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Forums - Gaming Discussion - The Ps3 will FINALLY pass the xbox360 at some point,so what,s the big deal?it,s only 2013

Legend11 said:
You missed the point in that it isn't really any kind of a success for the PS3 if it eventually passes the 360 since it changes nothing about how this generation actually played out.  But for argument's sake please tell us what you think it would change.  Do you think that many third parties would go back to ignoring the Xbox brand?  Do you think the 360 would start losing massive amounts of money?  Would the 360 lose the gains it's made in North America and the UK? 

Tell us how it's meaningful for the PS3 if it passes the 360 at this point in the generation and what changes we would see.  I could tell the Wii was dominating for example at the start of this generation simply by the amount of people that wanted one and the shortages I saw.  Tell me what changes I should expect to see at Gamestop and Walmart if the PS3 passes the 360.

Not here to attack the 360, so I won't address anything concerning it.

It does actually change how the generation played out, to this point 360 has more sales than PS3. In the end, this probably will not be the case. If you think 2nd and 3rd place are interchangeable, you've a strange stance on competition.

It's historical for the PS3. Looking back upon this particular generation years later, the World will know which console sold the most units (Wii) followed by 2nd place (be it PS3 or 360) and 3rd.

Moving forward (I guess this is what you're getting at), Sony can claim that it once again outsold Microsoft's console even though it released a year after the competition. 



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dsgrue3 said:
Legend11 said:
You missed the point in that it isn't really any kind of a success for the PS3 if it eventually passes the 360 since it changes nothing about how this generation actually played out.  But for argument's sake please tell us what you think it would change.  Do you think that many third parties would go back to ignoring the Xbox brand?  Do you think the 360 would start losing massive amounts of money?  Would the 360 lose the gains it's made in North America and the UK? 

Tell us how it's meaningful for the PS3 if it passes the 360 at this point in the generation and what changes we would see.  I could tell the Wii was dominating for example at the start of this generation simply by the amount of people that wanted one and the shortages I saw.  Tell me what changes I should expect to see at Gamestop and Walmart if the PS3 passes the 360.

Not here to attack the 360, so I won't address anything concerning it.

It does actually change how the generation played out, to this point 360 has more sales than PS3. In the end, this probably will not be the case. If you think 2nd and 3rd place are interchangeable, you've a strange stance on competition.

It's historical for the PS3. Looking back upon this particular generation years later, the World will know which console sold the most units (Wii) followed by 2nd place (be it PS3 or 360) and 3rd.

Moving forward (I guess this is what you're getting at), Sony can claim that it once again outsold Microsoft's console even though it released a year after the competition. 


I still don't see how it changes anything about how this generation played out.  I mean you can't even name one change that would be seen at Gamestop or Walmart if it happened.  I also think second and third place really are interchangeable when you're talking about this late in a generation and how close the numbers are.  Looking at last generation for example if it had been the Gamecube that outsold the Xbox by 1 million do you think think things would have been any different or meaningful in any way besides the order of consoles on a list?



Legend11 said:
I still don't see how it changes anything about how this generation played out.  I mean you can't even name one change that would be seen at Gamestop or Walmart if it happened.  I also think second and third place really are interchangeable when you're talking about this late in a generation and how close the numbers are.  Looking at last generation for example if it had been the Gamecube that outsold the Xbox by 1 million do you think think things would have been any different or meaningful in any way besides the order of consoles on a list?

Nothing will change (in terms of retail) when PS3 passed 360, just as nothing will change when 360 passes Wii U in certain regions. Lack of change isn't indicative of meaninglessness. These are still events which are significant.



dsgrue3 said:
Legend11 said:
The 360 is doing impressive against the PS3 because we're looking at it from the perspective of multiple generations and not in some sort of bubble like you seem to.  I mean if a company came in and took 40% of the desktop OS market would you be arguing that it isn't impressive at all because Microsoft has 51%?  Do you realize how stupid that sounds?  The 360 sold 50+ million more than last generation that's a fact, the PS3 has sold significantly less than PS2 and lost significant marketshare that's a fact. 

As far as this "lover" and "tissue" nonsense you seem to be spouting on the forum it seems like a really pathetic way to try to argue when you have absolutely nothing to back you up.  Even if the PS3 does pass the 360 at some point it really is meaningless because it changes absolutely nothing about what has actually happened this generation with the 360 gaining massive 3rd party support, a very strong presence in North America and UK, becoming profitable, etc.

You missed the point entirely. No one is in here attempting to downplay MS success, it has done VERY well. What I do see is people downplaying the success of Sony in outselling the 360 every year it's been on the market save 2008, and the ultimate passing of the 360 in total sales. 

