By using this site, you agree to our Privacy Policy and our Terms of Use. Close

Forums - Politics Discussion - Richest Man in France Seeks Belgian Citizenship

homer said:
Mr Khan said:
homer said:

What makes you think people deserve other people's money?  Why do you think that success should be punished?

People deserve a certain modicum of dignity (or the lower rungs on Marslow's Hierarchy of Needs): namely health, food, and shelter. It behooves the whole of society also if those who are unable to participate in society are made able to participate (and also fulfills another Need), and these Needs are superior to the "right of a man to the sweat of his own brow."

Those who are able to give should give, those who are in need should receive.

Now the how of all this is, of course, the tricky part, but there is little doubt that this course of action is *right,* save by those who hold unfeasibly extreme views of property rights.

You hypocrite. Live by your own code if you believe it to be right. Seems like you don't mind giving up other people's money but don't depart with your own.

Where did it say i wasn't? I pay my taxes (pointless as that may be, because i'm in the zero-income bracket and will get everything back come April or so), and really don't have money for anything aside from Student Loans. Nor am i the type of person who the system should be assisting, as i've got help from my folks. My life hasn't really begun yet, but i've helped the system aid the less fortunate in the past (helped at adult GED company before).

Also you're treading frightfully close to the realm of personal attacks. Take care.



Monster Hunter: pissing me off since 2010.

Around the Network
Mr Khan said:
leatherhat said:
Mr Khan said:
 

People deserve a certain modicum of dignity (or the lower rungs on Marslow's Hierarchy of Needs): namely health, food, and shelter. It behooves the whole of society also if those who are unable to participate in society are made able to participate (and also fulfills another Need), and these Needs are superior to the "right of a man to the sweat of his own brow."

Those who are able to give should give, those who are in need should receive.

Now the how of all this is, of course, the tricky part, but there is little doubt that this course of action is *right,* save by those who hold unfeasibly extreme views of property rights.


How, specifically, do you intend to get him to pay this money- regardless of tax rate. Pretend I'm him, convince me to stay in France. 

I wouldn't. He's free to go, after having oh, say, 50% of his net worth seized by the State.

How can you believe this to be fair? His money is his money. Not your money. Not my money. Not France's money.



"Everything we hear is an opinion, not a fact. Everything we see is a perspective, not the truth." -My good friend Mark Aurelius

homer said:
Mr Khan said:
leatherhat said:
Mr Khan said:
 

People deserve a certain modicum of dignity (or the lower rungs on Marslow's Hierarchy of Needs): namely health, food, and shelter. It behooves the whole of society also if those who are unable to participate in society are made able to participate (and also fulfills another Need), and these Needs are superior to the "right of a man to the sweat of his own brow."

Those who are able to give should give, those who are in need should receive.

Now the how of all this is, of course, the tricky part, but there is little doubt that this course of action is *right,* save by those who hold unfeasibly extreme views of property rights.


How, specifically, do you intend to get him to pay this money- regardless of tax rate. Pretend I'm him, convince me to stay in France. 

I wouldn't. He's free to go, after having oh, say, 50% of his net worth seized by the State.

How can you believe this to be fair? His money is his money. Not your money. Not my money. Not France's money.

Because he's trying to dodge a civic duty, no different than throwing a draft dodger in jail.



Monster Hunter: pissing me off since 2010.

Mr Khan said:
homer said:
Mr Khan said:
homer said:
 

What makes you think people deserve other people's money?  Why do you think that success should be punished?

People deserve a certain modicum of dignity (or the lower rungs on Marslow's Hierarchy of Needs): namely health, food, and shelter. It behooves the whole of society also if those who are unable to participate in society are made able to participate (and also fulfills another Need), and these Needs are superior to the "right of a man to the sweat of his own brow."

Those who are able to give should give, those who are in need should receive.

Now the how of all this is, of course, the tricky part, but there is little doubt that this course of action is *right,* save by those who hold unfeasibly extreme views of property rights.

You hypocrite. Live by your own code if you believe it to be right. Seems like you don't mind giving up other people's money but don't depart with your own.

