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Forums - Politics - Wall Street Protests

I'm not surprised to see these protests around the world. People have had enough. Many have lost their savings, jobs or even homes and unemployment has skyrocketed making it tough to get a new job quickly enough. It's not like all of them lost their jobs because they were doing a bad job, it's just that their companies no longer could afford them so they had to go. That may feel unfair but that's not the biggest issue here.
The problem is that while they struggle to get their lives back on track they see how CEO's and other higher-ups gets millions in bonuses even when their companies is making losses and have to fire people! People who have run their companies into the ground or have abused their positions for own gain is getting millions in parachutes! Unlike most people they get rewarded for failing!

Sometimes the government steps in and injects money into the companies but where does that money go? On several occasions companies in that situation has later paid out millions in bonuses to the higher-ups, even though they were recently saved by the government! If an individual did that you'd call him an unresponsible idiot. But the big guys gets away with it, and that pisses people off.



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Iveyboi said:
deskpro2k3 said:
About those banks, I'd like to add my own thoughts about it. When you invest 100 dollars in a bank, they multiply that by 9 and they send it out 9 different ways. They just don't make money on the initial investment, they make it 9 times the initial investment. In other words it is fake money they printed out of thin air, and the inflation is considered a tax.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tFz1VVXsWRU

Assuming you watched this?


he explained it a lot better than I could have.



kingofwale said:

lol, Marxist system is the definition of "greed"


Greed - is an excessive desire to possess wealth, goods, or abstract things of value with the intention to keep it for one's self.

Marxism -The political and economic theories of Karl Marx and Friedrich Engels, later developed as the basis for communism.

Communism A political theory derived from Karl Marx, advocating class war and leading to a society in which all property is publicly owned and each person works and is paid according to their abilities and needs.

 

Nope, seems you have your definition completely incorrect. In fact, it seems the opposite of greed is the Marxist system.



I describe myself as a little dose of toxic masculinity.

Revolution I say, it's what's needed.



           

Kasz216 said:
Raze said:
Kasz216 said:
Basically every single article i've read on brutality has basically been proven false by bothering to check another news sites articles.

So i'm extremely wary of any claims of brutality.


Hope you're not reference checking with Fox.

Here, check this out, this is raw unedited footage from one of the protests. The truth is right in front of you.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eU9Dx0x9h4A

No largely CNN and BBC.

As for that video, uh it's not raw unedited footage.  It's been edited, you'll notice that it starts well into the police aprhending her and doesn't mention WHY she was being arrested.

Funny accusations though coming from soemone being force fed strategically edited videos youtube videos.

It's basic viral campaigning.

Provoke the shit out of the cops and then when they need to use force to do their jobs, only show that part and ignore everything leading up to it.

It's literally one of the oldest propaganda tricks in the world.   Which is why when you bother to read third party accounts of the events not tied to people directly into the movement, you see why more often then not force was justified.

 

For example the guy who got punched by a cop... nobody from the occupy movement bothers to mention that the guy tried to elbow the cop in the face first, the cop got knocked down and then sprayed with liquid that could be anything from water to a dangerous chemical compound...

THEN he punched the guy after he lunged toward him... yet all you see is the punch for some reason? 

Yeah, that's not edited footage at all.

 

For every one legitamite case there are something like 30 manufactured cases... that goes for any protest.

Did you even watch the video? It starts off earlier than that, with protestors being arrested, and its continuous footage from there on, which means unedited. How about the guy being thrown headfirst into the parked car? I'm sure he was doing a lot of harm with 2 hands on a camera that deserved being flipped over into a car. And what about other footage of a girl standing , corralled, and being pepper sprayed in the face? She was just standing there, and even if she was egging the cops on verbally, pepper spray is NOT the proper reaction.

A lot of these police are acting WAY out of line, there is no arguing that. I'm not being force fed anything, I've seen a good deal of the brutality LIVE in person. For someone talking about the other side of the story, you are pretty uninformed of BOTH sides. But, such is the way of our society these days, which is why the world's turned to sh*t.



