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Forums - Gaming - 3 reasons why to NOT buy a new 3DTV for gaming.

Slimebeast said:

It's shocking this slow fps thing because I thought that was the main thing for these 3D-TVs - to produce a high fps in contrast to regular flat screen TVs.

Well screen pannel fps is high (100-240 hz) but input is still the same spec as HDMI 1.3.

So its limited by data input bandwith ...

The reason why monitors can do 120 hz @ 1080p input is because they use a custom made DVI cable/monitor plug.

Edit - I think the reason why you are being confused with these low fps specs is because these new 3D TVs work a little differently. The use what its called "frame packing" format which contains both screens in the single frame.

This is what the HDMI 14. TVs support

- frame packing 1080p 24Hz for BluRay 3D (two full resolution images sent together in one double-size frame separation blanking)

- frame packing 720p 50/60Hz for 3D gaming (two full resolution images sent together in one double-size frame separation blanking)

- side by side 720p/1080i/1080p 50/60Hz for 3D Broadcasts (two half resolution images compressed horizontally to fit within one single standard size frame)

- Top and bottom 720p/1080i 50/60Hz for 3D Broadcasts (two half resolution images compressed vertically to fit within one single standard size frame)



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disolitude said:
Bokal said:

Ok... so basically I wait till killzone 3 is released.

Other points are... meh...

1. 1080p... not so many games run in native 1080p anyway... but yea, ok, not so future proof... nothing is.

2. Content will come as soon as 3D movies from the theaters will come to blurays... And yes, I'll wait till killzone 3

3. Nvidia what? who cares? 1/5000? It still can show the content from my comp in 2D? fine.

lol, killzone 3 solves all. Very uneducated post. -1

1. 1080p on consoles is a challenge. However 100s of PC games are playable at 1080p in 3D already. Games like Metro 2033, Gears of War, Resident Evil 4, GTA4, Battlefield BC2, Batman: Arkham asylum all look mindblowing at 1080p 3D. The new 3000 dollar TV can not play them at this resolution while 2 year old 300 dollar 22 inch monitors can. Thats pretty sad if you ask me...

2. Content thats out now which works with these TVs is mediocre at best, in 3D quality and content quality. It will take a good timeframe to get many things worth watching or playing. Why not wait and buy the TVs for less money...

3. Nvidia has beein doing 3D strereoscopic gaming since 1997 if I remember correctly. Thats a shitload of games you can play in 3D. Also by having 3D work on your PC you can enjoy 100s of user made 3D videos, youtube 3D, pictures and cool things like google earth in 3D. This alone is the only reason one should buy a 3D TV at the moment.

Then name your post correctly like "Why not buy YET a 3DTV for PC gaming"...

But you're right, yet there is no reason to buy one to play with console, or even to watch movies... it's only for early adopters... YET.
That's why, yes, I'll wait for killzone 3 to buy a 3DTV set. By then, the price will have decreased and more content will be available.

And I will enjoy 3D gaming on tv. But not PC gaming (and I really couldn't care less)... and not yet.


I confirm my "meh" about your post.



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disolitude said:
Slimebeast said:

It's shocking this slow fps thing because I thought that was the main thing for these 3D-TVs - to produce a high fps in contrast to regular flat screen TVs.

Well screen pannel fps is high (100-240 hz) but input is still the same spec as HDMI 1.3.

So its limited by data input bandwith ...

The reason why monitors can do 120 hz @ 1080p input is because they use a custom made DVI cable/monitor plug.

Edit - I think the reason why you are being confused with these low fps specs is because these new 3D TVs work a little differently. The use what its called "frame packing" format which contains both screens in the single frame.

This is what the HDMI 14. TVs support

- frame packing 1080p 24Hz for BluRay 3D (two full resolution images sent together in one double-size frame separation blanking)

- frame packing 720p 50/60Hz for 3D gaming (two full resolution images sent together in one double-size frame separation blanking)

- side by side 720p/1080i/1080p 50/60Hz for 3D Broadcasts (two half resolution images compressed horizontally to fit within one single standard size frame)

- Top and bottom 720p/1080i 50/60Hz for 3D Broadcasts (two half resolution images compressed vertically to fit within one single standard size frame)

So bottom line the problem is not the blu-ray capacity, its the 720p in 3d gaming that is the problem (no 1080p 3d-gaming)?



Slimebeast said:
disolitude said:
Slimebeast said:

It's shocking this slow fps thing because I thought that was the main thing for these 3D-TVs - to produce a high fps in contrast to regular flat screen TVs.

Well screen pannel fps is high (100-240 hz) but input is still the same spec as HDMI 1.3.

So its limited by data input bandwith ...

The reason why monitors can do 120 hz @ 1080p input is because they use a custom made DVI cable/monitor plug.

Edit - I think the reason why you are being confused with these low fps specs is because these new 3D TVs work a little differently. The use what its called "frame packing" format which contains both screens in the single frame.

This is what the HDMI 14. TVs support

- frame packing 1080p 24Hz for BluRay 3D (two full resolution images sent together in one double-size frame separation blanking)

- frame packing 720p 50/60Hz for 3D gaming (two full resolution images sent together in one double-size frame separation blanking)

- side by side 720p/1080i/1080p 50/60Hz for 3D Broadcasts (two half resolution images compressed horizontally to fit within one single standard size frame)

- Top and bottom 720p/1080i 50/60Hz for 3D Broadcasts (two half resolution images compressed vertically to fit within one single standard size frame)

So bottom line the problem is not the blu-ray capacity, its the 720p in 3d gaming that is the problem (no 1080p 3d-gaming)?

Its HDMi bandwith capacity thats the problem.

