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o_O.Q on 19 July 2011



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o_O.Q on 19 July 2011

double post



Porcupine_I on 19 July 2011
padib said:
Porcupine_I said:
padib said:
Porcupine_I said:

the thing is, it seems i can have a civilized conversation with you, and that makes me much more inclined to respect your believes. do you see what i mean?

For sure. And I respect the points of view of alot of other people so much more when it's done with honest respect. But I worked so much at this man. I just moved to a new city last August, none of my family lives here. I changed living places 3 times, had a devastating rebound relationship and now I live on the most versatile street in the city, where parties go on day in day out, and I'm loving it. But to be able to do all that and cope you need to be able to take people as they are and stand your ground only on the essential points and where I can make a lasting difference and grow my friendships. If that part of my personality I can share with you, I did more than what I hoped for.

The most important part in these topics, even the joke ones, is the ability to joke about one's self (me in this case), and when joking of another it's really important to do it with care because you don't want to offend. If there was a thread moking atheism, out of respect for some of you I probably wouldn't join in the party. Then again if I built enough trust with the closest ones I would give myself the liberty to poke fun, but never as a wayto degrade or hurt them.

And it takes lots of patience with yourself and with your peers. That's key.

you know that sounds to me, like you saying i offended someone but player did not? it was not me who carried the insults into this thread. maybe you should talk to him about this?

No, I think you're right. Ido think he may have offended ASS, mind you ASS said he had no prob with what player said. Then again, you can say sticks and stones may break my bones, but it still hurts.

I was actually hoping to hit two birds with one stone there. Encourage one side to offend me less by comparing Christianity to a joke religion and encourage player to be more conducive to a civil and friendly conversation.

Sorry if I sounded biased there. Keep in mind, I'm replying to you but he's reading each one of these posts :)

do you think players initial post was justified?



“It appeared that there had even been demonstrations to thank Big Brother for raising the chocolate ration to twenty grams a week. And only yesterday, he reflected, it had been announced that the ration was to be reduced to twenty grams a week. Was it possible that they could swallow that, after only twenty-four hours? Yes, they swallowed it.”

- George Orwell, ‘1984’

Vetteman94 on 19 July 2011
padib said:
Vetteman94 said:
padib said:
Player1x3 said:

And hate? Wow, you need to learn the true meaning of the word hate, and how big that word is actually. I do not, even in the slightest bit of way shape or form hate you or him.

I'll speak for myself here. I don't hate him one single bit, I actually feel sorry for him. But the truth is, the attitude of disrespect towards religion by him, and towards Christianity by some here is something I find unacceptable.

You cannot disrespect by age, race, gender, religion or sexual orientation. You can tease maybe, but not disrespect. It should be considered offensive. It's not because I'm Christian that you have more leeway to step on my basics rights of freedom of belief. If you advocate for his freedom of belief, you fail to realize that the purpose of his religion is that of mockery. Churchgoers of pastafarianism are almost all proclaimed atheists (realize this isn't the first time I see this article). In other words there is no legitimate belief there, it is fake, because by definition an atheist does not believe in anything metaphysical. Their deity, the flying spaghetti monster, is not an entity in which they profess to believe other than with vain words that they themselves do not even believe. The point is to show that belief is absurd, and that in and of itself is not a belief. A practice yes, but not a belief. There is no faith involved there, and so they do not fit in the category advocating freedom of belief. They fit in the basic category of freedom of expression, but that, as many of us know, has been over-used for evil purposes. There is a saying that says "The freedom of one's rights is the infringement of those of another." Don't infringe on my freedom if you have no right to.

Also, why is BBC so interested in broadcasting this kind of thing? I really don't trust them at all. If you're for doing things the right way and keeping away from religious bias, at least be neutral and keep away from anti-religious bias. Anything else is a position of hypocrisy.

You claim there should be no disrespect for religious beliefs,  yet you make no comment of the disrespect for Atheists?  

Also you claim you feel sorry for this person, Why?   What is there to feel sorry for?

You're missing the heart of my post. I never encourage anyone to be disresepctful towards Atheists. However, I was making the case that pastafarianism (and yes saying it does make me smile) is not a serious position of faith and does not fall into a category that can call on freedom of belief. But I don't want to repeat that please. Again, even then, there is still no reason for anyone to be disrespectful to a person in a position of atheism, that's their personal belief.

