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Forums - Politics Discussion - Mitt Romney. 27 lies in 38 minutes.

mrstickball on 05 October 2012
SecondWar said:
Flanneryaug said:
BenVTrigger said:
Nah its not and Im not sayin Mitt is the best choice either

But I dont see how anyone defends Obama anymore. The mans a failed president, the worst in my lifetime, and is leading the slowest recovery in US history.

Im not even a big Romney supporter at all but Obama is beyond awful

The worst in your lifetime? Are you less than 4 years old? lol

Saying Obama is a failed president is just not accurate. In 4 years, with massive republican obstruction, he still got all of this done:

  • Stopped the economy from going into a depression
  • Passed Wall St reform
  • Saved the auto industry
  • Created 5 million jobs
  • Ended the war in Iraq(and ending the war in Afghanistan, though I think it should end now)
  • Got Bin Laden
  • Repealed DADT
  • Passed healthcare reform
  • Unemployment rate down to 7.8%
If you want to support Mitt Romney, thats fine. I don't agree with everything Obama supports or has done either.

Am I correct in saying that (like with the banks) many republicans opposed the auto industry bailout or criticised it after it happened? If nothing had been done the knock-on effect (espcially in the short-term) would have been horrific. Thousands (hundred of thousands to millions? not too sure how many exactly the american big 3 employs). The chain reaction on other industry and the rest of the economy as a whole as all of those workers became jobless would have pretty much sent the US into a depression.


Not all of the Big 3 accepted the bailouts. Ford didn't take a dime. Then, you have all of the other manufacturers that weren't Chrysler or GM, and they didn't get money, either.

Rather than allow them to reorganize and re-negotiate with the unions, they simply threw money at them. If they went bankrupt, the jobs could have been saved still after reorganization.



Back from the dead, I'm afraid.

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pokoko on 05 October 2012
kowenicki said:
Can anyone dig out Obama pre election records and tell me how many lies and how much he over promised and under delivered please.

The sooner people realise that pretty much all modern day politicians are selfish egomaniacs the better.

They're all the same.

http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/promises/obameter/

Not all that awful, really, depending on what you think of a compromise.  I don't believe Obama went in with a hidden agenda like the W. Bush administration had, and I don't think Romney has one, either.

That being said, the primary skill and purpose of a modern politician is getting elected.  Governing is kind of a secondary thing.



Areym on 05 October 2012
CDiablo said:
Wheres the Obama tells x amount of lies in x minutes. Surely the repubs arent above that. I want fair and balanced news.


Keep looking cause you're not gonna find it in your life time.



"Trick shot? The trick is NOT to get shot." - Lucian

spaceguy on 05 October 2012
mrstickball said:
SecondWar said:
Flanneryaug said:
BenVTrigger said:
Nah its not and Im not sayin Mitt is the best choice either

But I dont see how anyone defends Obama anymore. The mans a failed president, the worst in my lifetime, and is leading the slowest recovery in US history.

Im not even a big Romney supporter at all but Obama is beyond awful

The worst in your lifetime? Are you less than 4 years old? lol

Saying Obama is a failed president is just not accurate. In 4 years, with massive republican obstruction, he still got all of this done:

  • Stopped the economy from going into a depression
  • Passed Wall St reform
  • Saved the auto industry
  • Created 5 million jobs
  • Ended the war in Iraq(and ending the war in Afghanistan, though I think it should end now)
  • Got Bin Laden
  • Repealed DADT
  • Passed healthcare reform
  • Unemployment rate down to 7.8%
If you want to support Mitt Romney, thats fine. I don't agree with everything Obama supports or has done either.

Am I correct in saying that (like with the banks) many republicans opposed the auto industry bailout or criticised it after it happened? If nothing had been done the knock-on effect (espcially in the short-term) would have been horrific. Thousands (hundred of thousands to millions? not too sure how many exactly the american big 3 employs). The chain reaction on other industry and the rest of the economy as a whole as all of those workers became jobless would have pretty much sent the US into a depression.


Not all of the Big 3 accepted the bailouts. Ford didn't take a dime. Then, you have all of the other manufacturers that weren't Chrysler or GM, and they didn't get money, either.

