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Forums - Nintendo - Insane idea for Zelda Wii U. You won't know what it is unless you click.

TripleMMM said:
This reminds me of Starfox Adventures and I only watched the youtube playthrough...

@kain: I get it your preference control style, but please, you don't have to bash the moition controls.
Could've just said it's not to your liking (and I'm just starting to like this fellow ,-_-,).


Well yeah, it just isn't my thing, that's true. But I also think that most games, including Zelda, are better off without motion controls. I've been a Nintendo fan for a very long time and while I was still able to enjoy Nintendo games on the Wii the motion controls didn't make it easy. Even the games that got motion controls right, like Zelda SS, didn't make me love motion controls. For me motion contols just get in the way.



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kain_kusanagi said:
RobDX said:
kain_kusanagi said:
Catching a horse is fine and dandy, but petting it like Nintendogs?

No.

I don't want to use the touch pad to do anything other than manage my inventory. The worst part about Zelda SS was the stupid motion controls. I just want OoT controls with better graphics, voice acting, and a bigger more open world to explore. That's all. No gimmicks.

i bet that if they give you that, you'll complain that there is no innovation and that it's the same thing with hd graphics. Eiji Aonuma said it: gamers don´t necessarily know what they want

But that's all I want from Zelda. The same thing with better graphics and bigger more open worlds to explore. 2D Zelda was perfected with A Link to the Past and all the later ones were great because they just did better graphics and some new items. OoT did the same for 3D, but then motion controls came in and took it away. I don't feel like motion controls are a innovation. They've been around a lot longer than the Wii and I didn't like it back then either.

well i don´t know why you even have a wii if you hate motion controls, if all you need it´s the same game with improved graphics the you are fine with a PS360, it´s the same reason why i don´t play on PC: because i don´t like to use keyboard and mouse, but that doesn't make me go around saying that PC games suck or are stupid, i recognize them for what they are but if i don´t like what i have to use to play them, the simply: I DON'T PLAY THEM 



RobDX said:

well i don´t know why you even have a wii if you hate motion controls, if all you need it´s the same game with improved graphics the you are fine with a PS360, it´s the same reason why i don´t play on PC: because i don´t like to use keyboard and mouse, but that doesn't make me go around saying that PC games suck or are stupid, i recognize them for what they are but if i don´t like what i have to use to play them, the simply: I DON'T PLAY THEM 

Only problem with that, RobDx, is that Kain is a fan of the series. So for Nintendo to force him to use that is alienating to him. He just doesn't like motion controls. There are four options: Either he gets used to them for the love of the series, or he stops playing the series, or Nintendo gives him trad controls back, or Nintendo  gives players the option. Which one do you think is best?

Realize he's not alone in this. Others feel the same way.

What if choosing the motion controls mode allowed players to uncover techniques not found in the trad controls mode? Maybe it would be an incentive for him. But at least it wouldn't ruin the whole game for him. I think it's an easy solution for Nintendo, as it would only affect 3 things: 1) the way the sword and items are controlled and 2) what techniques are unlocable and where they are located and 3) the AI of the ennemies and kill strategy. It would even give added value to those who like both modes.

Nintendo could even feed the statistics back to themselves to get some analytics on the market for their games.



RobDX said:
kain_kusanagi said:
RobDX said:
kain_kusanagi said:
Catching a horse is fine and dandy, but petting it like Nintendogs?

No.

I don't want to use the touch pad to do anything other than manage my inventory. The worst part about Zelda SS was the stupid motion controls. I just want OoT controls with better graphics, voice acting, and a bigger more open world to explore. That's all. No gimmicks.

i bet that if they give you that, you'll complain that there is no innovation and that it's the same thing with hd graphics. Eiji Aonuma said it: gamers don´t necessarily know what they want

But that's all I want from Zelda. The same thing with better graphics and bigger more open worlds to explore. 2D Zelda was perfected with A Link to the Past and all the later ones were great because they just did better graphics and some new items. OoT did the same for 3D, but then motion controls came in and took it away. I don't feel like motion controls are a innovation. They've been around a lot longer than the Wii and I didn't like it back then either.