Where did it say i wasn't? I pay my taxes (pointless as that may be, because i'm in the zero-income bracket and will get everything back come April or so), and really don't have money for anything aside from Student Loans. Nor am i the type of person who the system should be assisting, as i've got help from my folks. My life hasn't really begun yet, but i've helped the system aid the less fortunate in the past (helped at adult GED company before).

Also you're treading frightfully close to the realm of personal attacks. Take care.

People shouldn't be forced to "give." And by give, I mean waste on a bloated and inefficient government. No one has the right to tell me how to spend money. It is not my responsibility to look after the less fortunate. I do not owe the destitue or impoverished a dime. Good for you. You are giving out the good of your own heart. Do not expect others to do as you do and certainly don't expect to be able to force people to do as you do. The government isn't a charity, and it should never be one. I fail to see your rationale behind punishing success and ambition and rewarding laziness and apathy.



"Everything we hear is an opinion, not a fact. Everything we see is a perspective, not the truth." -My good friend Mark Aurelius

Mr Khan said:
homer said:
Mr Khan said:
leatherhat said:
Mr Khan said:
 

People deserve a certain modicum of dignity (or the lower rungs on Marslow's Hierarchy of Needs): namely health, food, and shelter. It behooves the whole of society also if those who are unable to participate in society are made able to participate (and also fulfills another Need), and these Needs are superior to the "right of a man to the sweat of his own brow."

Those who are able to give should give, those who are in need should receive.

Now the how of all this is, of course, the tricky part, but there is little doubt that this course of action is *right,* save by those who hold unfeasibly extreme views of property rights.


How, specifically, do you intend to get him to pay this money- regardless of tax rate. Pretend I'm him, convince me to stay in France. 

I wouldn't. He's free to go, after having oh, say, 50% of his net worth seized by the State.

How can you believe this to be fair? His money is his money. Not your money. Not my money. Not France's money.

Because he's trying to dodge a civic duty, no different than throwing a draft dodger in jail

So a forced transfer of funds from the French to their refugee population. I thought government was supposed to be for the people?



ǝןdɯıs ʇı dǝǝʞ oʇ ǝʞıן ı ʍouʞ noʎ 

Ask me about being an elitist jerk

Time for hype

Around the Network
Mr Khan said:
homer said:
Mr Khan said:


How, specifically, do you intend to get him to pay this money- regardless of tax rate. Pretend I'm him, convince me to stay in France. 

leatherhat said:

 

I wouldn't. He's free to go, after having oh, say, 50% of his net worth seized by the State.

How can you believe this to be fair? His money is his money. Not your money. Not my money. Not France's money.

Because he's trying to dodge a civic duty, no different than throwing a draft dodger in jail.

The only claim the government has is the amount he owes them for his new tax rate from the time it went into effect to the time he left with his money. They don't have claim to any large portion of his wealth. Sucks he didn't escape fast enough. I hope more rich people leave countries like that.



"Everything we hear is an opinion, not a fact. Everything we see is a perspective, not the truth." -My good friend Mark Aurelius

leatherhat said:
Mr Khan said:
homer said:
Mr Khan said:
leatherhat said:
Mr Khan said:
 

People deserve a certain modicum of dignity (or the lower rungs on Marslow's Hierarchy of Needs): namely health, food, and shelter. It behooves the whole of society also if those who are unable to participate in society are made able to participate (and also fulfills another Need), and these Needs are superior to the "right of a man to the sweat of his own brow."

Those who are able to give should give, those who are in need should receive.

Now the how of all this is, of course, the tricky part, but there is little doubt that this course of action is *right,* save by those who hold unfeasibly extreme views of property rights.


How, specifically, do you intend to get him to pay this money- regardless of tax rate. Pretend I'm him, convince me to stay in France. 

I wouldn't. He's free to go, after having oh, say, 50% of his net worth seized by the State.

How can you believe this to be fair? His money is his money. Not your money. Not my money. Not France's money.

Because he's trying to dodge a civic duty, no different than throwing a draft dodger in jail

So a forced transfer of funds from the French to their refugee population. I thought government was supposed to be for the people?


This brings up another point. Why do France and especially Germany do things like this? How are the people not outraged by their government wasting their money on refugees who just suck money away from the hard working citizens?



