Anyone who thinks that there has been anything resembeling 'free market' in health care has been drinking too much koch.

If there were more competition from reducing regulatory burdens, people actually investigating their insurance companies reputation and reading their insurance contracts and asking questions their would be considerably better healthcare. 

And Mexico's health care system is even close to that of the United states and is an absurd comparison without anu basis at all.

glad i live in Canada. Many countries around the world have medicare yet the richest country in the world don't have the will to make it happen for all it's citizens?

That's not exactly true though.

Japan's culture is MUCH more debt resistant, because the japanese are ardent investors and savesrs in conservative porfolios.

Japan has the second largest debt market in the world despite it's economy not being anywhere near second, because of domestic demand that is unmatched elsewhere in the world, due to the aforementioend investors, and the corrupt government/corproations willing to prop up pension funds with bad bet government bonds.

Eh, not really.  Most hosptials actually lose money on treatment, and a lot lose money.

The only hosptials that really make bank are research hopsitals or other "top of the line" ones that get all the rich people money.

The issue with the free market is the same issue with communism: it doesn't work. Both assume perfect and utopian scenarios, such as people will not be greedy, people would be educated about they are acutally getting into and would be apart of it, and a small group of people do not control a large chunk of  the wealth in society. The reality is a free market would solve nothing, current insurance companies would just become stronger and because they control a monopoly not only would there be no chance for any new competiion but they would just have more power to do whatever they want.

That's actually not nessisairly a fact.  The traditional measures people tend to trott out about healthcare don't really tend to measure healthcare.

The US actuall has far better indicators when you clear up confounding variables of many kinds.

An example that even the most stringent liberal should be able to get behind for example is income inequality.  Poor people don't live as long.  Even in countries with universal healthcare.

Another one that oeople like to use life expectancy forget is the fact that the US has a SHIT ton of more violent crime... which leads to this fun statistical chart.

Then you've got the higher level of US teen pregancies compaired to most other countries, which feeds a higher rate of premature births which leads to again, a downward force on life expectancy.

and that's not even getting to Obesity, and tons of other factors.

Honestly, when it comes to life expetancy, healthcare means surprisingly little... or at the very least, the bottom of the line stuff that people will be signing up for thanks to Obamacare won't.

For example...

http://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMsa1212321

Well, i'll put i this way.   My heatlchare cost $90 a month.  If I want to keep it for next year, I have to pay $300 a month.

It offers no new benefits outside preventative care... and I already had that covered for free assuming I don't have to go to the doctor more then 3 times a year/just got it done when i did go.

Obama dropped the ball and is now going to make the public fear any healthcare bill. Honestly I believe he will go down as the worst president because of all the failures and pushed political agendas that are backfiring.

We need to drop stuff like fighting drugs and put that money towards a decent healthcare system. Have some government hospitals and also business hospitals. Free market is important with the balance of the government.

I'm a libertarian in some sense but I agree with somethings from all parties.

I find it weird how little some people know about the whole situation. Does anyone here REALLY know why we have insurance at all? I feel like almost no one does.

I predict that if Obamacare fails, there is no way Obama will seek a third term in office.