It turns out that Driveclub will be more a competitor to Forza Horizon which was 30fps. On 360, this gen.

Have you read this? http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=628511

So the determining factor for what makes games compete against eachother is framerate?

Also http://www.computerandvideogames.com/419746/driveclub-dev-debating-over-60fps-target/

Somehow, yes. By cutting the fps at half you get at least twice the computing power which will end up in a game looking way better than another game in 60fps but will result in a game which plays worse. For details on playing worse, ask ethomaz. Your link is exactly proving my point.

What does people trashing unfinished code have to do with anything? What they showed in the Reveal trailer was in game footage. Much like what Forza did. And if you read that thread from gaf you would have understood that. Plus everything is dynamic, from time of day to weather, to sea level changes. Drive club is not only better looking but technology wise it’s more impressive.

First: It *should* look at least better because it's running on *way* better hardware (given by "experts") and it only renders at 30fps. Technology-wise impressive? This would be too much in this post in this thread but believe me, everything that we see today is somehow prekaked. Devs are fooling us intentionally since ever to make things look like they do.

Would you consider the AI of Last of Us to be bad? Still, top-notch AI (which no console is capable of nowadays and they won't this gen) isn't even better than a 4 year old child. Welcome to gaming industry.

So you agree? The last of us has nothing to do with this, but the AI was okay, and better than most games. The only thing i really found odd about the AI was when Ellie would run in front of a clicker stopping on shit and the clicker would ignore her. 

At least twice? How would they get more than twice?

My link says that they don't know what the end result for the framerate will be but they're aiming for 60fps. How does that prove your point that it will be running at 30fps? And why would I ask Ethomaz when nobody's even talking about how the games play? That has literally nothing to do with this thread.

This is a comparison between the visuals of 2 games on hardware that is roughly 10x as powerful as their predecessors. Saying that the visuals of a game coming out this year on brand new hardware should instead be compared to the visuals of a game on hardware from 2005 makes zero sense. IF Driveclub runs at 30fps, Evolution would have about 10 times as much potential for performance as Playground Games had to work with. Whereas they'd only have a little more than twice the potential for performance that Turn 10 has with Forza 5.

I don't agree it looks that better that it should be on hardware which is said to be way more powerful than Xbone and 30fps. It doesn't even look better to me if it would be on the same hardware and 60fps. The "dynamic" things won't make it look better in screenshots.

In fact they do. The lighting in drive club kills the lighting of Forza, There no arguing that, unless you need a new eye glass prescription. Everything in Forza is prebaked and it kills the entire game for me, from the overly wet looking paint, to that damn reflection on the windscreen. Even the paint "Flake" everyone seems to raving about is so fake it hurts. Not to mention that flake would be closer to what’s applied to bass boat or old low riders from the 90's. Then there’s the massive amount of bloom that they use to cover everything up. 60 frames a seconding isn't going to fix how bad Forza actually looks when you get past the "ooo so shiny" mentality the MS guys have over the game.  All this talk about frame rates I guess you never caught the IGN video where it showed Forza having massive pop in and out issues. Mostly found in the rear view mirror. Where tree and building would suddenly disappear and flicker in and out.