Rather than allow them to reorganize and re-negotiate with the unions, they simply threw money at them. If they went bankrupt, the jobs could have been saved still after reorganization.



Ford got bailed out before them. http://www.businessinsider.com/ford-was-bailed-out-too-2010-11



spaceguy on 05 October 2012
forevercloud3000 said:
I do find it funny how Romney's entire stance on politics is kept promissory and vague. To be honest, that is exactly how Obama got into office in the first place. Make a bunch of bold promises that can't really be proven or at least have a dedicated plan to get there. This is why originally I was on board with Hilary, but then she joined his ticket and he started sounding a lot more promising. I think his run as president has been a good one...minus the Right wing spin to turn every accomplishment bad.

President Obama has done a great job putting the pieces back together that Bush left. Romney cannot change that there has only been positives since Obama's office.
-They want to talk about deficits, most of that money was already put into motion before he got there. Other amounts used for really good causes.
-Unemployment rate? Ask any conservative and they say Obama made it higher than it has been in decades. The truth? Rate was skyrocketing just before Obama took office and capped at the end of Obama's first year as his administration figured out what to do, Stopped it, and it has been in steady decline ever since.
-Lost jobs? Obama has done nothing but make jobs since his reign. The idea that the 1%, out of retaliation to Obama taxing them more, threaten to cut more jobs isn't something they can say out loud.

Romney and the entire GOP this election have literally been a bunch of clowns in suits. Bauchman? Seriously? Cain? For real america? I could not fathom a world where anyone of them could be a feasible candidate. They are so damn nutty, its practically funny...yet sad at the same time. For the first time I realized just how dilusional they were. Does Obama and the Democratic party have all the answers? No, but I assure you we will always be much better off than with those clowns.


Said very well.



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gergroy on 05 October 2012
SecondWar said:
Flanneryaug said:
BenVTrigger said:
Nah its not and Im not sayin Mitt is the best choice either

But I dont see how anyone defends Obama anymore. The mans a failed president, the worst in my lifetime, and is leading the slowest recovery in US history.

Im not even a big Romney supporter at all but Obama is beyond awful

The worst in your lifetime? Are you less than 4 years old? lol

Saying Obama is a failed president is just not accurate. In 4 years, with massive republican obstruction, he still got all of this done:

  • Stopped the economy from going into a depression
  • Passed Wall St reform
  • Saved the auto industry
  • Created 5 million jobs
  • Ended the war in Iraq(and ending the war in Afghanistan, though I think it should end now)
  • Got Bin Laden
  • Repealed DADT
  • Passed healthcare reform
  • Unemployment rate down to 7.8%
If you want to support Mitt Romney, thats fine. I don't agree with everything Obama supports or has done either.

Am I correct in saying that (like with the banks) many republicans opposed the auto industry bailout or criticised it after it happened? If nothing had been done the knock-on effect (espcially in the short-term) would have been horrific. Thousands (hundred of thousands to millions? not too sure how many exactly the american big 3 employs). The chain reaction on other industry and the rest of the economy as a whole as all of those workers became jobless would have pretty much sent the US into a depression.

its true that republicans did oppose the auto bailout.  However, to be fair, the bailout is not what saved the auto industry, the managed bankruptcy's that they went through is what saved them, and republicans just wanted them to go through that first.

You see, the Auto companies were over leveraged and in toxic amounts of debt.  The Bankruptcies helped them remove the toxic parts of the companies so that they could be leaner and more able companies.  

The bailouts may have saved some jobs (not many) in the short term, but honestly, once the companies had gone through the bankruptcies they could have hired employees back if needed.  



MDMAlliance on 05 October 2012

All these comments about how Obama is the worst president and how people who can defend Obama are blind or whatever, and the comments about "liberals" or "democrats." You guys don't know anything, and you contribute nothing to this thread. You regurgitate what the media of your political party says, or what the people around you say. As for the Romney comments, it somewhat is the same way however it's not nearly as bad as the Obama ones.

