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Forums - Sales Discussion - Global HW & SW Up! 19th January

Marucha on 26 January 2013
DanneSandin said:
 

As I said to VGKing, I made a lengthy post to Runqust, you should read it. It is sad when people are hating. Wouldn't it be sad if people hated Universal studios because they prefered Sony studios? Or howabout hating EMI when you prefer Sony Music?

Gamers have been hating on eachother's consoles since well... for freakin' forever. It's like hating on someone elses football team. Like guy talk, bashing other people's stuff. I've noticed this since a very young age, being the one little wee girl gamer among the guys... they tell me "Why do you play that piece of crap?". I just tell them to shut up lol.

I guess the reason we don't like it here on the boards is because it poisons conversations, drives more interesting discussion out. Like go to IGN, read a Nintendo article... maybe half would be bashing ♪"Nintendo sucks, you blow, this is why I think so, blah blah blah"♪ etc



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chocoloco on 26 January 2013
RolStoppable said:
3DS: average
PS3: bad
360: awful
Wii U: abysmal
Wii: disastrous
PSP: catastrophic
DS: apocalyptic
PSV: Kansas City Chiefs

 

OT: I would be happy if Sony made a gaming tablet with a controller and discontinued the Vita. 



thismeintiel on 26 January 2013
kowenicki said:
thismeintiel said:
kowenicki said:
thismeintiel said:

No, Nintendo dropping its price by $80, which lead to them selling it at a loss, is what saved the 3DS.  Nintendo can't do that with the Wii U, though they may be forced to, because they are already selling it at a pretty big loss. 

@ OP

Pretty bad numbers all around.  I do think the PS3, 360, and Vita will get price cuts, which will help with sales (the 360 less so).  To look on the bright side, at least Sony is making profit off of the Vita.  Can't say the same for Nintendo and the Wii U. 

I'd like to see the proof that they are making a profit on sales of he vita.  Factor in the advertising of the hardware and cost of producing games that aren't selling and this is one disastrous venture.  They expected for the project to be profitable after 3 years, no chance of that now. 

Well, just think of how uch money Nintendo is losing if you factor in "the advertising of the hardware and cost of producing games that aren't selling."  Especially when you need to sell 2 or more $60 games to even come close to breaking even.  And the 3 year comment included R&D.  I'm speaking purely on manufactoring cost vs. retail price.  A qoute from Shuhei Yoshida backs my statement up. 

"For Vita, the price on performance was something we definitely wanted to hit, although we all agreed because we are PlayStation, people expect better graphics and prettier pictures, so we have all those things we wanted to achieve in terms of capabilities, but we capped our ambitions with a cost of goods target that we can profitably sell the hardware for $250.

To answer your question, we set out a goal: Yes, we're going to hit the $250 price, and no, we don't want to sell the hardware with a deficit. That's a goal we set out to do and I'm very happy we are achieving that."

So, at the very most, they are taking a slight loss on the $249 SKU, but it is made up for by a memory card or game purchase.

Fine, but see Rol's post. Pretty undeniable they lost a ton of cash in the vita over Xmas. Mass marketing and offers galore = loss. 

When was that quote from by the way. 

Dont forget he most important quite from kaz on he 3yrs to profit statistic, what levels of sales would that have been based on? Millions more than it will achieve for sure. 

As with most holiday offers, as well as some marketing, they are done mostly by the retailers, not the console manufactorers.  Now, if stores were offering $50-$100 gift cards from the end of Oct to the end of Dec with every Vita, than you could make a claim that Sony was pushing those promotions.  As far as marketing that wasn't pushed by certain retailers (print or TV), I didn't see many adverts for the Vita this past holiday, if any at all.  So, I highly doubt they took a significant hit in the profit department. 

As for the 3 year comment, Kaz has already admitted that Vita sales are on the low end of their predictions, so yes, it will probably take more than 3 years (most likely 4-5) before they make up for all of R&D.  However, I do believe he was speaking specifically about the HW paying for itself, so who knows how SW and memory cards factor into that.  And considering they proved in 2012 that they weren't going to pull a FUD move like Nintendo did with the 3DS's price (and possibly the Wii U's price this year), it is almost guaranteed they will drop the cost of production to where they can still make a profit, before cutting the Vita's price to $199.



 

DanneSandin on 26 January 2013
Marucha said:
DanneSandin said:
 

As I said to VGKing, I made a lengthy post to Runqust, you should read it. It is sad when people are hating. Wouldn't it be sad if people hated Universal studios because they prefered Sony studios? Or howabout hating EMI when you prefer Sony Music?

Gamers have been hating on eachother's consoles since well... for freakin' forever. It's like hating on someone elses football team. Like guy talk, bashing other people's stuff. I've noticed this since a very young age, being the one little wee girl gamer among the guys... they tell me "Why do you play that piece of crap?". I just tell them to shut up lol.

I guess the reason we don't like it here on the boards is because it poisons conversations, drives more interesting discussion out. Like go to IGN, read a Nintendo article... maybe half would be bashing ♪"Nintendo sucks, you blow, this is why I think so, blah blah blah"♪ etc

Yeah, I've never understood the whole concept of bashing another team, or whatever it might be. I just don't get it.

And I never read the comments on IGN for a reason ^^ What's wrong with people??? Why all the hate?



I'm on Twitter @DanneSandin!

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maximrace on 26 January 2013
Soleron said:

maximrace said:
I think it's easy to understand. There is a marketshift towards apps.

