Wrong, Offical bundle with camera, extra controller and killzone---$500.

So much for being irrelevant.

Which would continue to be irrelevant to the topic, as it removes the $100 difference. We're talking about the core package. The Microsoft guy is talking about the core package. He isnt talking about a random bundle available at one retailer in France.

Granted, that bundle does have a hell of a lot of value for the cost. More than what you get when you buy your Day One Edition, Ill give you that. Its just not relevant to the topic at hand.

None of what you said makes any sense at all.

Kinect being required or not has nothing at all to do with the topic at hand. Its bundled. Kinect has a 100% attach ratio. If there is a feature in a game that needs Kinect, its there. If there is a feature for an app that needs Kinect, its there. If they change the system so that you need Kinect to turn it on... Its there.

Kinect is bundled and it adds to the value of the Xbox One package. End of.

Did you even read what you quoted?

I bolded it for you and cut out everything else, just to make sure.

Can you tell me how theyre trolling by the way? Id love to hear your reasons.

^ The core experience won't be much different between the two bar the camera tech and cable/sat TV connections. And that extra 100 dollar/euro or 80 pound difference is big factor, no matter how MS wants to cut it. Because for all its intent and purposes people buy consoles for the games, not to watch TV on them or Skype (though the Skype calls is more useful, I'll give it that). At the end of the day, both consoles will function similarly to each other. Sony will "borrow" features from Xbox One and vice versa. Its just that the camera is not mandatory in the core PS4 package.. giving people like us, the consumer more options what to buy or not to buy with the console.

About that Amazon deal. You can basically order it from anywhere in Europe. And I'm pretty sure you'll be able find more bundles (if not that one) in other countries over the next few months leading up to Christmas.

They are relevant...sorry to burst your bubble. MS can talk about core all they want, when Sony can cram a game, Eye camera and a controller the the same price as a core x1, that's vale and significant. You saying it is irrelevant doesn't make it so. It is obvious what package has more value and is more enticing for the consumer.

Kinect being bundled only adds value to those who want kinect, I think is useless and a gimmick so why would it add vale to me? Can't sell it it's a part of the xone.

PS3 bundles arent relevant in a discusion about the PS4 and the Xbox One... And yes, the French Amazon bundle has more value than the core Xbox One American bundle.

It also doesnt matter if you want Kinect. Its in the box. It adds to the value of the overall package. If you dont see the value, thats your problem. The value is there like it or not. This isnt a subjective thing.

I just can't get this.. Everytime people change mind just by their perspective. When they had lower price, they were like our product is affordable, has the same experiences and so on. And now price doesn't matter..
This console war looks like it won't end anytime soon.

They are relevant when the competition can offer a lot more for the same price, sorry that's simpy economics. You are dillusional if you think American and Canadian bundles are not coming, EB games here already told me thay are. The US is not the world, where the bundle is offered is irrelevant.

Who said anything about ps3 bundles? That is a PS4 bundle LMAO.

It also matters if I want kinect or not, as it's the reason I and others are not getting the x1 for awhile if ever. Again, the consumer determines what is VALUE for them, not MS, that again is simple economics.  If the consumer doesn't see added value, they don't period.

They should pay me to use a Kinect.

Ill believe that theyre releasing American bundles when I see them. If they offer better deals, cool. Hip hip hooray.

You said stuff about PS3 bundles being relevant, when you butted into mine and S.T.A.G.E.'s conversation after he brought them up.

The value of something is the monetary worth of it. You not thinking its worth the price doesnt mean the value isnt there. If youre too obtuse to see the value, its your problem. If the general consumer is too obtuse to see the value, again, its their problem. The value of Kinect is clear. Its why you pay a premium for Xbox One. If Kinect wasnt included, you can bet your balls that they would be undercutting Sony.

The value is clear. You need to open your eyes to see it.

If you choose not to pay the premium, fine. No problem. Im choosing not to because the package doesnt interest me.

Now will you tell me how theyre trolling Sony? Im eagerly waiting.

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00EW6QT76/ref=oh_details_o00_s00_i00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

Bundles already available...Do you actually think Sony won't offer bundles?  It was PS4 not ps3, if I accidently typesd ps3 it was a typo.

Again, the consumer decides value not MS. So far the consumer has spoken. It isn't their problem it is Microsoft's.. They need to sell their product to the consumer, and quite frankly many see kinect for what it is, An overpriced gimmick. If the consumer decides it is't worth it and gets the competitions product how is it their problem? MS will be suffering not the consumer.