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Forums - Nintendo Discussion - The Official Legend of Zelda Thread: Echoes of Wisdom Out Now

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Are you planning to buy Echoes of Wisdom?

I already pre-ordered 5 38.46%
 
Picking it up soon 4 30.77%
 
Waiting for a sale 2 15.38%
 
No, it's not for me 2 15.38%
 
Total:13
Jumpin said:

In the next Zelda, I am kind of against this forum:

1. More dungeons - NO - I want lower emphasis on dungeons, they are usually my least favourite part of Zelda games.

2. Building More things - YES - I LOVE the idea of more building and town stuff. Quests and progress about building up cities, like Terranigma or Dragon Quest 9

3. Online functionality - Don't Care - meh, I could take it or leave it. It would only be interesting if there was a reason

4. Ability to repair broken weapons - NO - if it means rebalancing the game so there are fewer weapons to acquire, then a big NO.

5. Less rain/ability to climb in rain - Sure, but not important - sure, maybe some kind of item.

6. New game + or post-game content - NO -  It would be kind of annoying to have stuff locked out of an open world game until after you finish it, so NO.

7. New mounts (e.g., loftwing) - YES - New content is always welcome.

8. Greater emphasis on narrative - NO - I am not sure what this one really means? You mean, make it more linear storytelling? If that is the case, then NO, that is the opposite of what I want to see in Zelda.

AMEN!

 

Except on #5: I could climb almost everywhere, and the rain was never the problem, sure the rain could make the climbing tedious in certain cases. But to do something about climbing in the rain is to fix something that isn't borken.

So don't touch the rain climbing thing.



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Jumpin said:

In the next Zelda, I am kind of against this forum:

1. More dungeons - NO - I want lower emphasis on dungeons, they are usually my least favourite part of Zelda games.

2. Building More things - YES - I LOVE the idea of more building and town stuff. Quests and progress about building up cities, like Terranigma or Dragon Quest 9

3. Online functionality - Don't Care - meh, I could take it or leave it. It would only be interesting if there was a reason

4. Ability to repair broken weapons - NO - if it means rebalancing the game so there are fewer weapons to acquire, then a big NO.

5. Less rain/ability to climb in rain - Sure, but not important - sure, maybe some kind of item.

6. New game + or post-game content - NO -  It would be kind of annoying to have stuff locked out of an open world game until after you finish it, so NO.

7. New mounts (e.g., loftwing) - YES - New content is always welcome.

8. Greater emphasis on narrative - NO - I am not sure what this one really means? You mean, make it more linear storytelling? If that is the case, then NO, that is the opposite of what I want to see in Zelda.

I’m in half agreement. I would definitely like more dungeons—not necessarily traditional Zelda dungeons oriented around an item or gimmick, but caves/ruins/catacombs with fearsome monsters and special loot. I think having more underworld locations to explore would be fun.

As for post-game content, I don’t think a new quest or just the ability to explore after the final showdown would be detrimental. I don’t really see it as locking away anything, but more of a bonus for those who finish the game.

The rest I agree with.



In regards to dungeons I've maintain various times through out that the less focus on them the better as seen in BOTW where because dungeons weren't the focus the rest of the game world had to be made more intriguing in order to become the focus. Dungeons were one of the main elements that rooted the series to the old formula and dictated the type of adventure that took place some people say it can still work in the new template but my view is only as like a Hyrule Castle type approach where it's not really a dungeon but a structured open location.

What BOTW opened up by dropping focus on them is the ability to incorporate other types of approaches into the structure for the adventure to drive progression to give people an example lets look at rpgs like Chrono Trigger and FFIV where the are set pieces that happen in the game's world/towns and so on an obvious one is at the start of FFIV in the mist village where the ring activates and burns the town down. Imagine in future Zelda games such events taken place in the game to drive things, you'll be roaming around exploring the open world then you come across Hateno Village and such an event happens and you're in the midst of it and have to try and deal with the issue that you've found yourself caught up in, that to me is a superior approach than falling back on dungeons.



On the rain - yeah, I agree that it’s not a problem. My main issue with it was in the first 15-20 hours or so when I was first presented with it. But after that it never struck me as an issue. I also said “sure” because I can’t think of anything offhand that it would break if it was an item (maybe armour feature of the final climb armour, or ingredient in food) to fix it. I could be wrong, I haven’t thought much into it, to be honest.

On the dungeons, I should clarify that I’m speaking more about the traditional Zelda style dungeons. Even in Breath of the Wild, my favourite part of a main dungeon was by far the big battle at the beginning. I like the story stuff too. I think there’s a reason many people’s favourite dungeon is the Forest Temple from Ocarina of Time - it’s not simply that it’s pretty to look at (others are too): it is straight forward, short, and the fact that the end boss was a simple Ganon clone didn’t bother anyone.

How I usually quantify the issues with dungeons is that many of them (3D in particular) are 90% searching for a hidden key/switch, or figuring out a series of vague puzzles. At least, this is how I found the experience - like finding a needle in a haystack most of the time.