PS3 passing the 360 isn't meaningless either. Arguing that is incredibly dense. It's historical, just as the Wii dominating this generation and MS proving itself this generation. One event does not diminish another.

There is some subjectivity in regards to success, but facts are unbiased and not without meaning. 

Exactly. 

But I see he's still trying to spin it.



sales2099 said:
dsgrue3 said:
 
sales2099 said:
You half got it, not there yet.

See 360 taking Wii globally IS relevant, it wont happen in one years time. So really the victory will be just as hollow as PS3 taking 2nd after next gen consoles are out.

 

Not worth attempting to convey why your statements are entirely contradictory, because you'll never admit it. I tried.

 

How so? 360 passing Wii would be just as hollow as PS3 passing 360. I am using the same principles for both cases. After holiday 2013 any gains by anybody become irrelevant and hollow. The gamers will have moved on.


If a system is still selling even if there are newer ones available, it proves that it is still relevant. It is relevant to those who buy it, no matter when they do.  And it is relevant to the manufacturers, since they're still making money off the product.

If the system is still being manufactured and selling good, even among the newer ones, I'm sure you can understand how it affects that new gen. People are buying the older one because it is cheaper, has more games available, etc. Instead of buying the newer, more expensive ones.



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sales2099 said:
Euphoria14 said:
sales2099 said:
Euphoria14 said:
sales2099 said:
Euphoria14 said:
sales2099 said:

Nono, more like the race ended with Wii taking 1st and 360 2nd. The people left the stadium and went to the next one to see the next race. PS3 is basically running by itself with nobody watching and its competitors allready left for the showers, pretending that the race is still going. It takes 2nd place, but only in its mind :P

Point, most gamers see the generation ending when all new consoles come out. Continuing to sell /= generation still going. It sells but it currently isnt the most current, or relevant generation

The finish line isn't some imaginary thing made up by you or anyone else here that makes them feel better or gives them a sense of victory. There is no "Next console released, so all sales after this point are irrelevant". After the 720, WiiU and PS4 are all released, the previous gen will still go on, which is why DS still sells well and the PS2 sold 50M+ after the newer consoles released.

History doesn't look at things that way either. If we look  in 6 years and none of this gens consoles are being shipped aymore, that is when we know where each finished.

Remember, PS2 didn't finish with 100M sales. It will finish with ~160M.

 

Staying power is VERY relevant and Sony looks to try and maintain it, evident by their 2013 release schedule.

Thats the thing. PS2 will finish with 160 but its generation ended a looong time ago.


You think it ended when the 360 released? Maybe you believe it ended when the Wii and PS3 released?

I don't know, I clearly remember God of War 2 releasing in 2007.

 

 

Sorry Sales, but you don't get to make up the rules on when and where a generation ends.

The rules arent concrete, but it seems a loose gamer consensus is when all 3 consoles release the past gen ends. Some people confuse a console still being alive with its generation still going strong.GOW may have released in 2007, but Gamecube and Xbox were long discontinued. All 3 next gen consoles were out. PS2 was still selling, but it time in the spotlight was over, not to mention its competition was done.


Gamer consensus means squat. The manufacturers make the consoles and as long as consumers buy them, they are still relevant.

And yes, Gamecube and Xbox were discontinued, but why does that matter? It wasn't Sonys fault they had no staying power.

 

And it's spotlight was not over. In 2006 the PS2 outsold the 360.

http://arstechnica.com/uncategorized/2006/06/7030-2/

 

 In 2007 it outsold the PS3. It was still mentioned quite frequently.

http://www.wired.com/gadgetlab/2007/08/ps2-still-outse/

 

Even in 2009 it was still making news.

http://www.businessinsider.com/sonys-9-year-old-playstation-2-outsold-the-ps3-last-month-2009-5

As I said, you can't make up the rules.

Id hardly call that stealing the spotlight. I never heard of a one console generation. Gamecube and Xbox became discontinued, PS2 is the winner and you move on.

Again I think your confusing a console selling well with its generation going strong. PS2 had staying power, but its gen ended in 2006. To be as simple as I can, despite its staying power, its spotlight was taken off when all 3 next gen consoles hit the market. PS2 still had some steam left, but was an afterthought compared to the combined gen of 360, Wii, and PS3.

But I seriously do wish there was a solid consensus.


In your world with your made up rules you move on, but here in the real world we understand that as long as a console gets developer support and is still selling, it's sales matter. 



