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Forums - Sony - How has Sony not fixed marketing yet?

Dodece said:
For Sony to fix its marketing it must first address the root cause of its problem. I think it has been made painfully clear over the past five years that Sony hasn't practiced due diligence when it comes to market research. Microsoft was successful with its advertising, because it was willing to spend the time. Getting to know their audience. This might come as news to some, but Microsoft paid members of their staff to be dedicated trolls on gaming forums, and this is a straight up fact. A number of former employees have confessed to doing this years before the 360 had actually launched.

This not only gave Microsoft invaluable data, but it gave them actual experts about this demographic. Which is why Microsoft's marketing resonates with gamers. Go to any gaming forum, and ask the members what they want to see in advertising. The first response you will get is real game play footage. What do Microsoft commercials have a lot of. You guessed it game play footage. The second response you would likely get is that gamers want to know the story. What do Microsoft commercials have a lot of. You guessed it a story. The third response would probably be good music, and you guessed it Microsoft puts a lot of emphasis on the sound track.

Compare that to Sony's efforts. Which are largely live action, abstract, and poorly orchestrated. Which is about as far from what gamers want as you can get, and we could explain to them why if they just asked. Why do any of us want to see the game play. Sure we want to see what we are buying, but if we don't see it where do our minds go first. We assume the game sucks, because they are refusing to show it to us. The same holds true for story, and as far as music is concerned. That is what is supposed to touch you emotionally.

Sony isn't doing itself any favors if it is pawning the job off on advertising agencies, because they are going to just offer up the same generic advertising. That they use for all of their other products. Gamers are not generic at all. You can't just create awareness with us. You need to get us fucking psyched about something. Happy go lucky is never going to turn us on like stroking our passions will. A hundred generic commercials aren't going to be half as effective as one well aimed shot.

The real irony is that Sony can spend less, and get more if they spend the time learning about what makes their audience tick. Thinking they know isn't the same as actually knowing. Hell it would go a long way to making their games more attractive, because they would have a better idea of what we want. Why we are turned off isn't some kind of deep mystery. We aren't that complex, and the fact that they haven't figured us out. Is proof that they just haven't even bothered to try. I guess they don't want to get their hands dirty.

By the way those Kevin Butler commercials were like the worst. I can understand why fans of the platform might have thought they were cool, because they were like a echo chamber of their sentiments. However speaking as a outside observer I found them rather disconnected from the product. Which is why the character ended up being used to mock the platform. By the way a character that can be construed as a pompous ass talking down to other people. While funny at times. Could also come across as a literal representation of the company and its product.

KB is a genius spokesperson for the platform and helped PS3 take off in 09.  People love guys who act pompus look at other ads that are popular.  The most interesting man in the world ring any bells?  Sorry but KB ads were hilarious and I know many people who had no interest in PS3 until they started airing.  His mockery of Wii and Kinect was priceless and true.




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platformmaster918 said:

Honestly I was watching Bonus Round and they mentioned that Starhawk and Twisted Metal both bombed this year.  This has been a disturbing trend.  Infamous 2, Resistance 3, Twisted Metal, and many more deserved to sell more.  I feel like their advertising needs to improve to get some big sellers.  They don't adverstise like they did in the PS2 era.  I just wish they would have something better than KB talking about a game when they did.  I mean he's great for selling the console but people don't get to see the awesome upgrading weapons in R3 when he's riding a horse the whole commercial.  How has this not been fixed yet?

Why do you think marketing is something alone that will generate millions and millions of sales?  How many copies do you think Starhawk and Twisted Metal should sell?  The former is a new take on an older IP, and the other one is a reboot of an older IP.  To get sales, you need to move platforms.  The Playstation isn't all that in America at this point (it is XBox territory) and Japan appears to be Nintendo's realm at this point.  So, you have Europe.  You are talking a region that is in financial hell, with large scale unemployment.  How much more would sales do there?

As far as marketing goes, Sony had one of the best campaigns this generation, the Kevin Butler one.  Would Kevin Butler hawking Starhawk and Twisted Metal sold several million more copies of each?

Sometimes, it can't be fixed.  Maybe had Sony been more competitive early on and didn't give up the edge to Microsoft in America, they would of had a shot.



richardhutnik said:
platformmaster918 said:

Honestly I was watching Bonus Round and they mentioned that Starhawk and Twisted Metal both bombed this year.  This has been a disturbing trend.  Infamous 2, Resistance 3, Twisted Metal, and many more deserved to sell more.  I feel like their advertising needs to improve to get some big sellers.  They don't adverstise like they did in the PS2 era.  I just wish they would have something better than KB talking about a game when they did.  I mean he's great for selling the console but people don't get to see the awesome upgrading weapons in R3 when he's riding a horse the whole commercial.  How has this not been fixed yet?