HDMI 1.4 is still single link...and it doesn't have enough bandwith to do 1080p@60hz in 3D that these TVs require

Essentially when I say 1080p@60 for these TVs...its 2x 1920x1080 (top and bottom) 60 times per second. 2 1080p images 60 times per second  =  120 hz...and the cable can not process that bandwith.

Bluray is this resolution but only 24 times per second so that is fine.

TV's can do it, but the plug cant provide it. Kinda sad...



disolitude said:
Slimebeast said:
disolitude said:
Slimebeast said:

It's shocking this slow fps thing because I thought that was the main thing for these 3D-TVs - to produce a high fps in contrast to regular flat screen TVs.

Well screen pannel fps is high (100-240 hz) but input is still the same spec as HDMI 1.3.

So its limited by data input bandwith ...

The reason why monitors can do 120 hz @ 1080p input is because they use a custom made DVI cable/monitor plug.

Edit - I think the reason why you are being confused with these low fps specs is because these new 3D TVs work a little differently. The use what its called "frame packing" format which contains both screens in the single frame.

This is what the HDMI 14. TVs support

- frame packing 1080p 24Hz for BluRay 3D (two full resolution images sent together in one double-size frame separation blanking)

- frame packing 720p 50/60Hz for 3D gaming (two full resolution images sent together in one double-size frame separation blanking)

- side by side 720p/1080i/1080p 50/60Hz for 3D Broadcasts (two half resolution images compressed horizontally to fit within one single standard size frame)

- Top and bottom 720p/1080i 50/60Hz for 3D Broadcasts (two half resolution images compressed vertically to fit within one single standard size frame)

So bottom line the problem is not the blu-ray capacity, its the 720p in 3d gaming that is the problem (no 1080p 3d-gaming)?

Its HDMi bandwith capacity thats the problem.

HDMI 1.4 is still single link...and it doesn't have enough bandwith to do 1080p@60hz in 3D that these TVs require

Essentially when I say 1080p@60 for these TVs...its 2x 1920x1080 (top and bottom) 60 times per second. 2 1080p images 60 times per second  =  120 hz...and the cable can not process that bandwith.

Bluray is this resolution but only 24 times per second so that is fine.

TV's can do it, but the plug cant provide it. Kinda sad...

Well they have more input plugs other than HDMI dont they? I mean at least a Samsung at this price should.

Like, a DVI port in the TV so I can hook up my PC through the GPU. Is that possible? That way i could play PC 3-d gaming through a nice big widescreen. Cos Im not believe in 3-d through consoles this gen anyway, its a marginal thing due to hardware limitations.



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So why not get a Panasonic?







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Slimebeast said:

Well they have more input plugs other than HDMI dont they? I mean at least a Samsung at this price should.

Like, a DVI port in the TV so I can hook up my PC through the GPU. Is that possible? That way i could play PC 3-d gaming through a nice big widescreen. Im not believe in 3-d through consoles this gen anyway, its a marginal thing.

They have more ports, but none of them allow for 3D.HDMi is the highest bandwith port and its the only one that allos for 3D on the new TV's. 3D option is gone if you try VGA port... All the 3d standardization centers around the HDMI port.

The reason why 3D vision monitors can do 1080p in 3D is because they have dual link DVI cable and port on the back. This is the same port which is used for 2560x1600 gaming on really high end monitors and needs a custom cable.



pbroy said:

So why not get a Panasonic?


Same problems as samsung TVs...



disolitude said:

 

I was close to buying a 50 inch Samsung 3D plasma last week. I did lots of research on forums, reading manuals, and talking to people. I've come to the conclusion that gamers should avoid these new 3D TVs like the black plague for now.  Here is why...

1. No 1080p gaming in 3D - That's right, the "Full HD 3D" on the box is pure marketing rubbish as it only applies to Bluray playback.

The new 3D TVs can accept 1920x1080 @24 frames per second stereoscopic 3D or only 720p @ 50/60 frames per second. According to HDMI 1.4 spec, 1080p does not work at more than 24 frames per second. Therefore blurays can work in 3D @ 1080p as they run at 24 fps but gaming and TV shows will never be able to run at 1080p 3D on these new 3D TVs (even when using a more capable system in the future like PC or PS4)

2. Content - Content isn't available and what is available isn't very good.

The few blurays which are available have questionable 3D effects since they were converted post filming. I also got to watch the World Cup final recording in 3D on my current 3D TV and it really doesn't add anything to the experience. 2D to 3D conversion has never produced great results.  As far as gaming, PS3 has some games you can play in 3D, but we all know that the technology will be much more impressive once native 3D gaming experiences come out, such as Killzone

3. Compatibility  -   TV's don't work with your PC using Nvidia 3D vision yet.

You see Nvidia 3D vision works at true 120 hz via custom DVI cable and these TVs can't accept that signal over HDMI 1.4. Also the fact that each TV manufacturer is providing their own exclusive set of glasses with the tv doesn't allow for 3rd part glasses to be used. This locks out any existing 3D technology one may own. Nvidia is working on a fix for both issues... Most of the 3D content today is found on the PC, such as Youtube 3D and over 400 3D compatible games and until that works, these TVs have no use.

 

There are many other resons such as price, and 1-2  year old 3D TV display technology which is cheaper and in some cases works better, but these are the main reasons why I did not by the Samsung 3D TV.

Considering that gaming on these 3D TVs is going to be locked at 720p, one must wonder if they should bother buying a 3D TV at all. They are bound to release a true 1080p@60 hz 3D TV in the foreseeable future. I mean, Asus are releasing a true 120 hz 1080p 27 inch 3D monitor for the PC shortly.

I'm pretty sure my Bravia accepts 1080p 3D at 120hz.



@Disolitude

 

I was thinking maybe I buy this new 27 inch Asus 3D Screen before I buy a real 3D TV.

But its impossible to use it with the PS3 isnt it ?