well i don´t know why you even have a wii if you hate motion controls, if all you need it´s the same game with improved graphics the you are fine with a PS360, it´s the same reason why i don´t play on PC: because i don´t like to use keyboard and mouse, but that doesn't make me go around saying that PC games suck or are stupid, i recognize them for what they are but if i don´t like what i have to use to play them, the simply: I DON'T PLAY THEM 


I have a Wii for the same reason, the only reason, I own and still own a N64, SNES, NES, DS, 3DS, all the Gameboys, and will own a Wii U. I love Nintendo games. Mario, Zelda, and Metroid are my bread and butter. I had lots of fun playing Mario Galaxy 1 and 2 and Metroid Prime 3 and Other M and Zelda Skyward Sword. But while I played them it was impossible for me not to think it would be better with a standard controler.

Motion Controls can't keep me away from Ninteno, though they may try. The Keyboard and mouse shouldn't keey you away from great games either.

I'm not asking for motion controls to be abandonded. All I want is for Nintendo to give me the option, in all their games, to use standard controls. If you could have your motion controls for Zelda and I could have my standard controls than everyone would be happy.



happydolphin said:
RobDX said:

well i don´t know why you even have a wii if you hate motion controls, if all you need it´s the same game with improved graphics the you are fine with a PS360, it´s the same reason why i don´t play on PC: because i don´t like to use keyboard and mouse, but that doesn't make me go around saying that PC games suck or are stupid, i recognize them for what they are but if i don´t like what i have to use to play them, the simply: I DON'T PLAY THEM 

Only problem with that, RobDx, is that Kain is a fan of the series. So for Nintendo to force him to use that is alienating to him. He just doesn't like motion controls. There are four options: Either he gets used to them for the love of the series, or he stops playing the series, or Nintendo gives him trad controls back, or Nintendo  gives players the option. Which one do you think is best?

Realize he's not alone in this. Others feel the same way.

What if choosing the motion controls mode allowed players to uncover techniques not found in the trad controls mode? Maybe it would be an incentive for him. But at least it wouldn't ruin the whole game for him. I think it's an easy solution for Nintendo, as it would only affect 3 things: 1) the way the sword and items are controlled and 2) what techniques are unlocable and where they are located and 3) the AI of the ennemies and kill strategy. It would even give added value to those who like both modes.

well i suppose the best option would be the multiple control options, but i think that in a game like skyward sword there are things that you can't do intuitively with just trad controls and i guess that mapping a whole game into two totally diferent controls schemes means no business for nintendo. I guess that if motion controls totally ruin the experience for him he is gonna have to stop playing them because nobody can force you to do something that you don't like, and if you don't like it there is no point in doing it. One example from me is that i love the resident evil series since they were released in the game cube but now that they are only released in other platforms i had to stop playing them because i can´t afford (in time and money) to have two consoles, and since i don't want to give up on nintendo consoles because i love their franchises more than any others, stop playing resident evil is the path that i had to choose 



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spurgeonryan said:
What was that horse movie from 1987?

I think that is a great idea! More freedom this time. Monthly add ons would be interesting as well. Exploration! Is key.

Minecraft/skrim the game with a few uncharted elements here and there but not too many.

yea not to much uncharted, as it is not open ended. it has the illusion of being of being so.

the idea sounds ok. i wish sky-rim would have let you tame wild horses



kain_kusanagi said:
RobDX said:
kain_kusanagi said:
RobDX said:
kain_kusanagi said:
Catching a horse is fine and dandy, but petting it like Nintendogs?

No.

I don't want to use the touch pad to do anything other than manage my inventory. The worst part about Zelda SS was the stupid motion controls. I just want OoT controls with better graphics, voice acting, and a bigger more open world to explore. That's all. No gimmicks.

i bet that if they give you that, you'll complain that there is no innovation and that it's the same thing with hd graphics. Eiji Aonuma said it: gamers don´t necessarily know what they want

But that's all I want from Zelda. The same thing with better graphics and bigger more open worlds to explore. 2D Zelda was perfected with A Link to the Past and all the later ones were great because they just did better graphics and some new items. OoT did the same for 3D, but then motion controls came in and took it away. I don't feel like motion controls are a innovation. They've been around a lot longer than the Wii and I didn't like it back then either.