Why do you think marketing is something alone that will generate millions and millions of sales?  How many copies do you think Starhawk and Twisted Metal should sell?  The former is a new take on an older IP, and the other one is a reboot of an older IP.  To get sales, you need to move platforms.  The Playstation isn't all that in America at this point (it is XBox territory) and Japan appears to be Nintendo's realm at this point.  So, you have Europe.  You are talking a region that is in financial hell, with large scale unemployment.  How much more would sales do there?

As far as marketing goes, Sony had one of the best campaigns this generation, the Kevin Butler one.  Would Kevin Butler hawking Starhawk and Twisted Metal sold several million more copies of each?

Sometimes, it can't be fixed.  Maybe had Sony been more competitive early on and didn't give up the edge to Microsoft in America, they would of had a shot.

there's always next gen...




Get Your Portable ID!Lord of Ratchet and Clank

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Warden of Platformers

Platform, Snake, thanks for your responses. For me it kind of reinforces my (completely uneducated) opinion of these games. Infamous to me sounds like the plot of a b-class superhero movie and the moral choices would have been cool if I hadn't played Bioware games and Fable a decade ago. If I'm going to spend the next three hours pretending to be a superhero, I'll be Batman. "Cole McGrath" just doesn't sound unique or exciting. If they could use some creativity and come up with something better than generic lighting man, it would excite me to play a superhero game. Reistence, well, post-appocolyptic stories, I think, Have limited appeal. They are inherently depressing. People often compare the game to Halo and say it's better (it may be), but if you are going to use your imagination and escape, I think more people would rather be a super-soldier named Master Chief exporing a beautiful, mysterious ring-shaped world called halo than a generic guy in a bleak, wasted future. I think the idea of getting across the continent to save your family is kinda cool, and it's a misison that isn't used in games very often. But still, when I get home from a long, frustrating day at work and want to escape, a generic super hero or a wasted future is not where I want to go. I want to be Batman. I think this, more than anything else, is why these games are not as big as others and it has nothing to do with game quality or advertising. If I pick up a PS3 this year I'm going straight for Uncharted (because I love Indian Jones type adventures) LBP (cool name, neat graphics and classic side scroling) and GoW (ancient Greece is awesome!).



@Dodece, I haven't seen Forza, Reach, ODST, nor Fable commercials, but I've seen every Gears of War commercials and Halo 4's commercials, there's no gameplay in any of them. By every Gears of War commercial I meant for each of the 3 games, not necessarily every commercial.



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platformmaster918 said:
richardhutnik said:
platformmaster918 said:

Honestly I was watching Bonus Round and they mentioned that Starhawk and Twisted Metal both bombed this year.  This has been a disturbing trend.  Infamous 2, Resistance 3, Twisted Metal, and many more deserved to sell more.  I feel like their advertising needs to improve to get some big sellers.  They don't adverstise like they did in the PS2 era.  I just wish they would have something better than KB talking about a game when they did.  I mean he's great for selling the console but people don't get to see the awesome upgrading weapons in R3 when he's riding a horse the whole commercial.  How has this not been fixed yet?

Why do you think marketing is something alone that will generate millions and millions of sales?  How many copies do you think Starhawk and Twisted Metal should sell?  The former is a new take on an older IP, and the other one is a reboot of an older IP.  To get sales, you need to move platforms.  The Playstation isn't all that in America at this point (it is XBox territory) and Japan appears to be Nintendo's realm at this point.  So, you have Europe.  You are talking a region that is in financial hell, with large scale unemployment.  How much more would sales do there?

As far as marketing goes, Sony had one of the best campaigns this generation, the Kevin Butler one.  Would Kevin Butler hawking Starhawk and Twisted Metal sold several million more copies of each?

Sometimes, it can't be fixed.  Maybe had Sony been more competitive early on and didn't give up the edge to Microsoft in America, they would of had a shot.

there's always next gen...

I would not deny that marketing couldn't have an impact when there is a battle to establish a platform.  But, I would say, once the markets for the platform is set, only thing you get going with marketing is to get awareness for the game, and tap into possible interest in a given game in that platform's market.  Most stuff today is multiplatform at this point anyhow.



It comes down to money and sony doesn't have enough money to make long standing/flashy advertising campaigns. While PlayStation isn't losing money for the company, it is an overall problem.



Dodece said:
For Sony to fix its marketing it must first address the root cause of its problem. I think it has been made painfully clear over the past five years that Sony hasn't practiced due diligence when it comes to market research. Microsoft was successful with its advertising, because it was willing to spend the time. Getting to know their audience. This might come as news to some, but Microsoft paid members of their staff to be dedicated trolls on gaming forums, and this is a straight up fact. A number of former employees have confessed to doing this years before the 360 had actually launched.

