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Forums - Gaming - John Carmack: 360 and PS3 were 'far from tapped out'

ghettoglamour on 12 December 2013
curl-6 said:
ghettoglamour said:
If you look at Rage, yes, he's right.

But not if you look at Beyond Two Souls, God of War Ascension, or Halo 4. ;)


That was my point



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Pemalite on 12 December 2013
curl-6 said:
ghettoglamour said:
If you look at Rage, yes, he's right.

But not if you look at Beyond Two Souls, God of War Ascension, or Halo 4. ;)


To be fair, I doubt any of them run at 60fps.
Rage could look *much* better if they cut the framerate in half.




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curl-6 on 12 December 2013
Pemalite said:
curl-6 said:
ghettoglamour said:
If you look at Rage, yes, he's right.

But not if you look at Beyond Two Souls, God of War Ascension, or Halo 4. ;)


To be fair, I doubt any of them run at 60fps.
Rage could look *much* better if they cut the framerate in half.

And if it was tailored to a specific console's strengths, like the afore-mentioned games.



walsufnir on 12 December 2013
ClassicGamingWizzz said:
walsufnir said:
ClassicGamingWizzz said:
i think this guy have mental problems


Yes, sure, a coding-genius and prodigy whose mental capabilities exceed yours by far has mental problems because you disagree with his opinion. Read his twitter account and try to even remotely understand what he talks about.


a  genius can have mental problems , if you want games with 20 fps most of the time, textures that pop after 4 seconds , etc be my guest and stay with ps3/360 forever, if even naughty dog cant make a game with 30 fps locked all time( last of us )  what have this gen more to give in terms of power?

all devs wanted new consoles but here comes mister coding genius saying that so much juice in this gen


You don't get what he says: "The 360 and PS3 are far from tapped out in terms of what a developer could do with them, but the whole world's gonna move over towards next-gen and high-end PCs and all these other things."

He is not explicitely talking about performance or way better graphics, he talks about possibilities for developers which is *not* necessarily "beating naughty dog/343i".



Mr Puggsly on 12 December 2013
ClassicGamingWizzz said:


a  genius can have mental problems , if you want games with 20 fps most of the time, textures that pop after 4 seconds , etc be my guest and stay with ps3/360 forever, if even naughty dog cant make a game with 30 fps locked all time( last of us )  what have this gen more to give in terms of power?

all devs wanted new consoles but here comes mister coding genius saying that so much juice in this gen


I approve of this message.

Developers could do new things and squeeze more out of any console. I bet PS1 games could look more amazing than we ever imagined if developers still focused on that hardware.

We could settle with small visual improvments year over year. But I'm looking forward to seeing developers push the limits of more modern hardware.



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walsufnir on 13 December 2013
ClassicGamingWizzz said:
walsufnir said:
ClassicGamingWizzz said:
walsufnir said:
ClassicGamingWizzz said:
i think this guy have mental problems


Yes, sure, a coding-genius and prodigy whose mental capabilities exceed yours by far has mental problems because you disagree with his opinion. Read his twitter account and try to even remotely understand what he talks about.


a  genius can have mental problems , if you want games with 20 fps most of the time, textures that pop after 4 seconds , etc be my guest and stay with ps3/360 forever, if even naughty dog cant make a game with 30 fps locked all time( last of us )  what have this gen more to give in terms of power?

all devs wanted new consoles but here comes mister coding genius saying that so much juice in this gen


You don't get what he says: "The 360 and PS3 are far from tapped out in terms of what a developer could do with them, but the whole world's gonna move over towards next-gen and high-end PCs and all these other things."

He is not explicitely talking about performance or way better graphics, he talks about possibilities for developers which is *not* necessarily "beating naughty dog/343i".

then tell me what are those possibilities for devs ? if its not performance what is there in ps3 or 360 left ? he is talking about fully understanding the machines , to me time passed and he and idSoft did nothing in this gen and he is buthurt about it, they released a game, full of problems on pc and not the best performance on ps3 , then he blamed the ps3 and sony for the problems and now he wants this gen to last longer.

 

http://www.gamersmint.com/ps3-has-tight-memory-poor-io-performance-john-carmack


New engine ideas, new rendering techniques, things you and me perhaps don't think of. I see what you are trying to say but I think you totally misunderstood him. But if you would really care then you should ask him via twitter.

And I see no reason to sh** on him or id software just because Rage didn't turn out to be what it used to be. Especially you don't seem to like him because he said something negative about PS3 which is laughable, really.

 

Edit: A nice blogpost from a rendering technique guy: http://c0de517e.blogspot.de/2013/12/shit-people-say-graphics-have-peaked.html



d21lewis on 13 December 2013

Gaming consoles are like tubes of toothpaste. You can always squeeze just a little bit more out of them....but eventually, it's just better to buy a new tube.



20happyballs on 13 December 2013
walsufnir said:
20happyballs said:
walsufnir said:
20happyballs said:
walsufnir said:
20happyballs said:
John Carmack is "tapped out". Honestly, he talks so big but doesn't deliver anymore. IMO this guy is now irrelevant.


He is what? Please go and get to know about what he is currently working on before you post crap like this.


Yes the oculus rift looks pretty awesome but he's not the creator. Seriously, within the last 10 years he hasnt contributed anything special. He's been surpassed by many in graphics engineering.


Then tell me one person who actually has contributed something special? Carmack is an awesome coder in general, 3d especially. There is no way to deny that. Perhaps he made wrong decisions with Rage but still code is always mostly his own and especially good made (I read about a code analysis about Quake(?) where the author explicitely says how nice and well organized the whole code is).

Any dev-team out there would be happy to have a genius like him as a partner.


See, the thing is that I can't really tell you anyone who has contributed more in recent years. That's not to say that there aren't people. Its just that it really takes a lot to get recognized. Obviously there are genious people working at places such as Crytek, Naughty Dog, Santa Monica, etc... The games they make look amazing and that's because they have really talented people in those studios. People who I dare say are more advanced in 3D coding. John Carmack, although smart, is not at the forefront of graphics technology anymore. Other people are more worthy of the attention.


Well, I think you don't have the right to judge this because 1) you would have to know the techniques used in engines *and* you would have to be able to understand them and 2) ID releases games not *that* often. Rage is now an "old" game, we don't know how a new id-tech-engine would've been.


i don't need to understand graphics to be able to tell what looks good and what doesn't. i have eyes and a perfectly competent brain. I think that gives me the right to judge. When Rage came out, it wasn't even impressive. I had it for my gaming pc and not only was it less than stellar visually, but it was riddled with performance issues and other technical problems. I believe that Uncharted 2 and even GOW3 were out before that game. Its widely accepted that those games look better.





Licence on 13 December 2013
Pemalite said:
curl-6 said:
ghettoglamour said:
If you look at Rage, yes, he's right.

But not if you look at Beyond Two Souls, God of War Ascension, or Halo 4. ;)


To be fair, I doubt any of them run at 60fps.
Rage could look *much* better if they cut the framerate in half.

I believe Carmack said that Doom 4 would look much better than Rage, because it would target 30fps. Allthough I'm not exactly sure what's the latest with that.



20happyballs on 13 December 2013
d21lewis said:
Gaming consoles are like tubes of toothpaste. You can always squeeze just a little bit more out of them....but eventually, it's just better to buy a new tube.


Hah. Thats an excellent analogy. 

Seriously, why would you complain about having more power? I mean, if it was from a financial point of view it would make sense, but thats not why he  wanted the generation to last longer.