The Carnival of Shadows - Folk Punk from Asbury Park, New Jersey

http://www.thecarnivalofshadows.com 


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MDMAniac said:
Joelcool7 said:
MDMAniac said:

So what? It's their own fault only. Why one needs to pay for their failures in life? If they want it, they still can emigrate to some fucking commie countries where they can meet their own kin and live the life they dreamed about so much there until the scum dies off. Or at least as long as they're not trying to turn other countries in their ghetto, too.


We should deport your ass to Vietnam and see how you like it. Fact is I haven't been able to find a job for over a year.


Actually I have been in Vietnam and liked the country. Very beautiful. It's quite a shame French/US/Australian forces were withdrawn back then from there while US was actually winning over the territories. What's even a bigger shame if not a crime is that it was done due to rabid commie-sponsored "protesters" so much alike those 99%ing monkeys nowadays.

As for your having no job, don't take it too personally, but if one could take forum posts as CV, possibly I'd not give you a place in a firm either. Don't take it as personal attack (because I really don't care about you or such reaction of yours at all), but you'd better take it as a reality check.


I don't take it personally that is your own opinion. I also haven't sought employment at a firm, I don't have the education required for a job at a law firm or accounting firm and so fourth.

Personally I had a career in game development or law enforcement planned. But due to finances and autism I can't be more then a security Guard/ Body Guard.

Right now I have an education but no degree. I only was in University two years and didn't get a degree. I took a lot of classes that didn't really stabilize a single career. I couldn't afford the courses I needed to get into game design and such.

As for my views. In high school I was Student Body President (only one year) and President of the Computer Commitee (Won re-election three years in a row). I also lead the debate team and after a few years I was noticed. I got nominated to go as a Page to parliament where I would work for the British Columbian Government. After a 6-month stay in Parliament I would become my mayors official assistant. However my mom prevented me from going. She didn't want me to become a politician because she does not view them with much regard. It would have also meant I would not see her for 6-months and she was not willing to let me go. As a minor I couldn't do otherwise.

But the fact is I have noticed that there are a lot of people who actually share my views and ideologies. I would never have been picked by the Government to represent the province if I was a complete moron. I wouldn't have become student body president or Computer Commity President. Here on VGChartz I take a lot of flack because I am a Christian and a Conservative but all the flack I get is soully opinion based.

Fact is I don't take offense to anything a few users online say to me. To be honest I have enough supporters both online, offline in Government in game companies in various other jobs like law enforcement. That I don't really give a crap what one user or even ten or even twenty users on VGChartz says about my political or religious views.

P.S- I do also have a lot of support here on VGChartz as well. Mostly unspoken because us Conservatives and Christians make up a very small minority. But I have enough support to know I'm not a complete moron. Plus if I did have a law degree or accounting degree then I would be just as qualified as anyone else.

No shit I am not firm material without the education. That's like telling a janitor no hospital will hire him as a doctor. Duh!



-JC7

"In God We Trust - In Games We Play " - Joel Reimer

 

Raze said:
Kasz216 said:
Raze said:
Kasz216 said:
Basically every single article i've read on brutality has basically been proven false by bothering to check another news sites articles.

So i'm extremely wary of any claims of brutality.


Hope you're not reference checking with Fox.

Here, check this out, this is raw unedited footage from one of the protests. The truth is right in front of you.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eU9Dx0x9h4A

No largely CNN and BBC.

As for that video, uh it's not raw unedited footage.  It's been edited, you'll notice that it starts well into the police aprhending her and doesn't mention WHY she was being arrested.

Funny accusations though coming from soemone being force fed strategically edited videos youtube videos.

It's basic viral campaigning.

Provoke the shit out of the cops and then when they need to use force to do their jobs, only show that part and ignore everything leading up to it.

It's literally one of the oldest propaganda tricks in the world.   Which is why when you bother to read third party accounts of the events not tied to people directly into the movement, you see why more often then not force was justified.

