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Forums - Sales Discussion - Playstation All-Stars Battle Royale will outsell Smash Bros

enditall727 said:
Kasz216 said:
enditall727 said:
Kasz216 said:
Final-Fan said:
Kasz you are saying that the addition to summoning is not a major part of the FF battle system?

Not really... summoning spells really were just a tweak on red mages.

Something like Gau or Umaro would be considrered a bigger change if you ask me.  I suppose it's equal to some of the stuff i listed though... which kinda makes my point for me.


so are you going to reply to my last comment to you or not?

I... did?

Best I can tell.

no, you didn't

but whatever though..


Ah, i found out what your talking about now.  Essentially Final Fantasy 7 and the games after Final Fantasy 7 try to act like bad movies.

The ones before it tried to be like bad books or plays.   Final Fantasy 4 being argueably the most successful as the amount of symbolism and of mistakes and redemption permiates practically every character in there own specialized and fully developed way.

Most JRPGs actually try to go for an "anime series" feel as far as I can tell, your Persona's/Tales etc.

Final Fantasy has always been more of a Movie/OVA type setup, though a longass movie/OVA once they got there hands on cutscenes.



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Quite the assumption, I'm still not sure, I mean smash bros. has been around to long so it already has a reputation while Battle Royal is a complete newcomer.



           

Kasz216 said:
Ah, i found out what your talking about now.  Essentially Final Fantasy 7 and the games after Final Fantasy 7 try to act like bad movies.

The ones before it tried to be like bad books or plays.

You be a bit harsh (bad book, bad movie). Yes, storytelling in a RPG isn't as good as in a good movie or book. But storytelling in a movie is never as good as in a book and games generally have a lesser storytelling-quality. That is a different media. To balance this lack out, they offer interactivity, that's why we all play computer-games (while I also read and watch movies, but I think most here do).

And that Final Fantasy try to act like book in earlier parts and now like a movie has a reason. Enix and Square were producing visual novels before entering the RPG-genre. These roots seem to influence them until today.



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Mnementh said:
Kasz216 said:
Ah, i found out what your talking about now.  Essentially Final Fantasy 7 and the games after Final Fantasy 7 try to act like bad movies.

The ones before it tried to be like bad books or plays.

You be a bit harsh (bad book, bad movie). Yes, storytelling in a RPG isn't as good as in a good movie or book. But storytelling in a movie is never as good as in a book and games generally have a lesser storytelling-quality. That is a different media. To balance this lack out, they offer interactivity, that's why we all play computer-games (while I also read and watch movies, but I think most here do).

And that Final Fantasy try to act like book in earlier parts and now like a movie has a reason. Enix and Square were producing visual novels before entering the RPG-genre. These roots seem to influence them until today.

I don't think it's harsh.  I mean, if I called Avengers a "Bad videogame" nobody would be offended... like you hinted when telling storys like that, it's going to be inferior because interactivity gets in the way of the story creating "two sections" more often then not.

That a book and movie have different story telling ways and methods, and in general concepts, was more or less my point.



Kasz216 said:

I don't think it's harsh.  I mean, if I called Avengers a "Bad videogame" nobody would be offended... like you hinted when telling storys like that, it's going to be inferior because interactivity gets in the way of the story creating "two sections" more often then not.

That a book and movie have different story telling ways and methods, and in general concepts, was more or less my point.

What differences were you expecting? Storyline differences, gameplay differences, both?

How many differences are there in D&D anyways? Last time I checked, Nethack barely had a story.

Does Baldur's Gate change that much from iteration to iteration?

And as for p&p, I thought that those stories were invented by the game master, so how is that different from a dev making a new story for a game?

Forgive me if I'm ignorant, but this all seems desperately biased.



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happydolphin said:
Kasz216 said:

I don't think it's harsh.  I mean, if I called Avengers a "Bad videogame" nobody would be offended... like you hinted when telling storys like that, it's going to be inferior because interactivity gets in the way of the story creating "two sections" more often then not.

That a book and movie have different story telling ways and methods, and in general concepts, was more or less my point.

What differences were you expecting? Storyline differences, gameplay differences, both?

How many differences are there in D&D anyways? Last time I checked, Nethack barely had a story.

Does Baldur's Gate change that much from iteration to iteration?

And as for p&p, I thought that those stories were invented by the game master, so how is that different from a dev making a new story for a game?

Forgive me if I'm ignorant, but this all seems desperately biased.

I think you're confusing Kasz and Mnemeth.  Kasz isn't saying that JRPGs have inferior stories to WRPGs/P&P/etc. so far as I know, but that JRPGs have inferior stories to books/movies.  If he has the same contempt for WRPGs and so on, your counterargument would be nonsense. 



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My advice to fanboys: Brag about stuff that's true, not about stuff that's false. Predict stuff that's likely, not stuff that's unlikely. You will be happier, and we will be happier.

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I don't think PS all-star will do as well as Smash. Mainly because it's a new IP and hasn't been established yet. At most I think 2 million. People will probably be cautious of the game before buying. I think what it will need to be successful is content though. The original smash lacked that, but now it's loaded with incredible amounts of it. All-Star will need that Brawl level of content if it wants to be successful as the original smash I think.



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Final-Fan said:
happydolphin said:

What differences were you expecting? Storyline differences, gameplay differences, both?

How many differences are there in D&D anyways? Last time I checked, Nethack barely had a story.

Does Baldur's Gate change that much from iteration to iteration?

And as for p&p, I thought that those stories were invented by the game master, so how is that different from a dev making a new story for a game?

Forgive me if I'm ignorant, but this all seems desperately biased.

I think you're confusing Kasz and Mnemeth.  Kasz isn't saying that JRPGs have inferior stories to WRPGs/P&P/etc. so far as I know, but that JRPGs have inferior stories to books/movies.  If he has the same contempt for WRPGs and so on, your counterargument would be nonsense. 

Not at all, because if he has the same contempt for WRPGs and p&ps and MUDs, then what's his frame of reference, what is he comparing too other than movies, and if that's true, in what way was his argument valid for FFVII in defense of mnemeth?

Don't worry, I didn't confuse them at all.



And who says he's defending Mnemeth? Really he's just bashing Final Fantasy, lol.



Tag (courtesy of fkusumot): "Please feel free -- nay, I encourage you -- to offer rebuttal."
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My advice to fanboys: Brag about stuff that's true, not about stuff that's false. Predict stuff that's likely, not stuff that's unlikely. You will be happier, and we will be happier.

"Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not his own facts." - Sen. Pat Moynihan
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The old smileys: ; - ) : - ) : - ( : - P : - D : - # ( c ) ( k ) ( y ) If anyone knows the shortcut for , let me know!
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I have the most epic death scene ever in VGChartz Mafia.  Thanks WordsofWisdom! 

That's of lesser importance, my point still stands. Let's see what he says ~.-

I also happen to be a fan of the Final Fantasies from 1 to 9 (all of them), so I'm also a bit offput by his arguments :P