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Forums - Microsoft - Digital Foundry vs. the Xbox One architects... or the end of the secret sauce craziness

Ashadian said:

endimion said:
damn people you really need to read or at least try to understand. PS4 IS MORE POWERFUL, we all know that and most of us never really question that part. the question is can an inferior spec sheet "on paper" can be as good as the other one more powerful, with better design and custom tweaks in real life. the answer is yes!!! Now, don't get me wrong, the PS4 will still probably end up having a slight advantage in the end but this will be way less noticeable than what the specs on paper make it out to be. I have always said a 50% more power on raw spec almost never translates into 50% better performance.

now that said you have to take into consideration what you want from your box, specs and design are far from the full story.
-What game do you want to play
-what pad you prefer (I know my hands are physically allergic to the DS format, so just that is a big point in my decision),
-do you have a use for an IR blaster (many device and many remotes you wish you could do without during gaming or even for your family that is not especially tech friendly),
- do you have a use for Kinect (do you like to have fun beside seating down, or in groups of friends, do you like fitness, dance games or out of the usual pad games, are you scared or not by it, do you have high enough self-esteem to not feel silly when talking to it and see how it can help you navigate way more naturally and faster than using the old pad ways)
-are you interested by the AV pass through (because you like to be able to switch, fast and seamlessly between TV and gaming when there is a commercial break or during wait time in MP game lobbies)
-are you interested by multi tasking capabilities or do just one thing with a console and game
-are you interested by the online current capabilities and especially the future of it that will ever get greater with time
-and finally do you like the idea that in the future your game/apps might be cross compatible across all there OSs to some extend or in some way....

all that should make you decide what platform is more suited for your needs than just raw spec which at the end will barely add anything to what you actually do and need with a console....
well at least it's my take on it

Except you posted a one sided arguement!

PS4 has voice/facial recognition. Gesture control etc etc.

Problem with AV pass through is you gotta leave both devices on which IMO is stupid and a waste of electricity. So in reality you still gotta have a Sky box to watch Sky on your X180 which completely defeats the purpose of having one box.

I'm sure the PS4 can do multi tasking too.Or did you miss that bit out on purpose?

Do you have remote play on X180?

 

 




yeah I posted a one sided argument, we are on the MS forum, not the main one,  or the sony forum

PS4 doesn't have facial recognition or voice control out of the box and certainly can't be compared to kinect tracking... comparing the two is like comparing a SD movie and an HD one on picture quality yeah you have the same movie but come on...

My box is alays on almost so it won't change much. the point is to be able to switch fast and seemlesly between two devices without changing remotes, pad, source on the TV etc... pure convenience, ease of use and fast switch nothing more.... and you can still use the app snap while watching TV which is the brownie point part... so might be stupid it is more convenient and enjoyable for me than the current sate of things

Multi tasking on PS4??? well first they should get a 21st century looking OS before even trying to do multitasking...and if they do we haven't seen anything about it so far... at least nothing close to multitasking like we saw on XB1

but hey like I said the PS4 is more powerful than the XB1 and will probably get better looking game in the end.... you can't have all the good things on one side of the game court right...???? PS4 will be the  grahic beast, XB1 will be the multi purpose entertainement box... I think it is pretty clear by now... and people will have to chose between better graphics or better entertainement and when I say better I mean more accessible, easy to use, well put together etc.... not the content itself...



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endimion said:
Ashadian said:

endimion said:
damn people you really need to read or at least try to understand. PS4 IS MORE POWERFUL, we all know that and most of us never really question that part. the question is can an inferior spec sheet "on paper" can be as good as the other one more powerful, with better design and custom tweaks in real life. the answer is yes!!! Now, don't get me wrong, the PS4 will still probably end up having a slight advantage in the end but this will be way less noticeable than what the specs on paper make it out to be. I have always said a 50% more power on raw spec almost never translates into 50% better performance.

now that said you have to take into consideration what you want from your box, specs and design are far from the full story.
-What game do you want to play
-what pad you prefer (I know my hands are physically allergic to the DS format, so just that is a big point in my decision),
-do you have a use for an IR blaster (many device and many remotes you wish you could do without during gaming or even for your family that is not especially tech friendly),
- do you have a use for Kinect (do you like to have fun beside seating down, or in groups of friends, do you like fitness, dance games or out of the usual pad games, are you scared or not by it, do you have high enough self-esteem to not feel silly when talking to it and see how it can help you navigate way more naturally and faster than using the old pad ways)
-are you interested by the AV pass through (because you like to be able to switch, fast and seamlessly between TV and gaming when there is a commercial break or during wait time in MP game lobbies)
-are you interested by multi tasking capabilities or do just one thing with a console and game
-are you interested by the online current capabilities and especially the future of it that will ever get greater with time
-and finally do you like the idea that in the future your game/apps might be cross compatible across all there OSs to some extend or in some way....

all that should make you decide what platform is more suited for your needs than just raw spec which at the end will barely add anything to what you actually do and need with a console....
well at least it's my take on it

Except you posted a one sided arguement!

