5th and 6th gen

And when making Virtual Boy

I define fail as in them not suceeding in what they set out to do.

Then Wii may have to count as well, as it didn't disrupt the industry in the end.

ok, Virtual boy was a failure.
the rest of your post is just biased bs.

Agreed.

Yes, but a somewhat significanter portion bought it first week due to 2d Mario starvation. And new customers cant be exposed to the games without the early adopters word of mouth.

NSMBros for ds and wii sales was assisted by 2d Mario starvation (Wii one being the first in a long time on an actual home console, but less starvation because of the ds one, so it had the co-op mode going to help sales).

The lack of 2d Mario over the years has made the masses appreciate the brand even more. So sales would be higher now than if they released it regularly.

Yes, those games were bundled. Because Nintendo fervently believed that those games would sell the system. Yamauchi once said something along the lines that a game console is 'just the hardware you buy to play Mario games.' Discounting those games because they sold the hardware they were bundled with is akin to putting the cart before the horse. Moreover, even if we assume that just over half of the purchasers would have bought the game if it wasn't bundled (I suspect it would be much more), each of those titles would still outsell Galaxy.

But for the sake of this post, let us concede the bundle point. The underlying point remains: even the best-selling 3D game has sold less than the poorest selling 2D game. So why does the former get far more resources and attention from Nintendo than the latter? You ask how much higher NSMBWii sales would have been if it had more resources. To be frank, I haven't the slightest idea. But by stating that Galaxy would sell less without the resources it received, it seems you're admitting that there's a correlation between resources and sales when it comes to Mario platformers. What evidence do you have that this relationship doesn't extend to 2D mario games?

As a final aside, I do not believe it is unfair to expect Mario platformers to sell over 17 million, because the 2D ones consistently have. Of the seven games in the series, only Mario Land 2 failed to reach that height.

Are you asserting that Sony's business practices are particularly wise ones?

It was either Miyamoto or Iwata who once said that NSMB was made because the marketing department had been insisting on a 2D platformer for several years. Even if that was a joke, and I don't think it was, I find it interesting that Miyamoto himself was not part of that game's development team.

They might no longer be planning to abandon 2D Mario, but they indisputably did once upon a time.

Now I'm curious to hear what you understand to be the cause of the collapse.

Where are you getting this from?

Outside Japan? No.

So you fully admit that the game is about one thing, some players took the game in an unintended direction, and you're using it as definitive proof that Malstrom's definition of UGC is therefore wrong? What am I missing here?

"Dicking around" was UGC all along. Awesome.

Might I suggest that the reason no one else "gets it" is because your definition, or at least the application thereof, is the flawed one?

Your history is wrong. The original Playstation had a fairly modest start, and didn't take off until '97, after the N64's release.

"Nostalgia" doesn't last  for six years.

Just quoting.

For funsies.

You think the N64 and Gamecube were successes?

What you're doing is dramaticizing this. Calling one game a miracle worker simply because we have seen it happen 3 times in 30 years. Don't fool yourself into banking on the remote chance.

After all one game DID change the momentum, and it WAS SM64. It's just that everything exploded, and people were ready for new things....that weren't mario.

Mario on NES exploded because it was arguably the best game of its time. SM64 was NOT the best game of its time. It was a revolutionary game and vision, but others did it better and at around the same time.

---next point---

You don't KNOW that the sales would have been the same level as SMW...in fact, that graph is completely missing super mario world 2; aka yoshis island, which already shows a downward trend.

And no, I'm not calling the market of SMB Barren. The market BEFORE NES was barren. Super Mario was on NES. NES paved the way to many outstanding games, but Mario did not have to compete with most of them. All it had to do was be better than anything else out at the time, which it did handily. Tell me I'm wrong, I encourage you to offer rebuttal.

I can accept that, but it would all depend on how said 2D Mario game were made. Remember, NSMB was made by another team than Miyamoto's. Alot of its appeal came from a more relaxed take on the series, in the vein of Brain Age and the likes.

Had Miyamoto done the 2D Mario at the time, stagnation would have been almost inevitable.

You'd be very shocked to know that's not true. It can last for decades. Ask the very alive Star Wars trekies and their following generations.

Also, Mario, atari T-shirts had their fair share of spotlight in the world of Antic grunge:

Also remember, alot of the folks who bought this game for their kids had played this earlier in their lives, and SMB was a staple game and part of pop culture both in the US and in Japan. The one that's really shocking in all this is Europe. The fact that NSMB sells so well over there is really a shock. That could be a good argument for the intrinsic value of Mario 2D if you will. Take it as a gift.

Can't a similar argument be made for Mario Kart 7 though?

Perhaps we are missing something else regarding mario though.
Perhaps, the reason why we haven't seen another 2d mario is because Nintendo hasn't seen enough demand for it. Surely, that long period in between SMW and NSMB played to their benefit, but what if releasing too many 2d marios will simply dilute the sales of each one?
If Nintendo were to make more 2d marios, would your example above of a 5 year old 2d mario outselling a new 3d mario still work?