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Euphoria14 said:
sales2099 said:
Euphoria14 said:
sales2099 said:
Euphoria14 said:
sales2099 said:
Euphoria14 said:
sales2099 said:

Nono, more like the race ended with Wii taking 1st and 360 2nd. The people left the stadium and went to the next one to see the next race. PS3 is basically running by itself with nobody watching and its competitors allready left for the showers, pretending that the race is still going. It takes 2nd place, but only in its mind :P

Point, most gamers see the generation ending when all new consoles come out. Continuing to sell /= generation still going. It sells but it currently isnt the most current, or relevant generation

The finish line isn't some imaginary thing made up by you or anyone else here that makes them feel better or gives them a sense of victory. There is no "Next console released, so all sales after this point are irrelevant". After the 720, WiiU and PS4 are all released, the previous gen will still go on, which is why DS still sells well and the PS2 sold 50M+ after the newer consoles released.

History doesn't look at things that way either. If we look  in 6 years and none of this gens consoles are being shipped aymore, that is when we know where each finished.

Remember, PS2 didn't finish with 100M sales. It will finish with ~160M.

 

Staying power is VERY relevant and Sony looks to try and maintain it, evident by their 2013 release schedule.

Thats the thing. PS2 will finish with 160 but its generation ended a looong time ago.


You think it ended when the 360 released? Maybe you believe it ended when the Wii and PS3 released?

I don't know, I clearly remember God of War 2 releasing in 2007.

 

 

Sorry Sales, but you don't get to make up the rules on when and where a generation ends.

The rules arent concrete, but it seems a loose gamer consensus is when all 3 consoles release the past gen ends. Some people confuse a console still being alive with its generation still going strong.GOW may have released in 2007, but Gamecube and Xbox were long discontinued. All 3 next gen consoles were out. PS2 was still selling, but it time in the spotlight was over, not to mention its competition was done.


Gamer consensus means squat. The manufacturers make the consoles and as long as consumers buy them, they are still relevant.

And yes, Gamecube and Xbox were discontinued, but why does that matter? It wasn't Sonys fault they had no staying power.

 

And it's spotlight was not over. In 2006 the PS2 outsold the 360.

http://arstechnica.com/uncategorized/2006/06/7030-2/

 

 In 2007 it outsold the PS3. It was still mentioned quite frequently.

http://www.wired.com/gadgetlab/2007/08/ps2-still-outse/

 

Even in 2009 it was still making news.

http://www.businessinsider.com/sonys-9-year-old-playstation-2-outsold-the-ps3-last-month-2009-5

As I said, you can't make up the rules.

Id hardly call that stealing the spotlight. I never heard of a one console generation. Gamecube and Xbox became discontinued, PS2 is the winner and you move on.

Again I think your confusing a console selling well with its generation going strong. PS2 had staying power, but its gen ended in 2006. To be as simple as I can, despite its staying power, its spotlight was taken off when all 3 next gen consoles hit the market. PS2 still had some steam left, but was an afterthought compared to the combined gen of 360, Wii, and PS3.

But I seriously do wish there was a solid consensus.


In your world with your made up rules you move on, but here in the real world we understand that as long as a console gets developer support and is still selling, it's sales matter. 

It only stops meaning anything if you put your own preferences and allegiance into the mix. As if you have anything to gain out of the success or failure of a company.



Hynad said:
dsgrue3 said:
Legend11 said:
The 360 is doing impressive against the PS3 because we're looking at it from the perspective of multiple generations and not in some sort of bubble like you seem to.  I mean if a company came in and took 40% of the desktop OS market would you be arguing that it isn't impressive at all because Microsoft has 51%?  Do you realize how stupid that sounds?  The 360 sold 50+ million more than last generation that's a fact, the PS3 has sold significantly less than PS2 and lost significant marketshare that's a fact. 

As far as this "lover" and "tissue" nonsense you seem to be spouting on the forum it seems like a really pathetic way to try to argue when you have absolutely nothing to back you up.  Even if the PS3 does pass the 360 at some point it really is meaningless because it changes absolutely nothing about what has actually happened this generation with the 360 gaining massive 3rd party support, a very strong presence in North America and UK, becoming profitable, etc.

You missed the point entirely. No one is in here attempting to downplay MS success, it has done VERY well. What I do see is people downplaying the success of Sony in outselling the 360 every year it's been on the market save 2008, and the ultimate passing of the 360 in total sales. 

PS3 passing the 360 isn't meaningless either. Arguing that is incredibly dense. It's historical, just as the Wii dominating this generation and MS proving itself this generation. One event does not diminish another.

There is some subjectivity in regards to success, but facts are unbiased and not without meaning. 

