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Look, you ignored everything but one thing I posted. how does popularity not equal quality. if popularity = sales?
And thus quality = sales = popularity?

Does this mean, mean michael bay films, filled with plotholes (this is objective) is of a higher quality than a less popular movie with less plot holes?



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killeryoshis said:
kickazz113 said:
killeryoshis said:
kickazz113 said:
killeryoshis said:
kickazz113 said:

if popularity equal quality then justin bieber will be the best singer ever

Oh you read the whole post already? and came up with that? Here answer this question correctly and you win

If the people who spend their money on a product doesn't determine quality. Who does?


ok so wii sport outsold halo 3 and that mean wii sport is a better quality game??? hate to say this but u need to get ur eye fix


Nice example  use a game that is bundled with the console. Now pick a game that's not bundled with the console. 

ok mario bro, that isnt in a bundle and still outsell quality game like uncharted 2, god of war etc


I'm guessing your talking about the 2-D ones. That's not hard. 2-D mario appeals to almost anybody. uncharted 2 and god of war appeal to more of a teen to young adult age. Which one can bring in more sales? Exactly. Sales is the best measuring stick to find how much quality is in a game


Last time I checked God of War was rated M. It has sex minigames and nudity.



Oh yeah I totally forgot about the most obvious example of how silly this idea is. Pornography.

If you look at entertainment in general, porn sits at the very pinnacle of everything. Movies, books, games, music, you name it. Obviously, porn has the highest quality of "entertainment" and has absolutely NOTHING to do with our basic instinct of reproduction. Nothing at all, all high quality shit right there.

...



Tag(thx fkusumot) - "Yet again I completely fail to see your point..."

HD vs Wii, PC vs HD: http://www.vgchartz.com/forum/thread.php?id=93374

Why Regenerating Health is a crap game mechanic: http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=3986420

gamrReview's broken review scores: http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=4170835

 

ishiki said:
Look, you ignored everything but one thing I posted. how does popularity not equal quality. if popularity = sales?
And thus quality = sales = popularity?

Does this mean, mean michael bay films, filled with plotholes (this is objective) is of a higher quality than a less popular movie with less plot holes?


A film is the sum total of more traits than I care to list in mere selection of camera lenses as angles of shots, let alone script.  It even includes the use of colour, music, and countless others.  Every film possesses different traits, each of which are of a different importance depending on the viewer.  If the traits in a plothole-ridden film by Michael Bay are enough to compensate for its own deficiencies to such a margin that more people will seek out the movie in spite of it than another film without such deficiencies, then yes, it is of higher quality.  I loved the King's Speech but it would have been a greater technical achievement if Birtie led an elite task force of British special ops to wrestle the crown from his brother.  Dialogue and story wouldn't have been as tight and the acting probably not spot-on, but perhaps the movie would have possessed more traits at higher levels to have grossed more than Return of the King.  But if you don't put much personal stock in the effort it takes to choreograph wall-to-wall explosions in a period piece, it won't entertain you and you probably won't buy the DVD or tell your friends to see it.  That money will be invested elsewhere.



vlad321 said:
HappySqurriel said:
For the most part I agree that sales are the same as being high quality, but that the areas that high selling products demonstrate their quality may not be what people want to be rewarded ...

McDonalds fails to be high quality when you judge it against the standard of pretentious restaurants, but how many restaurants can deliver comparable quality and consistency of food at a similar price to McDonalds while handling the volume of customers the typical McDonalds can?

When you stop looking down at the world for choosing something you believe is low quality, and start looking for the high quality elements in success, you will start to see people's choices in a different light. If you were so motivated, you could potentially use this knowlege to improve products you believe are more worthy of success.


So you are saying we need more glittery vampires and downright braindead romances in our books/movies?

When it comes to entertainment it's very simple to make something successful, and as I already poitned out you just need to appeal to the lowest common denominator in some way. However that appeal to the lcd is what reduces the quality itself, hence what you are saying just simply can't happen.


No, that's not what I'm saying at all ...

I know very little about the Twilight series because I have avoided it to the best of my ability, but I highly doubt the things people hate about the series (glittery vampires) are what makes it a popular series. From the little I know about it, it seems like Twilight was very focused on the target audience and was written in a way that these readers would identify with the main character and draws them into a fantasy that was specifically catered to them. The demographic that was picked was very large, and the fantasy that was choosen was one that had broad appeal and wasn't well represented.

While I'm not saying that the literary quality of the works are similar, it really isn't that much different to what J.K. Rowling did with the Harry Potter series.

