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Forums - Sales Discussion - Its time to admit it. PS3 will NEVER overtake 360.

miqdadi on 07 July 2010

In the USA I am sure the PS3 will not catch  360 , It's over there , If I owned a 360 I don't need a PS3 , the games are one and the same , I don't remember seeing two similar consoles in my gaming history , OK U can't play gran turismo (U got Forza) U can't play Killzone (U have Halo) this is not much of a big differance .

The only bright side I see is Blue-Ray support by PS3 (U can purchase a Blue-ray machine still) , Had microsoft choosed to support HD-DVD then it would't have died and Toshiba would be still fighting for it's market share till date.

Anyway in Europe we will have to see if The price cut will change the market there because the PS3 is leading there , The gap has shrunk to 5 Million because of Europe & Japan market.



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Mr Puggsly on 07 July 2010
Solid_Snake4RD said:
Mr Puggsly said:

4) Unlikely, but we'll see.

how is it unlikely?,they are already making profit.

5) I wonder how much they'll make off Bluray royalties. Was it worth making the PS3 a disaster?

do you even have any idea what you can make from a formaty royalties.the losses made by the PS3 will be easily wiped out

Were the standard DVD royalties that worthless?

they weren't worthless but they were dying and slowly decreasing in amount to as DVD forum cuts the royalty fees to continue demand

and if they didn't go with BLU-RAY then HD-DVD would have won and they  would have got nothing.

but now they are getting both DVD and BLU-RAY royalties

How long is it gonna take for Bluray to be the dominant media for movies and video games? Sony took a big risk, when will it be worth it?

it will be a dominant format next gen like the DVD when its cheap and with PS4 it will be cheap 

SONY took a risk depending on the PS brand being able to push BLU-RAY and they were succesfull

6) Nobody said it didn't have value. But Sony hurt the brand with this PS3 disaster. Its been a step down, not a step up.

SONY hurt the brand but the brand isn't dead.its still competing very much at a higher price and blu-ray has also won.

7) Well I think trying to reduce damage to the Playstation brand is damage control.

how is it damage control.it is normal business

it would only be called damage control if they didn't know that the brand was going to be damaged.

with the high price they knew it would be damaged and make loss.so that isn't damage control but more like normal business strategy.

4) Mkay, we'll have to wait and see. I predict losses, you don't. What's left to say?

5) Seems like a lot of people get royalties from Bluray. Lets all hope their share is enough to cover the PS3.

6) I wish we could find out how much those royalties are. It seems a lot of major companies have their hand in the pot.

7) More like monkey business! I still call it damage control when you hurt a brand and waste a ton of money in hopes your fans don't go elsewhere.



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NextLevel on 07 July 2010

it´s ok.

But Sony prepare the white ps3.....



Killiana1a on 07 July 2010

As I stated earlier in this thread, Sony took a $4.7 billion loss from when the PS3 was released until it started becoming profitable, which was around 2009.

That $4.7 billion was a real cost incurred by Sony and until they manage to recoup that $4.7 billion and then some from Walkman sales, television sales, or whatever, then the PS3 cannot be considered a worthwile, profitable venture that beckons a PS4.

All of that profit the PS3 is making now is what Accounting 101 calls a "credit" and that $4.7 billion loss is what Accounting 101 calls a "debit." Sony has a lot of credits to make from the PS3 in order to remove the parentheses from the red (4.7) billion.

I am just wondering what kind of uninformed investor invests in companies such as Sony who have shown with the PS3, that they are willing to take a $4.7 billion loss and still have another $5 billion loss via the PS4 in the next 5 years?

Now, I am assuming: 1. There will be a PS4 and 2. Sony and Kaz Hirai will try to 1up Nintendo and Microsoft by putting out another overpriced vanity machine (PS4) at a price all except the most fervent of Sony supporters will not buy.

I don't wish death on Sony as I have been a consumer of their product in my younger years, I just wish they would own up to their past mistakes, chop some heads off in their company, and get back to the basics by prioritizing what products are making a profit, continue to make those profitable products, and shut down the products and company divisions who are running at a loss, while being subsidized by the more profitable product divisions.



gtcarro on 07 July 2010

In Europe, Asia and in the rest of the world, xbox360 is starting to die.


The North Americans are the only ones that still believe in xbox360, but the last sub-HD exclusives, defenitely killed the console in the rest of the world.



Uncharted & The Last of Us 

(Definitely, best games of last Gen)

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thx1139 on 07 July 2010
Solid_Snake4RD said:
thx1139 said:
Solid_Snake4RD said:
thx1139 said:
slowmo said:

Why did this discussion turn into a debate over profits?  The thread is about whether the PS3 will overtake the 360 so I don't see the relevance of which company makes more money personally unless you're discussing current financials which could effect future pricing.

Profit has to come into the discussion.

It is simple really will Sony be willing to sell the PS3 at a loss the remainder of this generation to catch the 360?  I for one believe Sony is now at a place where profit is more important than making thier fans happy by trying to beat the 360.

Think of it this way. If come this fall Sony sees that they will sell 13 million this fiscal year will they cut price $50 so they can reach the 15 million goal and lose like $50 per console on about 7 million consoles.