Exactly. 

But I see he's still trying to spin it.

What am I trying to spin?  As the topic states what will be the big deal?  Can you name even one thing that will change if someone walked into a Gamestop if it happens?  Just one to prove that it is meaningful in any way.  If you can't name something then I stand by my point that it is meaningless and just something that some Playstation fans are desperately hoping for to try to spin what has actually happened this generation (lost marketshare, loss of clout with third parties, etc).



Legend11 said:
Hynad said:
dsgrue3 said:
Legend11 said:
The 360 is doing impressive against the PS3 because we're looking at it from the perspective of multiple generations and not in some sort of bubble like you seem to.  I mean if a company came in and took 40% of the desktop OS market would you be arguing that it isn't impressive at all because Microsoft has 51%?  Do you realize how stupid that sounds?  The 360 sold 50+ million more than last generation that's a fact, the PS3 has sold significantly less than PS2 and lost significant marketshare that's a fact. 

As far as this "lover" and "tissue" nonsense you seem to be spouting on the forum it seems like a really pathetic way to try to argue when you have absolutely nothing to back you up.  Even if the PS3 does pass the 360 at some point it really is meaningless because it changes absolutely nothing about what has actually happened this generation with the 360 gaining massive 3rd party support, a very strong presence in North America and UK, becoming profitable, etc.

You missed the point entirely. No one is in here attempting to downplay MS success, it has done VERY well. What I do see is people downplaying the success of Sony in outselling the 360 every year it's been on the market save 2008, and the ultimate passing of the 360 in total sales. 

PS3 passing the 360 isn't meaningless either. Arguing that is incredibly dense. It's historical, just as the Wii dominating this generation and MS proving itself this generation. One event does not diminish another.

There is some subjectivity in regards to success, but facts are unbiased and not without meaning. 

Exactly. 

But I see he's still trying to spin it.

What am I trying to spin?  As the topic states what will be the big deal?  Can you name even one thing that will change if someone walked into a Gamestop if it happens?  Just one to prove that it is meaningful in any way.  If you can't name something then I stand by my point that it is meaningless and just something that some Playstation fans are desperately hoping for to try to spin what has actually happened this generation (lost marketshare, loss of clout with third parties, etc).

I know, right? What is the big deal if the PS3 outsells the 360 in the end. Like it's been doing so far, year over year. What's making you so worked up about it? What's so important in this that makes you so upset that you must rain on others' parade?

Obviously, if it isn't such a big deal, you shouldn't even be posting in here in the first place.

If the PS3 outsells the 360, it ultimately means that they have surpassed it market-share wise. The last gen is irrelevant to this. 




sales2099 said:
Dragon246 said:
spaceguy said:
VGKing said:
spaceguy said:
dsgrue3 said:
sales2099 said:
Dragon246 said:
Looks like MS fans are already preparing their "It doesn't matter" speeches.

Ive been saying this since 2010. We all know its gonna happen at some point. 

But for the former #1 brand in gaming to crawl to 2nd place after 7+ years and in all likelihood after the next xbox is released, not to mention the marketshare gains Xbox has made at the expense of Sonys.......to celebrate victory is to celebrate lowering the bar for your faction.

So by all means, celebrate


PS3 has outsold Xbox360 every full year on the market except for 2008. In direct competition, the 360 has lost. Nothing you say can change this fact.

Who's made more money? Who gained more this gen (3rd party support & Owning U.S.)? Who converted many millions to their brand? Who has held a lead and outwitted the whole way? Sony has took it in the pants this gen. 720 will launch with ps3 still behind 360, fact!!! So really if ps3 does pass up 360, it will be like lighting a m1000 and it being a dud.

Calm down dude lmfao....

A steamed up today but not anything to do with this site. However it is showing in my posts. My mom has got cancer back, so kinda been a shit week. I'm usually pretty calm, Just irritated.

After a marathon, a sony and ms fan talks-

Sony Fan- Our player won second!

Ms Fan- So what? Our player had second position for 35 kms, he just lost it in the last 7.

Guess who won the silver medal?

Nono, more like the race ended with Wii taking 1st and 360 2nd. The people left the stadium and went to the next one to see the next race. PS3 is basically running by itself with nobody watching and its competitors allready left for the showers, pretending that the race is still going. It takes 2nd place, but only in its mind :P

Point, most gamers see the generation ending when all new consoles come out. Continuing to sell /= generation still going. It sells but it currently isnt the most current, or relevant generation


Funny I thought 360 was still running or did he retire hurt? I guess by this logic the ps2 took many a victory lap.