It's strange how quick people are to claim that the job unemployment numbers and reports are BS and fixed, yet most of you saying that give no source that really shows you are correct. With all things considered in this situation, if Obama were really as bad of a president you think he is, our numbers would be significantly worse than they were when he got into office. Do you guys remember all the news reports of how high unemployment rates were? Exactly.



joesampson on 06 October 2012
spaceguy said:
mrstickball said:
SecondWar said:
Flanneryaug said:
BenVTrigger said:
Nah its not and Im not sayin Mitt is the best choice either

But I dont see how anyone defends Obama anymore. The mans a failed president, the worst in my lifetime, and is leading the slowest recovery in US history.

Im not even a big Romney supporter at all but Obama is beyond awful

The worst in your lifetime? Are you less than 4 years old? lol

Saying Obama is a failed president is just not accurate. In 4 years, with massive republican obstruction, he still got all of this done:

  • Stopped the economy from going into a depression
  • Passed Wall St reform
  • Saved the auto industry
  • Created 5 million jobs
  • Ended the war in Iraq(and ending the war in Afghanistan, though I think it should end now)
  • Got Bin Laden
  • Repealed DADT
  • Passed healthcare reform
  • Unemployment rate down to 7.8%
If you want to support Mitt Romney, thats fine. I don't agree with everything Obama supports or has done either.

Am I correct in saying that (like with the banks) many republicans opposed the auto industry bailout or criticised it after it happened? If nothing had been done the knock-on effect (espcially in the short-term) would have been horrific. Thousands (hundred of thousands to millions? not too sure how many exactly the american big 3 employs). The chain reaction on other industry and the rest of the economy as a whole as all of those workers became jobless would have pretty much sent the US into a depression.


Not all of the Big 3 accepted the bailouts. Ford didn't take a dime. Then, you have all of the other manufacturers that weren't Chrysler or GM, and they didn't get money, either.

Rather than allow them to reorganize and re-negotiate with the unions, they simply threw money at them. If they went bankrupt, the jobs could have been saved still after reorganization.



Ford got bailed out before them. http://www.businessinsider.com/ford-was-bailed-out-too-2010-11

Huh? Did you read the article or just copy a link to the first google result that said ford bailout? Ford did not receive a bailout. The article argues that Ford benefited from the downstream effects on suppliers that were also prevented from going in to bankruptcy. I would argue against that as Ford's suppliers would have adjusted production accordingly and a proper bankruptcy and reorganization of GM/Ford would have kept them in business anyway. Either way Ford did not receive a bailout package out of the Obama auto-bailout.



acdcste on 06 October 2012

I am not going to pretend that i know anything about either candidate, being i live in the uk and all, but the newspaper i get yesterday had a massive article about how romney had won the first debate hands down, and how obama did not really challenge him on anything. It was most critical of how a great orator like obama spent so much time with his head down looking at his notes. It did say at the end though that romney spent a hell of a lot of time rehearsing and preparing, which obama couldnt really do due to running a country. It was an interestting article.



HappySqurriel on 06 October 2012
MDMAlliance said:
All these comments about how Obama is the worst president and how people who can defend Obama are blind or whatever, and the comments about "liberals" or "democrats." You guys don't know anything, and you contribute nothing to this thread. You regurgitate what the media of your political party says, or what the people around you say. As for the Romney comments, it somewhat is the same way however it's not nearly as bad as the Obama ones.

It's strange how quick people are to claim that the job unemployment numbers and reports are BS and fixed, yet most of you saying that give no source that really shows you are correct. With all things considered in this situation, if Obama were really as bad of a president you think he is, our numbers would be significantly worse than they were when he got into office. Do you guys remember all the news reports of how high unemployment rates were? Exactly.

The job numbers are heavily manipulated. Over the years the methodology for calculating unemployment has changed and these changes have been to lower the labor force participation rate and therefore reduce unemployment. If we calculated unemployment without these mainpulations we would get the following:

http://www.shadowstats.com/alternate_data/unemployment-charts

 

As you can see, the traditional methods for calculating unemployment result in both dramatically higher unemployment rates and unemployment that has steadily increased since 2010. The primary reason for this difference is caused because, when the long term unemployed become discouraged and "give up" they are no longer seen as unemployed by the new statistics while they were based on the old methodologies.

 

In other words, the unemployment rate has fallen below 8% because the job market is so bad that millions of people have given up on ever finding work.