| Metrium said: *spits on ground* |
What's the ground ever done to you?
I was reading the OP, and I thought, "what? SSBB sold less than 1 million? If PSABR is being pitched for 7-800K that's pretty reasonable, a bit low perhaps but easily doable. But SSBB must have sold way worse than I imagined..."
Then I realised the OP was predicting 7 million+ O_o
“The fundamental cause of the trouble is that in the modern world the stupid are cocksure while the intelligent are full of doubt.” - Bertrand Russell
"When the power of love overcomes the love of power, the world will know peace."
Jimi Hendrix
To get back on the topic (sorry for going sideways), I don't think the well-known game-icons don't help too much for the sales of the game. SSB sold so much because of it's quality. That's why I think this ridicously named game can do good (3-5M), if it is a good copy and doesn't destroy the good gameplay. Add a better online, and the overall quality is good. But one thing is: such a game makes the fighters more known - and so the gaming-series it came from. Through SSB I learned about some IPs from Nintendo. So if this game is made good, it can help to sell other games.
By the way, the sales of game may be hut, because it comes out so late in this generation. Or should it be a launch-title for the PS4? In this case it can be huge (if the quality is there, as mentioned before).
| Metrium said: here are some numbers for you, therefor facts. The only games on ps3 to ever outsell SSBB (I'm counting sales on ps3 alone) are CoD:MW3 and CoD:BO *spits on ground*. This means that between ALL of your ps3 exclusive that I'm sure you loooove sooooo much, NONE of them outsold SSBB, not GoW, not Uncharted, not Killzone, not GT, NOTHING outsold it other than the last 2 CoDs. Now, for ps3 games that outsold SSBM, you add to that list CoD:MW2 *spits on ground*, GTA4 and GT5.So now, the only games that outsold SSBM are 3 CoDs, a GTA (making this 4 3rd party game) and GT5 the only 1st party game to outsell SSBM. Meaning if you hope to outsell SSBM you need to be a game from 3 of the biggest crazy successful franchises. With GT5 being the only 1st party game and it barely outsold it (outsold it by 400k), knowing that every other Ps3 first party game failed to outsell SSBM, what make you think that a poorly named and unproved new IP will? |
Your numbers are correct here, however Gilgamesh clearly said in the OP that the game would outsell the ORIGINAL SSB, so although your making good counter arguments, the original argument was never made.
| Metrium said: Finally, for the original SSB, you add to the list CoD:4, FIFA12, MGS4, and Uncharted 2. Again an other CoD and a other hugely popular franchise (FIFA is ridiculously huge in europe but for some reasons this year's title is selling awfully more than usual and I have no idea why... lol) and MGS4, making it the 2nd PS3 exclusive BUT it had the ENTIRE PS3 lifespan to sell units and despite that it ONLY outsold SSB by 60k units. So if you honestly think that PASBR will be as successful as MGS4 which IMO was the biggest system seller on the system for a while, it would still need 4 years to reach SSB and I doubt the PS3 even have 4 years left. Same result for UC2, if it gets as popular as UC2 (which I srsly doubt), consider the fact that UC2 has been on the market for 3 years, won countless of GoTY awards (something that PASBR wont) and according to today's numbers it only outsold SSB by 20k. So plz answer me this question... Do you srsly think that PASBR will be as popular and will win as many GoTY award as UC2? If your answer is ''yes'' than according to that logic it would still take 3 years (not sure if the ps3 have 3 more years to go) and I think it would also have to be bundled cause I think UC2 was bundled at some point I'm not sure. Than in 3 years, if the PS4 is still not out, after PASBR won all the GoTYs in the industry and after everyone hyped the game as being a unique experience (wont happen cause UC2 was unique at the time with its movie like action, while PASBR is just a clone) than ONLY if all these conditions applied, it would have outsold SSB by a small 20k. (I know its a rly flawed logic, but I still think its a valid way to look at things). |
I can understand the basic argument your trying to make here, but between MGS4 and UC2 releasing, the size of the PS3 userbase has increased by a substanstial amount. You can't really look at it through MGS because there has only been one mainline release of it this gen, but with Uncharted you certainly can, after the first 10 weeks, Uncharted 3 had an extra million sales compared to U2, and compared to U1, U3 has nearly outsold it!
