 2005 era technology in 2013 substantial? If Nintendo operated in a vacuum maybe.

Wii vs Wii U jump has nothing to do with the "era" of technology.  The video was in CONTEXT of that vacuum you're referring to.  I am not making that argument, you keep trying to make it seem like I am.  You are off topic when you make those comments because the video isn't ABOUT what you're talking about.  REWATCH THE VIDEO.  PAY ATTENTION TO WHAT'S BEING SAID.  MAYBE YOU'LL FIGURE IT OUT.  That is why your comment in this thread is a problem.  

2. My point that leap is offeset by the Wiis low base is perfectly valid. Its a big jump but thats 8 years overdue. I dont see whats wrong with what I said, consideringat leat 3 other people here have said the exact same thing.

Your point is only valid if it actually made sense in context of the video.  It would make more sense outside of this thread.  HOWEVER, it's not.  You decided to make that comment HERE.  To try and contribute with that comment HERE.  THAT is the problem.  While I did see other people saying something similar, it seemed much more like some kind of repetition of something said earlier in the video. You, on the other hand, talked about it as if in response to the video itself.  It would make no sense to say something like that in response to the video.  Watch it again and you'll see what I mean (as long as you understand what point he's trying to get at).

1. Your second comment was also pointless because it's completely off topic.  It has nothing to do with the video or what 2. I was saying.  It's like you're trying to change the argument so you can win,  but we aren't even arguing about that. 3. I am simply stating the truth about what you said with your original comment pretty much trying to put the Wii U down by being off topic.  

1. I was trying to explain how to the consumer and the industry, the Wii U s jump will largely go unnoticed because of the PS4 and X1 own technological advances. Of course choose to ignore that. And the 3 other people who have said the exact same thing I did in this thread, who you also choose to ignore. I dont why Ive upset you so much

It's off topic, regardless of what you want to say.  Also, I personally did NOT see anyone else saying what you did.  I see some people thinking that the jump between PS360 and PS4/XBO is larger than Wii and Wii U, but not what YOU are saying.  Because making that comment IS on topic, yours wasn't.  Do you get it yet?

2. It was explaining my offset stance further

Watch the video again.  It's off topic.  Do you not understand why?  

3. Again, I was not off-topic, its just something you dont want to hear clearly.

No, I perfectly understand what you're trying to say with PS4 and XBox One. It just is irrelevant to the thread.  Wii U graphics are obviously much lower than the PS4 and XBox One, and that the Wii U's advancement over its previous generation is obviously going to get overshadowed in the market in comparison to the PS4 and XBox One.  Of course those aren't the only deciding factors, but that isn't even what this thread is about.  It's off topic, and that's what's wrong.

Do us all a favor and actually pay attention next time so you will actually see that the video wasn't about Wii U winning this generation, but rather that Nintendo made the biggest improvement within their 1. own line of hardware for this generation.  Like I have said so many times already, I'm not saying it's a good argument.  Your comment just simply isn't talking about the same thing.

1. Again, even within the Nintendo vacuum that holds no water as its offset the low base of the Wii. I dont know why this basic logical fact is so hard for you to understand.

The one who is failing at basic logic is you.  You need to understand that there's a certain topic of this thread, and you're going off on a tangent and running with it.  The guy in the video isn't talking about its effect on the market.  The video is comparing the leaps themselves.  That is all.  It is that basic.  It's NOT going into things like "and because of this leap, Wii U will be better than PS4/XBO."  In fact, if you watch the video again, he says over and over how that's not what he's saying.  His point is weak and I don't know why he's making it, but you aren't even talking about the same thing he is.  

If I tried to sell the Wii U to my friends or a customer by saying "Its made the biggest leap of the three" I would be flat out lying because that isnt true when put in context. I guess thats another "cheap shot" in your eyes, whatever. 

At least 3 other people have said the exact same thing Ive said in this very thread and I dont see you targetting them for being "off topic". If I am offtopic then Id like a mod to tell me so.

Also, mods don't enforce the off topic rule as hard as most of the other ones.  Especially when an off topic comment may SEEM like it is on topic.  

~Mod Edit~

This post has been moderated.

-Smeags



Well, this thread went nowhere fast.



Nintendo Network ID: Cheebee   3DS Code: 2320 - 6113 - 9046

 

adriane23 said:

But they made the smallest leap between the GC and the Wii. Meaning they had a lot of room for improvement this gen.


Yes, it was easier for them to make a larger leap.  I think the video is more directed towards people who think that the difference between the Wii and Wii U isn't that big.  Although I kind of don't see the point of the video either way.  It's a weak argument given that not many people are thinking the Wii and Wii U power difference is small.



curl-6 said:
 

Wii U's GPU is not well documented; it has no been identified as any single pre-existing GPU.

There hasn't been improvement in third party efforts because less and less resources and effort are being invested in them due to low sales, which were partly caused by the shittiness of early ports. Besides a few like Frozenbyte and Criterion, nobody has really even tried to push the system. They just haven't bothered. You can't forcefeed a system code written for different architecture and expect it to perform well.

As for Wii/Xbox, RAM speed was also against the Xbox; CPU cycles would be lost waiting for its slower RAM to respond, and when a mistake was made, its longer pipeline meant more processing time was wasted. Xbox may look beefier on paper, but in practice it lost out due to inefficiency compared to the Wii.

It won't be identified as any pre-existing gpu exactly either as it integrates a wii gpu within it. It is likely A Radeon HD 6400 mobility gpu or similar. The point is its a Radeon architecture gpu of humble origins which Nintendo won't release details of but developers will have the documentation on.  Also adds a high speed mpeg compression engine.

The second paragraph is your belief that the wii u is getting lazy ports. This was the same excuse given to wii games. It is the standard Nintendo fanboy defence but its much more likely based on overwhelming evidence that the wii u is performing as expected based on its hardware design which has many huge weaknesses.

Again you have made a defence of the wii cpu based on your belief that somehow the xbox is inefficient. The xbox has cache memory all over the place including the cpu and gpu, it has a high 6.4GB/s memory bandwidth continous 64MB of memory, a full sound processor again with its own cache.  The wii has a 2MB frame buffer, 1MB texture cache, 24MB main memory and 64MB DDR buffer area but no hard drive. 

You really just need to look at the maximum performance level of both consoles.

Just look at Conker on original xbox. Not the artistic style but the rich textures, lighting effects, graphic effects, animation etc. Mario Galaxy while attractive has very similar textures, little depth effect. It sort of resembles a high res Mario 64 in look but Conker has some enhanced effects well beyond wii including defocusing and other stuff. Not only does Conker have more impressive graphics but you get full 5.1 sound.

http://www.youtubedoubler.com/?video1=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.youtube.com%2Fwatch%3Fv%3DMov1AlNKCWk&start1=1580&video2=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.youtube.com%2Fwatch%3Fhttps%3A%2F%2Fwww.youtube.com%2Fwatch%3Fv%3DYat9LvFtixsv%3DK05xxeCdhSo&start2=160&authorName=

 

Moderated - Kresnik.