Certainly, there is probably far more to the success of Twilight than simply how it was targeted; but I couldn't say what it is with the little I know about it.

 

 

Something like McDonalds is much easier for me to talk about, and saying that every restaurant could learn a lot from McDonalds if they desire success doesn't mean that restaurants should start selling happy-meals.



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vlad321 said:
Oh yeah I totally forgot about the most obvious example of how silly this idea is. Pornography.

If you look at entertainment in general, porn sits at the very pinnacle of everything. Movies, books, games, music, you name it. Obviously, porn has the highest quality of "entertainment" and has absolutely NOTHING to do with our basic instinct of reproduction. Nothing at all, all high quality shit right there.

...


I 2nd this.



Mummelmann said:
vlad321 said:

Do you know what servicing the least common denominator means?

You are also wrong. For example, Shakespear isn't considered good by many. Many are told he is good but are just too fucking dumb to understand why it's good. It's an idea propagated by the people of higher intelligence down to the idiots of society. It's worked pretty well too, as you can see.

Edit: It's taken many years to get the idae of Shakespeare = pretty decent down to the dumbest idiot in society.

If your goal is to entertain the greatest amount of people, they you go with the dumbest, most idiotic, most basic, ideas you can get. Inherently that means the quality is also pretty shitty. There are a few, very few, examples of something that is considered great because it's approachable by idiots, but also deep enough for more intellectual people, but those examples are few and far between.

Pretty much this.

Farts are also entertaining, does that mean that one man farting into a microphone on stage with 100.000 spectators who all start laughing is of better quality than a Metallica concert with 50.000 people going nuts in the it?

Also, Harry Potter must be the best books ever written. Actually, scratch that; the bible is the best quality book ever written since it sold the most.

If 100 000 people spent more money to watch one man farting into a microphone than 50 000 to watch Meallica, that would be an indication that the perfarter has top-quality flatulence.  But since no one to my knowledge has ever paid anything to watch that, the quality of such a performance is obvious.  See how easy it is to apply the formula to reality and hypothetical scenario?



Sales DO equal Quality but there's more to it. If the game is bundled with a console it doesn't count(I'm looking at you Wii Sports). If a game manages to sell millions and millions without being bundled with a console then yes it is a game of high quality.



killeryoshis said:
kickazz113 said:
killeryoshis said:
kickazz113 said:
killeryoshis said:
kickazz113 said:

if popularity equal quality then justin bieber will be the best singer ever

Oh you read the whole post already? and came up with that? Here answer this question correctly and you win

If the people who spend their money on a product doesn't determine quality. Who does?


ok so wii sport outsold halo 3 and that mean wii sport is a better quality game??? hate to say this but u need to get ur eye fix


Nice example  use a game that is bundled with the console. Now pick a game that's not bundled with the console. 

ok mario bro, that isnt in a bundle and still outsell quality game like uncharted 2, god of war etc


I'm guessing your talking about the 2-D ones. That's not hard. 2-D mario appeals to almost anybody. uncharted 2 and god of war appeal to more of a teen to young adult age. Which one can bring in more sales? Exactly. Sales is the best measuring stick to find how much quality is in a game


Super Mario 2 is the highest rated game this generation. So in that case it is a better quaility game than uncharted and GOW and sold better lol.



vlad321 said:
HappySqurriel said:
For the most part I agree that sales are the same as being high quality, but that the areas that high selling products demonstrate their quality may not be what people want to be rewarded ...

McDonalds fails to be high quality when you judge it against the standard of pretentious restaurants, but how many restaurants can deliver comparable quality and consistency of food at a similar price to McDonalds while handling the volume of customers the typical McDonalds can?

When you stop looking down at the world for choosing something you believe is low quality, and start looking for the high quality elements in success, you will start to see people's choices in a different light. If you were so motivated, you could potentially use this knowlege to improve products you believe are more worthy of success.


So you are saying we need more glittery vampires and downright braindead romances in our books/movies?

When it comes to entertainment it's very simple to make something successful, and as I already poitned out you just need to appeal to the lowest common denominator in some way. However that appeal to the lcd is what reduces the quality itself, hence what you are saying just simply can't happen.

Let's see...there's Anne Rice, the Buffy and Angel romance, True Blood...Twilight is hardly an original concept and the demand for it does indicate that more is needed.  Which is why there's now Being Human, The Vampire Diaries...the audience is out there.  Just because you don't have any need for it doesn't mean that the audience doesn't exist.  Boiling it all down to "appealing to the lcd" is just a pretentious way of trying to dehumanize people based on their interests.