"Everything we hear is an opinion, not a fact. Everything we see is a perspective, not the truth." -My good friend Mark Aurelius

homer said:
leatherhat said:
Mr Khan said:
homer said:
Mr Khan said:
leatherhat said:
Mr Khan said:
 

People deserve a certain modicum of dignity (or the lower rungs on Marslow's Hierarchy of Needs): namely health, food, and shelter. It behooves the whole of society also if those who are unable to participate in society are made able to participate (and also fulfills another Need), and these Needs are superior to the "right of a man to the sweat of his own brow."

Those who are able to give should give, those who are in need should receive.

Now the how of all this is, of course, the tricky part, but there is little doubt that this course of action is *right,* save by those who hold unfeasibly extreme views of property rights.


How, specifically, do you intend to get him to pay this money- regardless of tax rate. Pretend I'm him, convince me to stay in France. 

I wouldn't. He's free to go, after having oh, say, 50% of his net worth seized by the State.

How can you believe this to be fair? His money is his money. Not your money. Not my money. Not France's money.

Because he's trying to dodge a civic duty, no different than throwing a draft dodger in jail

So a forced transfer of funds from the French to their refugee population. I thought government was supposed to be for the people?


This brings up another point. Why do France and especially Germany do things like this? How are the people not outraged by their government wasting their money on refugees who just suck money away from the hard working citizens?

In Sweden they want to raise the retirement age to 75(literally working to death) in order to pay for them. There is a reason so many national socialist parties are booming in Europe.



ǝןdɯıs ʇı dǝǝʞ oʇ ǝʞıן ı ʍouʞ noʎ 

Ask me about being an elitist jerk

Time for hype

Signalstar said:
I can't believe France elected a socialist. A 75% tax rate is downright insane I don't care how much money you have. Does anyone honestly think this is a good idea?

Isn't this the kind of stuff France has revolutions over?


I don't know, worked pretty well in America through the 40s, 50s, 60s, and 70s when our top marginal tax rate sat between 94-70%. In the past high marginal tax rates would merely force CEOs to reinvest and grow their own companies rather then take the money for themselves. I know my grandpa had no problems growing and maintaining his personal wealth under these kinds of tax rates.

And no, France normally has revolutions over the aristocracy enjoying opulent lifestyles and oppressing the poor and down trodden. This is just France going back to to the tax rates they had in the 50s and 60s. Their current top tax rate before this was actually the lowest it had been since the 1920s.



Mr Khan said:
homer said:
Mr Khan said:
homer said:
I would die before I payed 75 % of my income on taxes. I wish all the liberals in the US would go there and enjoy socialism and leave honest working people who believe that poor people who refuse to work or are lazy should be left to fend for themselves and eat amongst the dogs not be robbed to pay for the incompetant.

Let's do a social experiment, then: go to the slums of Calcutta, have someone shoot you in the spine, then pull yourself up by your bootstraps and conquer that country.

I'll wait.

What makes you think people deserve other people's money?  Why do you think that success should be punished?

People deserve a certain modicum of dignity (or the lower rungs on Marslow's Hierarchy of Needs): namely health, food, and shelter. It behooves the whole of society also if those who are unable to participate in society are made able to participate (and also fulfills another Need), and these Needs are superior to the "right of a man to the sweat of his own brow."

Those who are able to give should give, those who are in need should receive.

Now the how of all this is, of course, the tricky part, but there is little doubt that this course of action is *right,* save by those who hold unfeasibly extreme views of property rights.

The problem is... everyone in ethe first world has maslows needs met on the most basic level.

 

Starvation just isn't a thing stataistically.   Longe term Homelesness research generally shows it as a case of either A) People wanting to be off the grid.  B) Mental Insanity.

And France has a universal healthcare system.

France's main issue is that government spending is 56% of GDP.... and that's the more conservative estimate.

 

As for what they spend this budget on... I dunno, can't speak french but i can show you a good graph of it.

http://voila-le-travail.data-projet.com/budget2012/#ancre

 

Spending being higher then 50% of GDP is just all kinds of problematic when you think about it.

Because government spending has to = non goverment spending taxes + Deficit.

 

To have over half your GDP be Government spending.... balancing a budget is impossible without cuts.   Just mathmaticlly, unless you tap into wealth...

Which only really helps short short term.

 

Thoughts on America aside... raising the French tax rates is mathmatically a pointless endevaor.  What's needed is massive cuts.