well i don´t know why you even have a wii if you hate motion controls, if all you need it´s the same game with improved graphics the you are fine with a PS360, it´s the same reason why i don´t play on PC: because i don´t like to use keyboard and mouse, but that doesn't make me go around saying that PC games suck or are stupid, i recognize them for what they are but if i don´t like what i have to use to play them, the simply: I DON'T PLAY THEM 


I have a Wii for the same reason, the only reason, I own and still own a N64, SNES, NES, DS, 3DS, all the Gameboys, and will own a Wii U. I love Nintendo games. Mario, Zelda, and Metroid are my bread and butter. I had lots of fun playing Mario Galaxy 1 and 2 and Metroid Prime 3 and Other M and Zelda Skyward Sword. But while I played them it was impossible for me not to think it would be better with a standard controler.

Motion Controls can't keep me away from Ninteno, though they may try. The Keyboard and mouse shouldn't keey you away from great games either.

I'm not asking for motion controls to be abandonded. All I want is for Nintendo to give me the option, in all their games, to use standard controls. If you could have your motion controls for Zelda and I could have my standard controls than everyone would be happy.

then i guess you don´t have a problem at all, you enjoyed all those great games and in the end that's all that counts: that you have a lot of fun with them, the real problem is that we don't live in a perfect world where we can have anything we want so the best we can do is try to adapt to everything that life throws at us... and take the most fun out of it!!!



RobDX said:

well i suppose the best option would be the multiple control options, but i think that in a game like skyward sword there are things that you can't do intuitively with just trad controls and i guess that mapping a whole game into two totally diferent controls schemes means no business for nintendo. I guess that if motion controls totally ruin the experience for him he is gonna have to stop playing them because nobody can force you to do something that you don't like, and if you don't like it there is no point in doing it. One example from me is that i love the resident evil series since they were released in the game cube but now that they are only released in other platforms i had to stop playing them because i can´t afford (in time and money) to have two consoles, and since i don't want to give up on nintendo consoles because i love their franchises more than any others, stop playing resident evil is the path that i had to choose 

I understand what you mean. The only thing is that it would mean business for Nintendo, close to 3-5M more copies sold, if not more.

The mapping wouldn't require to alter the whole world, it would just alter 3 things: 1) the way the sword and items are controlled and 2) what techniques are unlocable and where they are located and 3) the AI of the ennemies and kill strategy. It would even give added value to those who like both modes.



Metrium said:
archbrix said:

Totally agree, Kain.  Nintendo did prove to be creative with some of how they implemented motion into Skyward Sword, but they also proved to me that I don't want that type of control again.  When I want to cut grass for Rupees, I want to tap the attack button, not swing my wrist left and right.  Ocarina and Majora's Mask controlled beautifully, with Wind Waker's awesome combat being the pinnacle of fluid controls for Zelda.

With all of the motion and touch control disruptions we've had in Zelda games for the last several entries, I think that a return to form with standard controls on the WiiU gamepad and the controller screen reserved for inventory/icons/maps would be "new" all over again, at this point. 


I'm sorry, if their is anything that OoT succeeded in, it wasn't its control. The battle mechanics are terrible. Its only ''find monster, stand in front of monster, press A!A!A! like a maniac''. I never had fun killing monsters in Zelda, the game could have been all about exploration and puzzle solving w/o any monsters in the entire game and I would be fine with it. The memories of Link yelling ''Ahh! yarh! waah!'' 10times in the span of 5seconds because I was spamming A!A!A! in front of a monster are still hunting me.

You don't like motion control, I get it. You like to lie down on your couch, I get it. You refuse new things even tho it's clearly a great evolution in gaming (imo), I also get it. But don't tell me that OoT and MM had great controls when it comes to battle. Twilight Princess on the other hand... That game had the best battle controls in the series (after SS IMO). If you played it on the Wii, you will complain about the waggle, but if you played it on the GC, the waggle is replaced by your so dear ''A'' pressing (and personaly, I don't see much difference between a random small shake of the wrist and pressing A). The reason why TP was so great is because you had alot of techniques and combos that were needed to kill your oponent (skull splitter, backslash, shield bash etc...). The battle system was much more complex than ''stand in front of monster and spam A''.

