Yeah, those subjects try to sell you the most horrible horror stories about Turks lol. Truth is, they're still there, they have their religion and language intact. We can't say the same thing about European colonnists who enslaved their people whereas Turks gave their subjects equal rights, many of our subjects were ministers and viziers. highest positions you could get with no noble blood in the empire.

Yeah and taking young christian children from their family and train them to fight for Ottomans and then make them burn their own villages (janissary)

Those poor starving families from the Balkans were happy to send their children to elite schools in Istanbul where they got the best training and education possible. No way did they burn villages in their own vilayets and empire, are you insane? Contrary to your belief there was unity back in the empire before nationalism showed its ugly face 100 years ago.

Those families were poor and starving exclusively thanks to the Turks. And the only education they got is on how to kill and slay most efficiently. And there are numerous folk songs throughout Balkans about mothers dismembering their own children so the Turks wouldn't take them away and how janissary soldiers unknowingly burned their own villages and killed their families.

Out of all people that were under Ottoman rule, the Balkans people had it THE WORST, they were the most terrorized people by the Ottomans, probably because of a large non-muslim population there.

This discussion is highly thread derailing. Contain it, you two, or i'll report you both.

Like I said, stupid fake horror stories. They live at the mercy of Turks, we couldve easily enslaved them and enforce our own religion and langauge upon them like the European colonnists but we didn't.

And please, stop with your lies. You dont know any history about this region at all, only from biased sources. For instance, when the Ottomans entered the region, Fatih Sultan Mehmet II gave the worlds first order for religious freedom to the christians in that area, to quote him:

on 28 May 1463, to grant safety and security to the Fransiscans. This pledge reads as follows: quote "I, sultan Mehmet Han, inform the entire world that those who posses these imperial edicts, the Bosnia Fransiscans, are in my good graces and do hereby command: let nobody bother or disturb neither those mentioned nor their churches. Let them dwell in peace in my empire. And let those who have become refugees be allowed to do so and be safe. Let them return and let them settle in their monasteries without fear in all countries of my empire" unquote. And it goes on then says "Let nobody attack, insult or endanger their life or their property, nor their property of their church

Another one about Jerusalem:

Another example from another region of the Empire is the decree which was issued by Sultan Selim in May 1517 when he entered Jerusalem, to patriarchs in and around Jerusalem. The document given to the Armenian Patriarch Serkis guaranteed all the previous religious rights and institutions of the Christians.

Do you know the Ottoman millet system? It means "people".

As for the muslim population of the balkans. Muslims were almost 50% of the population of the balkans prior to the Balkan wars. Around 5 million Balkan Turks were persecuted from the Balkans when Turks lost the wars. Another couple of millions of Bosnians and Albanians were persecuted and found refuge in Turkey because of racist attacks of orthodox xtians. My own family was persecuted from the Balkans 100 years ago.

So please, STFU when you talk about these matters and who had it the worst.

Not to mention as someone  partly of Aremenian decent it's kinda hard to not butt in about the "compassion" of the Turks.  At least the US is upfront about it and apologized about the Native Americans. (Though it took waaaay to long.)

RE: Birthrates as well, I hear the Palestinian birth rates aren't quite as high as often reported as well.  Still if it came to a one state solution I think Israel would probably just deport all the Palestinians.  Probably all to the Golan heights and then just hand the thing back over to Syria. (If they'd want it.)

It's hard to forget that the arabs biggest reason for supporting Palestine is that they don't want there refugees, as can be seen by the way they're often treated.

It was barely a discussion. There were only like 4-5 quotes, relax

A) It'd be a PR disaster... but nothing would come of it, even without US support.

As for the difference between Israel and Arabs... Jewish people are unique in that for basically all of history even going back to the earliest days of their own religious books, they've been pretty much beat up, mistreated and screwed by everyone at all times.

Probably best described by

The entire history of arab support of Palestine has been nothing but rank oppurtunism.  Originally in a land grab, and currently for political and economic issues.

It's a lot easier for some arab governments to keep control with Israel around.  Given the chance of fighting a purely selfess war where they would get nothing but the establishment of a Palestine state, I don't see one Arab government actually going through with it... outside a couple just to stick it to Israel, who had been sticking it to them.  Arab governments would turn on Palestine in a heart beat if it was to their advantage. (And have, many times before heck if they didn't Gaza and the West bank wouldn't even be under Israeli control right now.  Egypt and Jordan would be taking care of the Palestinians.).

As for birth rates, was an article i read about two years ago that used some statistical methods that showed the census didn't actually match up with the birth and death rates, and in general showed a dropping off of birth rates.  There just aren't nearly as reported births in the Palestinian territories as there are projected births.