Oh really? Show me the big app game company's balance sheets.

Look at games like fruit ninja, temple run and angry birds. They are far more profitable than a 64€ core game that sells below 1m

Most core gamers have the hdtwins and are waiting for the nextgen.

Why wait? Aren't all the games they like out now? Why will next gen's games suddenly be attractive if current ones are not?

Because next gen games will be different. More will be able to be done resulting in better games that core gamers really need to play so they buy the next consoles.

The casual gamer who bought the wii, psp or ds isn't interested in gaming anymore because they have a tablet/ smartphone to game on.

Are they spending the same amount of money on it? What you're actually seeing is $60 games no longer being worth it so people will take what they can get for 99c or free. That doesn't amount to actually not wanting console games, it means the ones they do want don't exist. And when they DO exist (CoD, Minecraft, Animal Crossing 3DS) suddenly we see lots of sales out of nowhere.

It's market apathy, not market shift.

Not true, if they really wanted that game they would have bought a vita to play ac or cod. This didn't happen.

But casuals aren't that important for a core gaming console.

Kinect didn't sell 20m then?

Yes it did but 360 would have sold 50m with kinect, that's a good number for a core gaming machine. And a cellphone device can't play games like kinect. Kinect is unique thus making people want it.

So the nextbox/ ps 4 should do allright if they are aimed a tthe core market.

wasn't the Wii U aimed at the core market?

Yes but there is name confusion. Most people aren't really that well informed like gameforummembers. So most people don't want to buy it because it's just the succesor of a casual games console







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the_dengle on 26 January 2013
Yakuzaice said:

Well Japan did have animal crossing, which was bigger than those individually.  That also reflects in the hardware sales.  If you remove Japan, the 3DS is down 28,666 units YoY over 24%.

Yeah, Animal Crossing is huge in Japan, big enough to compensate for one or even two of 2011's releases, but not all three.



Pavolink on 26 January 2013

I honestly can't imagine Wii U sales during february. Disastrous.



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DKCTF didn't move consoles

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MakeAmazing on 26 January 2013

The market is so fragmented at the moment, that I really do think we are on a potential gaming bubble burst... I remember the Amiga gaming bubble burst... really sad day for gaming. Considering the recession is worse now than it was back then, in fact this one has just been going on for years and years and might be a few more years.

Sony sales should hold firm over Feb-May as some potential big hitters stop or reduce the slide, in previous years this has been the case. I do see the summer months being bad for all consoles. New consoles by the end of the year should help lift the overall yearly sales from last year... but I don't expect sales to be that great in 2014.




Scisca on 26 January 2013

Sad.

People were saying Wii U will overtake Vita in a matter of weeks after the launch. We may have to wait for quite some time for that to happen...

I'm not worried about Wii U though... not just yet. Nintendo has interesting games coming so the console will be doing better in Q3-4. They have to resist the urge of making it a Mario-box by releasing other games, I'm really sick of even hearing about more Mario games being released every 3 months! This would kill all other games on Wii U and 3rd party games especially. They have to get their crowd used to playing different games, so they have to push Pikmin 3, Bayo 2, X, Metroid, Zelda and some good 3rd party games asap and finally give Mario a break! We'll get MK and SSB and that should be all Mario games for quite some time.

Vita... Is in a worse spot, but it can grow as well. I think it will get over Wii U in weekly sales quite soon for a few weeks when Japan-oriented games get released (there are a few coming). After all, Famitsu said it's the most desired console in Japan. They just have to start taking care of the Japanese market more and cut the price. It's really strange that a handheld sells best in Europe.


Wii U is selling bad, but it's not a problem. The sales are appropriate - there are no games and I can't see a single reason somebody would want to buy it. A 10th Mario released in a year's time really isn't much of a reason. Situation should improve once we get some software though.
Vita has a bigger problem, since there are many awesome games on it, it had the best launch year in history when it comes to SF and it still tanks. This is a problem, I just hope a price-cut and a few new games can solve the problem.


I wonder what pricing policy will Nintendo have for Wii U. Are they going to follow the 3DS and cut the price this year, which may improve sales but will hurt every single future console they release? Can you imagine being an early adopter after something like that? Or will they try to go Vita's way and keep the price longer (probably until early 2014) hoping for software to convince people to buy the console?



Wii U is a GCN 2 - I called it months before the release!

My Vita to-buy list: The Walking Dead, Persona 4 Golden, Need for Speed: Most Wanted, TearAway, Ys: Memories of Celceta, Muramasa: The Demon Blade, History: Legends of War, FIFA 13, Final Fantasy HD X, X-2, Worms Revolution Extreme, The Amazing Spiderman, Batman: Arkham Origins Blackgate - too many no-gaemz :/

My consoles: PS2 Slim, PS3 Slim 320 GB, PSV 32 GB, Wii, DSi.

DarkFury on 26 January 2013

What people need to realize is that development costs for the next gen are going up massively, and therefore require BIGGER sales per game than ever before. Consoles losing ground to mobile is very bad news for core gamers, we should never wish "good riddance" to the gamers Wii brought to console gaming. Console gaming cannot exist with the sales numbers of the yesteryear. To make up for the higher dev costs, games need to sell more.

No core gamer should be happy with these numbers, or hope for "casuals' to go away.

No consoles sold=small userbase=less games sold=no big console games made as the sales cannot justify the massive development budgets.