 

For example the guy who got punched by a cop... nobody from the occupy movement bothers to mention that the guy tried to elbow the cop in the face first, the cop got knocked down and then sprayed with liquid that could be anything from water to a dangerous chemical compound...

THEN he punched the guy after he lunged toward him... yet all you see is the punch for some reason? 

Yeah, that's not edited footage at all.

 

For every one legitamite case there are something like 30 manufactured cases... that goes for any protest.

Did you even watch the video? It starts off earlier than that, with protestors being arrested,

That was exactly my point.  It starts with the protesters being arrested.

AKA everything before that is ignored.

The Pepper Spray case by the way is the one proper incident to be upset.

It's the only one i've seen of someone complaining.

Outside that, if you aren't listening to the police and are getting people in the way "IE corraled" the cops are going to force you back with force, with good reason... and when being outnumber by 10 times or more you can damn well bet they're going to put expiedence over gentleness because if the protesters turn things violent they're fucked doing things the slow way.

Simple moral of the story?  When the police say move back, you move back quickly and orderly so you aren't hindering other peoples way.

I've been a part of more then one protest and I know what makes them orderly and what makes them violent.  Even with some of the worst police out there, it's damn hard to get yourself in a physical altercation that's unfair to you unless your activly trying for that.



forest-spirit said:
I'm not surprised to see these protests around the world. People have had enough. Many have lost their savings, jobs or even homes and unemployment has skyrocketed making it tough to get a new job quickly enough. It's not like all of them lost their jobs because they were doing a bad job, it's just that their companies no longer could afford them so they had to go. That may feel unfair but that's not the biggest issue here.
The problem is that while they struggle to get their lives back on track they see how CEO's and other higher-ups gets millions in bonuses even when their companies is making losses and have to fire people! People who have run their companies into the ground or have abused their positions for own gain is getting millions in parachutes! Unlike most people they get rewarded for failing!

Sometimes the government steps in and injects money into the companies but where does that money go? On several occasions companies in that situation has later paid out millions in bonuses to the higher-ups, even though they were recently saved by the government! If an individual did that you'd call him an unresponsible idiot. But the big guys gets away with it, and that pisses people off.

Why people are upset is perfectly reasonable (and it is shared by people of all political affiliations), what and how they complain about is somewhat moronic and ironic (posting an angry message about corporate greed and poverty on Twitter on your $600 tablet created by Apple that is tethered to your $500 iPhone created by Apple using your $50+/month cell phone plan from Verizon while wearing $1,000+ in designer clothing), and their solutions seem to be the one thing that will ensure that the problem will get worse.

Corporations and unions spend so much money lobbying the government to buy influence with it because the government has become so large and powerful. If the government didn’t have the means to bailout these companies, to subsidize these companies through poorly thought out stimulus packages, to offer wavers to poorly thought out laws, or to create regulations specifically to limit competition the corporations would see no value in buying influence from the government. By expanding the role of government and making it more powerful all these protestors would be doing is increasing the necessity for corporations to buy influence from the government and making it more likely that corporations will be bailed out in the future.



HappySqurriel said:
forest-spirit said:
I'm not surprised to see these protests around the world. People have had enough. Many have lost their savings, jobs or even homes and unemployment has skyrocketed making it tough to get a new job quickly enough. It's not like all of them lost their jobs because they were doing a bad job, it's just that their companies no longer could afford them so they had to go. That may feel unfair but that's not the biggest issue here.
The problem is that while they struggle to get their lives back on track they see how CEO's and other higher-ups gets millions in bonuses even when their companies is making losses and have to fire people! People who have run their companies into the ground or have abused their positions for own gain is getting millions in parachutes! Unlike most people they get rewarded for failing!

Sometimes the government steps in and injects money into the companies but where does that money go? On several occasions companies in that situation has later paid out millions in bonuses to the higher-ups, even though they were recently saved by the government! If an individual did that you'd call him an unresponsible idiot. But the big guys gets away with it, and that pisses people off.