The amount of time left in the PS3 before the PS4 comes out is a bit of a concern to legs, but the game can easily become successful in the time before the PS4 comes out, the PS4 won't come out this year, there are far too many games going to release this, and next year for that, but Christmas 2013 is at least a possibility. If with choose that launch date, the PS3 will still be on the market for at least a year afterwards and PSAS can still get quite a large amount of sales in that time.
Lastly, although your counting PS3 games to beat SSB, in Gilgamesh's prediction, he's predicting a strong 3rd party character count. Like Cloud, Sephiroth, Snake, Ezio etc. With those characters combined with other older Sony characters (like Parrappa), its possible sales could be higher than 3 million (I don't think PSAS will outsell SSB, so I'm keeping my numbers in line with that idea).
| Metrium said: In conclusion, on the entire Ps3 lifespan, only 4 CoDs, 1 GTA, 1 GT, MGS4(after being on the market for 4years) and 1 UC game(by a miserable 20k after being on the market for 3years) outsold the original SSB. And I don't see why or how PASBR could be able to do what no GoW, Killzone, Final Fantasy, LittleBig Planet, Assasin's Creed, Madden, Guitar Hero, Resident Evil or even Uncharted(except for the 2nd) could. Personaly, I think it will sell between 1.5mil and 2.5mil but I think closer to 1.5. MAYBE 3mil if its bundled. I think the name sounds like a shovelware title, and footages I've seen so far also looked like from a shovelware title (I think it lacked a certain charm and production value that SSB games have but granted they havent revealed much). Their is still a market for it cause obviously alot of Sony fans wanted a game like this for a while, but other than those guys I dont see alot of ppl who would be super interested in buying it. Maybe it will do well in europe cause it seems for some reasons that europeans are huge sony fanboys. Also, Wii U will be launching around the same time, offcaurse SSB won't be a launch title but KI:U went gold like 6months ago, whitch means that by E3 the next SSB will already be in production for 6months, MAYBE we will see a small teaser trailer (I doubt it but still possible) or maybe some screens and info. If it happens that would take alot of hype from the PASBR. |
The name isn't great, but calling it a shovelware title is a bit harsh.
I'd be quite surprised if we saw gameplay of the new SSB, that's the only thing that could reduce the hype of PSAS, as the new SSB is only going to be releasing late next year at the earliest and PSAS is looking to come out at this Christmas and will be almost certainly in playable form at E3.
If Dissidia 012 Final Fantasy taught us anything, fighting games with awful names doesn't sell quite well. And this is a prime example of that.
Judging the screenshots I saw so far, this game will be lucky if it reaches 2m. Also, why are you assuming it will be characters from other sagas? I mean, if Cloud/Sephirot, Chris/Wesker/Jill, KH characters are in the game then it's not very "Playstation ALL stars"
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Dont think it will outsell Smash Bros. But 5m is a lock if sony spend some money on ads.
It might be able to beat the original SSB but I don't think it will stand a chance against Melee or Brawl. We have to and see if it will actually be fun to play.
If it does manage to outsell the original N64 version of Smash, it'll be just barely. Mascot-brawling games don't really seem to fit in all that well with the Playstation audience, but we'll see. I'd be surprised if it sold more than 4 million lifetime.
| sperrico87 said: If it does manage to outsell the original N64 version of Smash, it'll be just barely. Mascot-brawling games don't really seem to fit in all that well with the Playstation audience, but we'll see. I'd be surprised if it sold more than 4 million lifetime. |
...how do you know this is a first!?
