"Gameplay first,graphics after".It 's always right
I have played many games with good graphics but poor gameplay this gen,I want to see the difference next gen.
| HappySqurriel said:
Middleware reduces the amount of work required by programmers to produce a game, the vast majority of work required to produce a videogame is in creating the artistic assets ... It isn't just the increase in time it takes to create the core assets, you suddenly need far more "filler" assets and these need to be produced at higher quality, and there is no middleware that generates this content. |
But what about a game like RDR that seems to make use of alot of generic assets and is still a quality game?
| Andrespetmonkey said: Because improving how a largely VISUAL medium looks won't improve the experience. |
He was pretty clear in saying that, if the gameplay is bad, then wonderful graphics won't help, not that wonderful graphics don't improve the experience for great games.
The Avatar movie has great visuals, but it will never be a great game... because the gameplay is practically (or rather, actually) nonexistent. Graphics is one of those "all other things being equal" type of things - better graphics won't make a game better than another game that has better gameplay. But for two games with equally good gameplay, the one with better graphics will be the better game.
Iwata is arguing for more focus on making better gameplay, because graphics are more than good enough as it is, and improving them won't make anywhere near as much impact, now.
happydolphin said:
But what about a game like RDR that seems to make use of alot of generic assets and is still a quality game? |
There are ways that companies can reduce the costs, but using libraries of graphical assets would reduce the benefit of enhanced graphics
Aielyn said:
He was pretty clear in saying that, if the gameplay is bad, then wonderful graphics won't help, not that wonderful graphics don't improve the experience for great games. The Avatar movie has great visuals, but it will never be a great game... because the gameplay is practically (or rather, actually) nonexistent. Graphics is one of those "all other things being equal" type of things - better graphics won't make a game better than another game that has better gameplay. But for two games with equally good gameplay, the one with better graphics will be the better game. Iwata is arguing for more focus on making better gameplay, because graphics are more than good enough as it is, and improving them won't make anywhere near as much impact, now. |
That's a good point. I guess my post is directed at the "who cares about graphics/graphics aren't important" camp rather than Iwata himself or his comments. Good catch
Potable_Toe said:
--- OT: Simply speaking NIntendo are wrong 'innovation' isn't all that is needed to create great experiences just as great graphics aren't either, ofcourse when I great graphics that doesn't necessarily mean realistic at all, they are both important whilst at the same time just being parts of the overall experience which is unfortunately often overlooked. More power doesn't just mean better graphics capabilities but also improved lighing, improved physics, improved AI, larger game worlds and so on and that is why people desire more powerful hardware. So yes new ways of playing games can be wonderful and even welcomed but that shouldn't be at the detriment of hardware capability. The good news is that whilst the WiiU may not be a trailblazer when it comes to 'power' but it looks to be a noticable increase above the Xbox 360 and PS3 so it should be able to see improvements in all the required areas. |
Oh I thought we were talking about good videogame developers. I forgot we were talking about Epic Games.
Sal.Paradise said:
This is exactly what I would have said 10 years ago though. People forget about the march of progress so easily. I remember seeing old usenet posts about diminishing returns in the early Dreamcast era - how much further could we possibly improve graphics from upcoming 128 bit beasts! How can we expect developers to create games on PS2/GC/Xbox hardware, it's too powerful and complex! It's the same spiel every generation, difference is now Nintendo have a weaker machine to sell, so they'll be saying it too, not just forum posters. |
I 100% guarantee you would have said absolutely nothing of the sort 10 years ago. Ten years ago, the advance of graphics power had exploded through the previous ten years. Some games made ten years ago (or nearly ten years ago, on hardware that is now at least eleven years old) still have graphics that are relevant today. Not a single game whatsoever from the 4th or 5th generations had anything significant to compare against the 6th generation, though.
5th gen was inarguably the biggest graphical leap, with 6th not that much smaller a leap. The increase in graphical output from 6th to 7th wasn't anywhere NEAR as big, and the advanced SINCE the 7th gen began have been fairly mediocre. You've seen what they're producing on the 7th gen hardware now - they're producing in-game engine models and scenery that look almost lifelike.
Of course improvements CAN be made, but the bigger thing from here out is going to be increasing the amount you can show WITH those graphics (which requires mostly a larger amount of RAM and more streamlined processing, both of which are MAJOR upgrades the WiiU has over current-gen), and improving the gameplay experience itself (which is what Nintendo is addressing here).
SW-5120-1900-6153
| MDMAlliance said: People who say pretty visuals add to the experience of a game, yet bash the 3DS for the "gimmick 3D" I would like to point out how ironic that is. Also, there's not much more you can improve on in terms of graphics like you could have between the PS2/Xbox generation to the PS3/360 generation as graphics have become much closer to things where it becomes harder for us to tell the difference. Power, on the other hand, is different. More power means more capabilities, and a lot of the time power and graphics go hand in hand, but that is eventually going to go away as graphics will become as good as we can perceive it. However, new ways of gaming is almost just as important as more power to a system, and bringing both is even better. People saying that Iwata is just saying that for PR or whatever, I would think that anything anyone says in the company is PR. Sony bashing Nintendo's 3DS calling it a kid's console is PR talk. Seriously, I keep hearing the same things blathered about this over and over again. |
I'm not sure who you are referring to, since no one in this thread mentioned the 3DS's 3D or when you'd have a situation where people are talking about both at the same time. To start the stereoscopic 3D that the 3DS uses cuts the resolution in half, so really it is reducing the graphical fidelity of the games. Same goes to all stereoscopic 3D. The 3DS's 3D is cool, but it could have been better with a little more power behind the system to make up for the resolution drop and a larger screen to better display the 3D and increase the "sweet spot" size. 3DSXL is a defenite welcomed model. Anyway, to the point, I don't see the irony.
I think next gen graphics are going to suprise people because there isn't really that much to show people what those graphcis will be like. Well, aside from the various demos recently, but for some reason people seem to shrug it off like its not going to happen. If anything, those demos showcase the early less impressive graphical capabilities we will see next gen.
Before the PS3 everyone was nice to me :(
| SaviorX said: It is not only graphics but physics and animation and AI....rendering a certain numbers of NPCs on-screen. The Wii U should be a decent bit stronger than the 360, so it should be capable of staying relevant for another 6 years like the 360, instead of maybe 3.25 years for the Wii. By January 1st, 2010, Wii was pretty much dead in terms of continued support. About 1 dozen games of good standing were released that year and that was that. Despite all of this, I feel like in 2015, a large computational leap will have occurred, and the Wii U will be in the same situation Wii was...but it might still prove to be too expensive by then to matter. I cannot wait to see the GPad in action though this holiday and what Nintendo has to offer outside of launch. |
Why do people keep shitting on 2010? Epic Mickey, Galaxy 2, yes, Other M, Sonic Colors, DKCR, Sin & Punishment 2, No More Heroes 2, damn Monster Hunter Tri, Kirby's Epic Yarn?
Monster Hunter: pissing me off since 2010.
I dont believe anything nintendo says anymore, which is why I havent bought a nintendo console since the n64!
actions speak louder than words, till I see 3rd party support on the wii-u and less mario I would jump on board
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