RCTjunkie said: Jay520 said: RCTjunkie said: An honest question to those that say life has no purpose: What would you give as a reason for not doing awful crimes such as rape or murder if life ultimately has no purpose? Well, doing those acts would react in a negative reaction from the society. That's good reason for most people. That's why in societies that don't strongly frown upon those actions, rape & murder are more frequent. But almost all societies frown on unnecessary murder (for obvious reasons). So in almost all cases, the consequences of murder are good enough reason for most people. Although the answer to my question is addressed in the video miz1q2w3e posted, what about when society cheered for deaths and don't see murder or rape as moral issues? Is it okay, then?

I responded to your question "What reason do you have to not commit crimes like murder and rape." That had nothing to with morality.

But to answer your question, if such a society existed, it would probably only last a short period of time until it collapsed into chaos. Would such a society be moral? It doesn't matter. Why does morality matter? Ultimately, civilizations father for the best of the society, not the most moral route.

Why must there be a purpose. As soon as people get rid of the notion that there is purpose and meaning behind something that was probably a chain of events that there was no mind behind the sooner people will be free

Jay520 said: RCTjunkie said: Jay520 said: RCTjunkie said: An honest question to those that say life has no purpose: What would you give as a reason for not doing awful crimes such as rape or murder if life ultimately has no purpose? Well, doing those acts would react in a negative reaction from the society. That's good reason for most people. That's why in societies that don't strongly frown upon those actions, rape & murder are more frequent. But almost all societies frown on unnecessary murder (for obvious reasons). So in almost all cases, the consequences of murder are good enough reason for most people. Although the answer to my question is addressed in the video miz1q2w3e posted, what about when society cheered for deaths and don't see murder or rape as moral issues? Is it okay, then? I responded to your question "What reason do you have to not commit crimes like murder and rape." That had nothing to with morality. But to answer your question, if such a society existed, it would probably only last a short period of time until it collapsed into chaos. Would such a society be moral? It doesn't matter. Why does morality matter?

But it all ties together in the sense that if a majority society believes something like human sacrifice is moral and doesn't frown upon it, then what would be the reason for not doing such things without a morality to stop you?

Responding to the answer, it would still be immoral for such a society to do immoral things even if it only lasted a short time. Why did Hitler's short reign matter? Does morality play into that?

  Got to love Siri. Keeping it simple. 

RCTjunkie said: 1. But it all ties together in the sense that if a majority society believes something like human sacrifice is moral and doesn't frown upon it, then what would be the reason for not doing such things without a morality to stop you? 2. Responding to the answer, it would still be immoral for such a society to do immoral things even if it only lasted a short time. Why did Hitler's short reign matter? Does morality play into that?

1. If the majority of society believes human sacrifice is moral, then there would no "reason" to not do those things. I think you give to much credit to humans. Without laws & practical consequences, you would see how terrible human morality really is. Without laws & consequences, people would for the most part do what they want regardless of morality.

That's not the point I was making. My point was if a society practices "immoral" acts such as murder & rape, then eventually it would fix itself since those actions are bad for society. Either the society would die or it would change.

Great posts, Jay.

Jay520 said: RCTjunkie said: 1. But it all ties together in the sense that if a majority society believes something like human sacrifice is moral and doesn't frown upon it, then what would be the reason for not doing such things without a morality to stop you? 2. Responding to the answer, it would still be immoral for such a society to do immoral things even if it only lasted a short time. Why did Hitler's short reign matter? Does morality play into that? 1. If the majority of society believes human sacrifice is moral, then there would no "reason" to not do those things. I think you give to much credit to humans. Without laws & practical consequences, you would see how terrible human morality really is. Without laws & consequences, people would for the most part do what they want regardless of morality. That's not the point I was making. My point was if a society practices "immoral" acts such as murder & rape, then eventually it would fix itself since those actions are bad for society. Either the society would die or it would change.

What's "good" and "bad" for society are not the same definition of morality. The arguement you present is in regard to what's best for the human race, which is different from morality (see: animals eating their young).  There's nothing being proven in regards to these acts being morally wrong. Without a definite morality, there is no absolute moral law that universally says that something is wrong, and thus no objective moral duties.