Why people are upset is perfectly reasonable (and it is shared by people of all political affiliations), what and how they complain about is somewhat moronic and ironic (posting an angry message about corporate greed and poverty on Twitter on your $600 tablet created by Apple that is tethered to your $500 iPhone created by Apple using your $50+/month cell phone plan from Verizon while wearing $1,000+ in designer clothing), and their solutions seem to be the one thing that will ensure that the problem will get worse.

Corporations and unions spend so much money lobbying the government to buy influence with it because the government has become so large and powerful. If the government didn’t have the means to bailout these companies, to subsidize these companies through poorly thought out stimulus packages, to offer wavers to poorly thought out laws, or to create regulations specifically to limit competition the corporations would see no value in buying influence from the government. By expanding the role of government and making it more powerful all these protestors would be doing is increasing the necessity for corporations to buy influence from the government and making it more likely that corporations will be bailed out in the future.


Espiecally bad when you consider just how unethical Apple is compaired to most companies. They're one of the worst.



Kasz216 said:
Raze said:
Kasz216 said:
Raze said:
Kasz216 said:
Basically every single article i've read on brutality has basically been proven false by bothering to check another news sites articles.

So i'm extremely wary of any claims of brutality.


Hope you're not reference checking with Fox.

Here, check this out, this is raw unedited footage from one of the protests. The truth is right in front of you.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eU9Dx0x9h4A

No largely CNN and BBC.

As for that video, uh it's not raw unedited footage.  It's been edited, you'll notice that it starts well into the police aprhending her and doesn't mention WHY she was being arrested.

Funny accusations though coming from soemone being force fed strategically edited videos youtube videos.

It's basic viral campaigning.

Provoke the shit out of the cops and then when they need to use force to do their jobs, only show that part and ignore everything leading up to it.

It's literally one of the oldest propaganda tricks in the world.   Which is why when you bother to read third party accounts of the events not tied to people directly into the movement, you see why more often then not force was justified.

 

For example the guy who got punched by a cop... nobody from the occupy movement bothers to mention that the guy tried to elbow the cop in the face first, the cop got knocked down and then sprayed with liquid that could be anything from water to a dangerous chemical compound...

THEN he punched the guy after he lunged toward him... yet all you see is the punch for some reason? 

Yeah, that's not edited footage at all.

 

For every one legitamite case there are something like 30 manufactured cases... that goes for any protest.

Did you even watch the video? It starts off earlier than that, with protestors being arrested,

That was exactly my point.  It starts with the protesters being arrested.

AKA everything before that is ignored.

The Pepper Spray case by the way is the one proper incident to be upset.

It's the only one i've seen of someone complaining.

Outside that, if you aren't listening to the police and are getting people in the way "IE corraled" the cops are going to force you back with force, with good reason... and when being outnumber by 10 times or more you can damn well bet they're going to put expiedence over gentleness because if the protesters turn things violent they're fucked doing things the slow way.

Simple moral of the story?  When the police say move back, you move back quickly and orderly so you aren't hindering other peoples way.

I've been a part of more then one protest and I know what makes them orderly and what makes them violent.  Even with some of the worst police out there, it's damn hard to get yourself in a physical altercation that's unfair to you unless your activly trying for that.

That's where we differentiate, I suppose.  You seem to think that violence begins with the protesters, I see it as beginning with the police. Of course, to be entirely honest, I see protesting as a giant waste of time, and believe that if they want the CEOs attention, they'll follow them to their house and get their address and post it online for the world to know. Because you never know what maniac will go vigilante and hunt the greedy bastard down. Either way, it'll seriously diminish the CEOs quality of life, making them quicker to react and more willing to listen.  >=)

I support the movement and anger of the OWS protest, but this hippie/peace-loving crap will accomplish nothing.

 



The Carnival of Shadows - Folk Punk from Asbury Park, New Jersey

http://www.thecarnivalofshadows.com