Next, HAVING to do these beedle-in-a-haystack puzzles/portions to progress. I think some people like the idea of this: there were complaints the Shrines were “too easy.” IMO the Shrines required a great deal more thought and skill: where they are easier is that the goals are clear and you know what you’re doing and where you are supposed to be (no searching through 18 gigantic rooms to find that switch hidden under a vaguely located switch) - but you still might NOT be able to do it (at least right then): the older Zelda games were easy once you knew where you were supposed to go and what the goal of the puzzle was. And often I would look at guides to simply save time, and prevent the possibility of wandering around the same dungeon for potentially hours with NOTHING to show for it except a headache.

And these “trying to figure out where to go and what the goal is” sorts of “puzzles” DO exist all over BotW. BUT they are not apparent, nor are they in the critical path (in the dungeons blocking your progress, mandated for the player to complete). It’s the entire world. Best of all, none of it ever blocks you from moving forward - so it’s applied in a WAY more fun and rewarding way. Finding 1/3rd of what the game has hidden is more than adequate.

Personally, I found it incredibly liberating to finally play a Zelda game where I didn’t have to check up a guide every 30 minutes. In fact, I don’t think I looked up anything online ever, outside of reference documents for ingredients. Not to say I didn’t spend hours upon hours watching videos and guides for BotW, but they were about fun stuff players discovered you could do: a very different experience than “I’m stuck and need help finding out how to open that door.” type stuff. 

But in the bend, from an emotional standpoint, (in my humble opinion) it’s a far more beautiful experience to live most of the game on the surface, in the world - rather than through a series of dungeons. Breath of the Wild emphasizes the overworld like no other Zelda game before it, and it does it spectacularly.

And this is another reason that, while I am big on elaborate narratives in other games, there’s something special about the freedom and the “living in the world” aspect of Zelda that helps make it special.

 

Building Stuff, why I like that idea:

That’s also why more building stuff can be interesting as well. Wouldn’t it be nice to build more towns up? Or have the ability to have a cottage in many different parts of the world, perhaps set up a more elaborate homestead with more trophy cases? For example, if a player has a house in Kakariko, they might be able to build ingredient growing fields for rice, grain, turnips: come back and harvest later. A lot of people already farm in Breath of the Wild and have fun doing so. A big one is the farming of Durians in Faron; why not allow the player to build a cottage there? Allow them to grow their own Durian tree outside the cottage.

These sorts of little additions are fun, IMO.

Hateno is the business capital of Hyrule, why not make a building game out of it? Or perhaps outside the city a game about restoring Fort Hateno as a part of it.

How about a trade route minigame? Using Link to complete quests to build up that infrastructure and have a little oversight on it: “Gordon the Gordon is bringing iron ore to Hateno” “Deagle the eagle is transporting feather pillows from Rito to Gerudo City.” etc... And perhaps this could be another way to develop towns - even if it only to expand the number of places Link can go and buy arrows, or other limited consumables.

Rebuilding Hyrule Town could be interesting too. Gathering settlers from around the world.

There are tremendous numbers of possibilities using Breath of the Wild as an example: but the next game will likely have a bit of a different landscape - though Gerudo city, Kakariko Village, and Goron Town are almost certain to be there in some form.

Last edited by Jumpin - on 14 January 2019

I describe myself as a little dose of toxic masculinity.

Check out this cool fan animation inspired by Breath of the Wild:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8xGJr4dKkWQ



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Very cool. It reminds me of how I spent half an hour and several lives trying to kill that damn stationary guardian on the Great Plateau when first starting the game. It was an unreal feeling to have a Zelda enemy I couldn't just beat outright and really set the tone for the rest of my entire playthrough.



So, it’s a huge undertaking, but would anyone be interested in a big Zelda replay? I’m not sure if we would do only the mainline game or include spinoffs, but either way it could be fun!

Zelda 1/2 are available on Switch online, so that gives us a good head start.

Maybe we could do like one game a month? Maybe shorter windows for the shorter games? It would probably take a year and a half :P



Veknoid_Outcast said:
So, it’s a huge undertaking, but would anyone be interested in a big Zelda replay? I’m not sure if we would do only the mainline game or include spinoffs, but either way it could be fun!

Zelda 1/2 are available on Switch online, so that gives us a good head start.

Maybe we could do like one game a month? Maybe shorter windows for the shorter games? It would probably take a year and a half :P

If we do this one rule must be to not be allowed to look stuff up on the internet (how to enforce such a rule beats me tho)



Veknoid_Outcast said:
So, it’s a huge undertaking, but would anyone be interested in a big Zelda replay? I’m not sure if we would do only the mainline game or include spinoffs, but either way it could be fun!

Zelda 1/2 are available on Switch online, so that gives us a good head start.

Maybe we could do like one game a month? Maybe shorter windows for the shorter games? It would probably take a year and a half :P

Like a book club, but for finishing Zelda games instead of books? I'd be up for that. Real question is whether we're including the handheld Zeldas or just the console games.



I actually really love the idea of 'a zelda game a month', but then I remembered I hate/dislike about half the franchise and Breath of the Wild is a 6-month commitment. I'd love to go back and play Twilight Princess/Wind Waker as well as the handheld games, but honestly that seems like a lot of work.

Plus I hate Ocarina, Majora's Mask, Skyward Sword, adventures of Link, Phantom Hourglass, and Spirit Tracks. Well, maybe not HATE Ocarina, but I definitely think it's grossly overrated.



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