No, apparently you don't "get it" because I never said I didn't like motion controls or that I refuse new things.  Don't put words in my mouth and don't get so defensive just because someone has a different opinion than you...

What I said was, I don't like motion controls FOR ZELDA.  For bowling, golfing and FPSs, the Wii remote is a veritable revolution for gaming.  When I play Wii Sports I want to be up off my couch and moving around.  But no, I don't like that for a Zelda game, nor do I like it for Punch Out, either.  When you play Mario Galaxy, would you be happy if you had to flick the remote upward every time you wanted Mario to jump?  There are some people who might; I think that would be an abysmal control choice as it wouldn't be accurate at all compared to a simple button press.  However, doing Mario's spin move with a shake of the remote works FLAWLESSLY to me and I love it.  It's all about implementing motion tastefully into the game mechanics and not overdoing it.  Although, as I said before, Nintendo showed some creativity with Skyward Sword, I feel the motion was overdone.  I didn't like what the game became as much, despite the few moments where I loved striking a scorpion's claws in a specific direction or stabbing inward to strike at a weak spot.  And I'm not alone either:  despite being a big advocate for SS's controls, Miyamoto himself has admitted that they may have alienated some people with the motion.

Regarding OoT, you may be too young to remember but upon its release, its lock-on feature alone was a revolution in 3D game space.  Never before could you leap from side to side and backwards all while facing your enemy.  And you can still accomplish different sword strikes depending on how you hold the analogue stick or if you jump attack - all with just a standard controller.  And yes, Twilight Princess felt great as well, despite the waggling of the sword, simply because I absolutely LOVED the spin attack with a shake of the nunchuck.  Again, tasteful implementation makes all the difference.  In fact, I personally like TP's control better than SS overall.  Yes, the waggling was cheesy but the fact that Link can actually run while swinging the sword (coupled with the glorious spin attack) makes the game feel better to me than what they chose to do for SS. 



archbrix said:

No, apparently you don't "get it" because I never said I didn't like motion controls or that I refuse new things.  Don't put words in my mouth and don't get so defensive just because someone has a different opinion than you...

What I said was, I don't like motion controls FOR ZELDA.  For bowling, golfing and FPSs, the Wii remote is a veritable revolution for gaming.  When I play Wii Sports I want to be up off my couch and moving around.  But no, I don't like that for a Zelda game, nor do I like it for Punch Out, either.  When you play Mario Galaxy, would you be happy if you had to flick the remote upward every time you wanted Mario to jump?  There are some people who might; I think that would be an abysmal control choice as it wouldn't be accurate at all compared to a simple button press.  However, doing Mario's spin move with a shake of the remote works FLAWLESSLY to me and I love it.  It's all about implementing motion tastefully into the game mechanics and not overdoing it.  Although, as I said before, Nintendo showed some creativity with Skyward Sword, I feel the motion was overdone.  I didn't like what the game became as much, despite the few moments where I loved striking a scorpion's claws in a specific direction or stabbing inward to strike at a weak spot.  And I'm not alone either:  despite being a big advocate for SS's controls, Miyamoto himself has admitted that they may have alienated some people with the motion.

Regarding OoT, you may be too young to remember but upon its release, its lock-on feature alone was a revolution in 3D game space.  Never before could you leap from side to side and backwards all while facing your enemy.  And you can still accomplish different sword strikes depending on how you hold the analogue stick or if you jump attack - all with just a standard controller.  And yes, Twilight Princess felt great as well, despite the waggling of the sword, simply because I absolutely LOVED the spin attack with a shake of the nunchuck.  Again, tasteful implementation makes all the difference.  In fact, I personally like TP's control better than SS overall.  Yes, the waggling was cheesy but the fact that Link can actually run while swinging the sword (coupled with the glorious spin attack) makes the game feel better to me than what they chose to do for SS

I still can't understand for the life of me why they removed that from Skyward Sword.

To tie in a bit to OP, I think that horseback riding on TP could still see alot of improvement, though it was very well executed already.

The series could take cues from Shadow of the Colossus or Assassin's creed for intersting alternative implementations of the concept.