PS4 has voice/facial recognition. Gesture control etc etc.

Problem with AV pass through is you gotta leave both devices on which IMO is stupid and a waste of electricity. So in reality you still gotta have a Sky box to watch Sky on your X180 which completely defeats the purpose of having one box.

I'm sure the PS4 can do multi tasking too.Or did you miss that bit out on purpose?

Do you have remote play on X180?

 

 




yeah I posted a one sided argument, we are on the MS forum, not the main one,  or the sony forum

PS4 doesn't have facial recognition or voice control out of the box and certainly can't be compared to kinect tracking... comparing the two is like comparing a SD movie and an HD one on picture quality yeah you have the same movie but come on...

My box is alays on almost so it won't change much. the point is to be able to switch fast and seemlesly between two devices without changing remotes, pad, source on the TV etc... pure convenience, ease of use and fast switch nothing more.... and you can still use the app snap while watching TV which is the brownie point part... so might be stupid it is more convenient and enjoyable for me than the current sate of things

Multi tasking on PS4??? well first they should get a 21st century looking OS before even trying to do multitasking...and if they do we haven't seen anything about it so far... at least nothing close to multitasking like we saw on XB1

but hey like I said the PS4 is more powerful than the XB1 and will probably get better looking game in the end.... you can't have all the good things on one side of the game court right...???? PS4 will be the  grahic beast, XB1 will be the multi purpose entertainement box... I think it is pretty clear by now... and people will have to chose between better graphics or better entertainement and when I say better I mean more accessible, easy to use, well put together etc.... not the content itself...


I don't see how the OS of one looks more "21st Century" than the other. That's the kind of clouded speech that these conversations certainly don't need.
They both look modern in my book. And both seem to offer a smooth overall experience. ¬_¬



endimion said:

yeah I posted a one sided argument, we are on the MS forum, not the main one,  or the sony forum

PS4 doesn't have facial recognition or voice control out of the box and certainly can't be compared to kinect tracking... comparing the two is like comparing a SD movie and an HD one on picture quality yeah you have the same movie but come on...

My box is alays on almost so it won't change much. the point is to be able to switch fast and seemlesly between two devices without changing remotes, pad, source on the TV etc... pure convenience, ease of use and fast switch nothing more.... and you can still use the app snap while watching TV which is the brownie point part... so might be stupid it is more convenient and enjoyable for me than the current sate of things

Multi tasking on PS4??? well first they should get a 21st century looking OS before even trying to do multitasking...and if they do we haven't seen anything about it so far... at least nothing close to multitasking like we saw on XB1

but hey like I said the PS4 is more powerful than the XB1 and will probably get better looking game in the end.... you can't have all the good things on one side of the game court right...???? PS4 will be the  grahic beast, XB1 will be the multi purpose entertainement box... I think it is pretty clear by now... and people will have to chose between better graphics or better entertainement and when I say better I mean more accessible, easy to use, well put together etc.... not the content itself...

But games dont need/require facial reconition/voice control... and there have been very few games that have proven this to be actually useful. Many people play games at home in the evening and dont want to be talking to their device. Same with Kinect you say Kinect is like comparing SD to HD... that's not a helpful description really. Kinect is like Laser Disk... might have some benefits but most people don't care/want it.

Multi tasking... again this is a console and multitasking isnt really that useful/benefitial. But again, the PS4 can do it if needed. Have you not seen the Vita multitasking video, that is enough for most people. The multiple OS's might help switch between TV and Games quickly, but you know already it takes me about 1 second to switch between Sky and my game on PS3... it's not an issue. 

Everything you have suggested is not required to make a good gaming console... and the other items are generally already covered by the PS4... which believe it or not is just like the PS3, which is a pretty good entertainment device. 

In terms of entertainment device, the PS4 has most of their stuff outside the paywall, while the XBO is behind a paywall.

So every point has a counter point ;)



Making an indie game : Dead of Day!

@OP: while the explanation correctly tries to scale performance from ideal peak to real life numbers, it still falls into propaganda when it says eDRAM and DDR3 bandwidth can be added together. Yes, in real life, with independent memory controllers and if different units can use the two different memories simultaneously, that sum can happen, but each time the eDRAM must be filled with brand new data, not with the results of operations on data read from itself, it will be bottlenecked by the DDR3 speed.



Stwike him, Centuwion. Stwike him vewy wuffly! (Pontius Pilate, "Life of Brian")
A fart without stink is like a sky without stars.
TGS, Third Grade Shooter: brand new genre invented by Kevin Butler exclusively for Natal WiiToo Kinect. PEW! PEW-PEW-PEW! 
 


Just to added FreeBSD do multitasking as well or better than Windows.

So I didn't get that 21st century OS comment.



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tiffac said:
I really do not see the need for MS (or anyone for that matter) to defend the X1. The last 2 generations showed us that even the least powerful console can win the war. I mean, personal attacks for counter points? My goodness...


I think the difference this gen is that the weaker of the two will be more expensive this time.

That is huge IMO.

Manditory Kinect is a mistake.



 

 

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