I see you're falling for the hardcore vs casual separation of gamers propagandized by the industry. There are no "hardcore" and "casual" gamers, only gamers.

Motion controls have little to do with a game's success. It is the type of gameplay, ie arcade style gameplay like that found in Mario Kart and Wii Sports that brings a game success.

And in regards to the bold, NSMB Wii and Mario Kart can actually be quite difficult. More difficult than most HD games I have played. Try play with 4 people through world 2 or above in NSMB Wii, it's pure chaos. Or try getting through the special stages while getting all 3 secret coins. Nothing about them is dumbed down at all.

selnor kinect is expensive for ps eye move which is almost the same thing its 50$ more expensive, i really wonder how much profit ms are making.

oh and ms said that they are pricing it competitively well it looks like they priced it according to their charts :P

Thats not 2 players. And does not allow you to play all Move games. 

You need to add £50 for the analog controller parts. Which you need to be able to experience all PS Move games.

Yes you can play some games without, but the point is with Kinect you have the full experience right out of the box for £129. You can have a gimped PS Move for around the same price or a full Move experience for £180 Amazon or £189 high street. 

It's only £25 not 50, as you don't need 2 analog controllers as for at least one you can substitute the DS3.

We also don't know how many games will require the extra analog controller. I have a Wii with 2 Wii-motes and a single nun-chuck and for most MP games I get by, and for others I usually have someone bring an extra nun-chuck.

Like I said, the ENTRY price for most current PS3 owners (even for 2 players for the reasons stated above) is far cheaper and people will see that. Won't neccessarily mean Move will do better (I actually think Kinect will do better), but the entry price is very important and Move is essentially cheaper.

As far as I'm aware no announcement has been made to have a Move bundle with Sports Champions or any other full game. Perhaps they're relying on older games being patched to feature Move support to sell early copies? I think when PS1 was released in the UK it only had a demo disc bundle too.

There's one error in logic here.

The game with such bundles will drop to 18 pounds or less in UK online retailers offers in a month or two.

This is the same kind of logic that actually attempts to "applaud" the $150 MSRP of Kinect.

While it would be a bit pointless to ship the camera without any sort of software to showcase how it works, if you asked 100 potential buyers if they'd rather just buy the camera for $99 and spend the $50 difference on ANY Kinect game of their choosing... It doesn't take a market analyst to guess what the majority answer would be.

Kinect Adventures is essentially the equivalent of Wii Play, which amounted to a $10 game with the included controller.

As for the whole issue of ignoring the two active player limitation (believable considering each player can only have up to 20 joints being tracked according to the MS data sheet); don't. It's definitely an issue if Kinect is supposed to be the ultimate family/party game peripheral.

BTW, 20 joints per player isn't much (any character rig created in Maya with only 20 joints for example, would be a very basic model with limited animation), not that this limitation should prevent developers from producing acceptable results, but for those who were under the impression that Kinect would be able to detect intricate finger gestures in games; looks like you're out of luck unless fingers are the only thing a particular game engine is designed to track (at two joints per finger).

It just seems to me that the more formal information MS releases (clothing limitations, number of active players, amount of space required, etc), the further away Kinect seems be from the Project Natal concept reels from E3 2009. It's really going to be up to the games once you get past the smoke and mirrors of how Kinect works in reality.

I don't think so, that's harder to grasp for the casual folks

By the way, Microsoft Kinect doing outstanding on pre-orders see here, even the old Xbox is outclassing Wii. Move is somewhere close to #250. Does that not mean that Microsoft priced it just right?

Wow, the thread of page long responses.

TBH looking at all the pricing and functions I'd say the Wii remains the most cost effective if you want motion control gaming and it has the largest library (of course) at this point plus the most rounded features if you rope in the Wii Fit.

Kinect on its own is way to high - but the bundle seems okay.  Looks to me like MS are banking on existing owners being loyal and snapping it up for a premium to help cover a lower cost bundle for new consumers.

Move pricing and hype right now is just blank IMHO.  I think that, technically, for games Move is actually the best tech out of all three (i.e. including Wii) but right now it's releasing just like another peripheral and it's just not generating the attention needed to do better.  Particularly in the US and the UK Sony need to spend more on marketing and hype building or they're going to see Kinect do better on sheer hype alone.

I think Kinect will sell well, at least initially, but depending upon how they fill out the library I think it may then drop off a bit vs the hype growth the Wii saw initially unless something from the initial launch turns out to be Kinect's Wii Sports.