Mnementh said:
I didn't say the RPG-videogames are inferior to pen&paper. But pen&paper defines the area, in which the videogame-genre lives. All RPG-videogames use elements from pen&paper-RPGs, but they may use different elements. And no videogame so far captured the whole experience. And people calm down. I didn't say I dislike JRPGs (I don't) or I hated FF X. I did not like FF X enough to buy another game from the series. That's not ignorant, there are simply to much RPG-offerings to choose from. If you all say: 'OMG, FF VII is so much superior to FF X' - I might give it a try. But FF VII doesn't define the genre or is even a unmissable milestone. If you say, what else is a must play? Every Black Isle-game? A entry of the Pokemon-series? Or one of the Monster Hunters? Not to forget Dragon Quest? A Wizardry-title? A MUD? A rogue-like? An Atlus-game? A Fire Emblem or Battle for Wesnoth? A Ultima-game? WOW? Phantasy Star Online? Mass Effect? Jagged Alliance? Gothic? Diablo? I surely missed something important. You can say for all of these, that they define the variety that makes the RPG-genre. So a real player of RPGs should know them all. But nobody does. Nobody really played all these games. So a player with real RPG-cred does not exist, if you define it that way. But as a player of pen&paper-RPGs does no game of these list really surprise me in the basic mechanics. I can see where it comes from. So if you like FF VII very much, that doesn't make it a defining game.
So you didn't played a MUD, a SRPG, a rogue-like? And you say you played them all?
Yeah, sure I'm a noob toRPGs. I played them before the PS-series existed, but if you didn't play on the PS1 and PS2 you started only this generation, because no RPG did exist before these consoles, no RPG did exist on platforms beside the PS-series. Sure.... I see you are only started with the Playstations to play RPGs and it seems you only touched a little the newer RPGs on the PC. I would recommend every gamer of RPGs to play at least once a pen&paper, but it's not that easy. You need friends who want to try it too, you need a good GM, that the game-session does not suck and you need much time and preparations. But what everyone can do is play nethack - it is free and available for nearly every digital device in the world. Also you should try a MUD. They are basically available for every computer that can connect to the internet and they are free too. I can not recommend a good one to you, as I played mostly german RPGs. You will have to choose one from the list. You may not like them. Hell, if FF is the best in the RPG-world for you, you may hate this. But it will widen your horizon on what a RPG can be. Nethack: http://nethack.org/ MUDs: http://www.mudconnect.com/
|
So you didn't played a MUD, a SRPG, a rogue-like? And you say you played them all?
rogue-like?
you mean stuff like Dungeons and Dragons, chocobos dungeon,Pokemon Mystery Dungeon or Baroque? yea i play them
SRPG?
stuff like Valkyria Chronicles, Disgaea or Final Fantasy Tactics? yea i play them
MUD
i'm not too sure at the moment about the muds i've played but i played Runescape a LOOOOOOOOOOONG ass time ago
Yeah, sure I'm a noob toRPGs.
i didn't say that you were a noob. I said that anybody who just started playing rpgs this gen were noobie's to the game
I played them before the PS-series existed
yea, i started on the Super Nintendo
but if you didn't play on the PS1 and PS2 you started only this generation, because no RPG did exist before these consoles, no RPG did exist on platforms beside the PS-series. Sure....
who said that rpgs didn't exist before PlayStation's were around? okay, i see where this is going ;)
basically you want to use the fact that i'm a PlayStation Fan against me right? you are trying to create this illusion that i only play PlayStation RPGs right? so in your mind it is like this "oh he is only praising FF7 because he is a PlayStation fan" while ignoring the fact that maybe i just might be doing it because it was just simply a great game. Maybe you are trying to create that illusion to hide the fact that maybe you dont like them because they are simply PlayStation known games?
hopefully i'm wrong though, Icarus
I see you are only started with the Playstations to play RPGs
and what makes you say that? did i tell you that or did you just pull it out of your ass?
@ the top half of your comment
lets be serious for a second
everybody knows that Final Fantasy is the face of JRPGS
the JRPG is the face RPGS(this is pretty much changing now due to the WRPGs presence this gen and the JRPGs absence), Final Fantasy is the face of JRPGs and Final Fantasy 7 is the face of the Final Fantasy series
go up to a person who usually doesn't play rpgs(football,basketball player, boxer or whatever) and show them the case of an any RPG like Persona ,Evolution Worlds or a Tales Of and i guarantee you that the 1st thing they will most likely ask is "is it like Final Fantasy??"
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