Now, I feel sorry for the guy because I feel like he's wasting his time and ours. Apart from the few giggles here and there (which I very much enjoy), the problem is that there is an underlying tone of serious in the matter, in that it leads to ridicule of other positions of faith. That, right there, is where it becomes vain and source of my sense of pity, where it gets pathetic.

Well I guess we wil have agree to disagree on that



Vetteman94 on 19 July 2011
o_O.Q said:

LOL,  I love that photo



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o_O.Q on 19 July 2011
padib said:
Porcupine_I said:

do you think players initial post was justified?

You're refering to "What an obssesive depressed asshole".

Well, I don't have the same view on the matter.

Then again, player is free to express that, as the guy in the article is probably related noone on this forum, so nobody should really be offended. But, then again some people associate to the guy's aim (to ridicule religion and the legal system), so it wasn't the smartest thing to do. He called for war, that's what he got :). Then again that's a 2-nd level at that point and I don't think should be considered offensive to posters.

Plus, the guy is offensive towards player's religion, so player is just reacting like anyone else would: to retaliate.

how? by choosing spaghetti over his religion?



o_O.Q on 19 July 2011
padib said:

lol, no. see my prior post. http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=4146841
Don't claim freedom of religion on pastafarianism, it's a religion none of its participants sincerely believe in, and has as aim to ridicule other forms of religion.

By ridiculing religion, religious people can feel offended. It goes without saying...


even if that were the case think for a minute... don't you think that it may be possible for whatever reason that these same people may find christianity offensive and as a result are using this to protest?... if that were the case shouldn't they have the right to do so?



Porcupine_I on 19 July 2011
padib said:
Porcupine_I said:

do you think players initial post was justified?

You're refering to "What an obssesive depressed asshole".

Well, I don't have the same view on the matter.

Then again, player is free to express that, as the guy in the article is probably related noone on this forum, so nobody should really be offended. But, then again some people associate to the guy's aim (to ridicule religion and the legal system), so it wasn't the smartest thing to do. He called for war, that's what he got :). Then again that's a 2-nd level at that point and I don't think should be considered offensive to posters.

Plus, the guy is offensive towards player's religion, so player is just reacting like anyone else would: to retaliate.

yes, he is absolutely free to express his feelings, but he should also be able to handle the backlash if he chooses to do so. you may dismiss pastafarian as a joke religion, but it is the expression of a believe nonetheless and not only religious people can be offended.

and another thing! respect needs to be earned it is not something that can be demanded. if he wants his faith to be respected he should act accordingly!



“It appeared that there had even been demonstrations to thank Big Brother for raising the chocolate ration to twenty grams a week. And only yesterday, he reflected, it had been announced that the ration was to be reduced to twenty grams a week. Was it possible that they could swallow that, after only twenty-four hours? Yes, they swallowed it.”

- George Orwell, ‘1984’

o_O.Q on 19 July 2011
padib said:
That's a solid question. The question I'll ask back to you (constructively of course) is, why make innocent people pay for the crimes of others. For those who have used religions as a means to intimidate, mock, repress or abuse, why do the others have to take the hit? We're already repressed, if atheism is rooted in critical thinking, go that far and let it lead you to greater understanding. Avoid falling in the pit of ignorance that leads other groups into oppression. "Be the better man" :)

interesting... barring the possibility that these people don't care about offending "innocent people" how in this situation therefore would you have gone about protesting differently so as to not offend the "innocent people"



Rath on 19 July 2011
padib said:

lol, no. see my prior post. http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=4146841
Don't claim freedom of religion on pastafarianism, it's a religion none of its participants sincerely believe in, and has as aim to ridicule other forms of religion.

By ridiculing religion, religious people can feel offended. It goes without saying...

 

No you have it's aims wrong. It was created in response to people claiming that creationism should be taught in class by bringing an absurd and equally unprovable claim from a religion that was clearly absurd and then saying that that should also be taught. It's not really meant to ridicule - it's meant to be an absurd religion by which religious rights and the limitations on religion in public life can be measured.