This not only gave Microsoft invaluable data, but it gave them actual experts about this demographic. Which is why Microsoft's marketing resonates with gamers. Go to any gaming forum, and ask the members what they want to see in advertising. The first response you will get is real game play footage. What do Microsoft commercials have a lot of. You guessed it game play footage. The second response you would likely get is that gamers want to know the story. What do Microsoft commercials have a lot of. You guessed it a story. The third response would probably be good music, and you guessed it Microsoft puts a lot of emphasis on the sound track.

Compare that to Sony's efforts. Which are largely live action, abstract, and poorly orchestrated. Which is about as far from what gamers want as you can get, and we could explain to them why if they just asked. Why do any of us want to see the game play. Sure we want to see what we are buying, but if we don't see it where do our minds go first. We assume the game sucks, because they are refusing to show it to us. The same holds true for story, and as far as music is concerned. That is what is supposed to touch you emotionally.

Sony isn't doing itself any favors if it is pawning the job off on advertising agencies, because they are going to just offer up the same generic advertising. That they use for all of their other products. Gamers are not generic at all. You can't just create awareness with us. You need to get us fucking psyched about something. Happy go lucky is never going to turn us on like stroking our passions will. A hundred generic commercials aren't going to be half as effective as one well aimed shot.

The real irony is that Sony can spend less, and get more if they spend the time learning about what makes their audience tick. Thinking they know isn't the same as actually knowing. Hell it would go a long way to making their games more attractive, because they would have a better idea of what we want. Why we are turned off isn't some kind of deep mystery. We aren't that complex, and the fact that they haven't figured us out. Is proof that they just haven't even bothered to try. I guess they don't want to get their hands dirty.

By the way those Kevin Butler commercials were like the worst. I can understand why fans of the platform might have thought they were cool, because they were like a echo chamber of their sentiments. However speaking as a outside observer I found them rather disconnected from the product. Which is why the character ended up being used to mock the platform. By the way a character that can be construed as a pompous ass talking down to other people. While funny at times. Could also come across as a literal representation of the company and its product.

One thing I definitely agree on is use of gameplay of live action in ads.  The PS all star ad recently did nothing for me, felt cheap even though it likely cost far more than just showing some game play. 



platformmaster918 said:
SnakeDrake said:
I think Sony should do what it has done here and get out offical playstation license to retailers to redecorate stores with a playstation look.

I think they should open up Playstation stores (like apple stores).  Line them with characters from Playstation exclusives from PSone to PS3.  Have kiosks up for Vita and PS3.  Have exclusives at the front and not have Playstation games pushed to the back like at Gamestops I've seen.  This could skyrocket the brandname and get way more people to check out their products.  Although it far more likely that  a Sony store would open with Playstation as a small part but still a thought.


well they did have a PlayStation store in California back in the ps2 days but it got closed down a little bit after the PS3's release



richardhutnik said:
platformmaster918 said:

Honestly I was watching Bonus Round and they mentioned that Starhawk and Twisted Metal both bombed this year.  This has been a disturbing trend.  Infamous 2, Resistance 3, Twisted Metal, and many more deserved to sell more.  I feel like their advertising needs to improve to get some big sellers.  They don't adverstise like they did in the PS2 era.  I just wish they would have something better than KB talking about a game when they did.  I mean he's great for selling the console but people don't get to see the awesome upgrading weapons in R3 when he's riding a horse the whole commercial.  How has this not been fixed yet?

Why do you think marketing is something alone that will generate millions and millions of sales?  How many copies do you think Starhawk and Twisted Metal should sell?  The former is a new take on an older IP, and the other one is a reboot of an older IP.  To get sales, you need to move platforms.  The Playstation isn't all that in America at this point (it is XBox territory) and Japan appears to be Nintendo's realm at this point.  So, you have Europe.  You are talking a region that is in financial hell, with large scale unemployment.  How much more would sales do there?

As far as marketing goes, Sony had one of the best campaigns this generation, the Kevin Butler one.  Would Kevin Butler hawking Starhawk and Twisted Metal sold several million more copies of each?

Sometimes, it can't be fixed.  Maybe had Sony been more competitive early on and didn't give up the edge to Microsoft in America, they would of had a shot.


this was a good point, Richard

 

but i have to say that Twisted Metal isn't selling too low. It should be able to climb it's way past 1 million.

 

It still would have been a slow burner if KB did a commercial for it but it probably would have got there faster

 

I think Starhawk was the main game this year that needed better advertising to have good legs. Warhawk was a slow burner so you could tell that Starhawk would be 1 too but it didn't get any kind of commercial time for it to take place