" lose like $50 per console on about 7 million consoles."

how will they lose $50 on million??????

Dont know what you are asking.  They are basically breaking even on the PS3 right now. So a $50 price cut to boost sales from 13 to 15 million causes additional losses for the sake of 2 million extra console sales.  The reason I say 7 million is because to sell the additional 2 million consoles they will need to make the price change before the holiday sales period. I guestimated that from that time (say Nov 1) through March 31 2011 they would sell 7 million consoles at $250 rather than 5 million at $300.

we don't know if they are breaking even.

stop bullshting trying to make people believe that PS3 just doesn't make profit

SONY CFO at FY09-10 FINANCIAL REPORT MEETING said PS3 started making profit in USA under$10 in  JAN-MAR period

in may they induced  the RSX 40nm which will make more profit.

don't forget that in JAPAN they were already making profit as they sell for $340 there.

even in Europe they were selling at a higher cost.

 

even after this if you think they are just breaking even,then you have gone bonkers.

 

and for your info if they do a $50 PRICE-CUT it will do alot more than just 2m PS3's

now if they are already getting 15m projected PS3 sales without a price cut then they will not make it but if the impact of 360 doesn't allow it then they will.

i think by the above mentioned cost cuts and profits SONY is making,if they cut the price by $50 they will be  losing a minor amoutn and not full $50 as you say.

now that minor loss can be made by Software sales like it was done when PS3 SLIM was released and Software sales were making the minor loss on PS3 SLIM's

and don't forget the profits they would make on bundles,250gb ones which alot of people will buy once that gets down to $299 and accesaries.

 

once more thing,32nm  is incoming by the end of this year and other hardware costs keep decreasing as time goes.

 

 

NOW EVEN after all this you think that PS3 will just continue to lose then what can i say.I can't treat a patient like you

Doesnt jive with what Sony said last month

"This year is the first time that we are able to cover the cost of the PlayStation 3," Shuhei Yoshida, president of Sony's Worldwide Studios, told IGN. "We aren't making huge money from hardware, but we aren't bleeding like we used to."

http://gameinformer.com/b/news/archive/2010/06/29/ps3-making-money-no-price-cuts.aspx



Its libraries that sell systems not a single game.

Killiana1a on 07 July 2010
gtcarro said:

In Europe, Asia and in the rest of the world, xbox360 is starting to die.


The North Americans are the only ones that still believe in xbox360, but the last sub-HD exclusives, defenitely killed the console in the rest of the world.


The Xbox brand has always been a peculiarly North American console. A lot of it's underperformance in Japan and the EMEAA is due to it entering the market late after Nintendo and Sony established a foothold and following.

At the end of the day, the Americas is still the largest market followed by Japan. Yes, the EMEAA may cover more geography, but if you look at the data on VGChartz, the EMEAA has maybe a 5th to a quarter of the sales of the Americas and Japan has more than a third of the sales of the Americas. The Americas by and large has been and is currently the biggest market, thus the biggest prize.

I can understand your post in terms of long lasting fanbase creation for a particular brand that is the Xbox, which is a very valid point now and forever. However, in this global recession where the Euro may again be rocked if either Portugal, Italy, Ireland or Spain defaults or needs a huge bailout, then it will send ripples through both the EMEAA and Japanese market not only in terms of less consumers having less disposable income to purchase video games, but the affects on individual companies.

Sony does very well in Europe and a downturn of the Euro in Europe will prove disastrous for them. Nintendo not so much because it does the majority of its' sales in the Americas. Microsoft is more a mystery in terms of their business strategy. We all know they do best in the Americas, but what we don't know is their aims for expanding their influence to the Japanese market and EMEAA market.



joeorc on 07 July 2010
Killiana1a said:

As I stated earlier in this thread, Sony took a $4.7 billion loss from when the PS3 was released until it started becoming profitable, which was around 2009.

That $4.7 billion was a real cost incurred by Sony and until they manage to recoup that $4.7 billion and then some from Walkman sales, television sales, or whatever, then the PS3 cannot be considered a worthwile, profitable venture that beckons a PS4.

All of that profit the PS3 is making now is what Accounting 101 calls a "credit" and that $4.7 billion loss is what Accounting 101 calls a "debit." Sony has a lot of credits to make from the PS3 in order to remove the parentheses from the red (4.7) billion.

I am just wondering what kind of uninformed investor invests in companies such as Sony who have shown with the PS3, that they are willing to take a $4.7 billion loss and still have another $5 billion loss via the PS4 in the next 5 years?

Now, I am assuming: 1. There will be a PS4 and 2. Sony and Kaz Hirai will try to 1up Nintendo and Microsoft by putting out another overpriced vanity machine (PS4) at a price all except the most fervent of Sony supporters will not buy.

I don't wish death on Sony as I have been a consumer of their product in my younger years, I just wish they would own up to their past mistakes, chop some heads off in their company, and get back to the basics by prioritizing what products are making a profit, continue to make those profitable products, and shut down the products and company divisions who are running at a loss, while being subsidized by the more profitable product divisions.

YET MORE DIATRIBE: LOL....

Playstation does not just = the PS3

yes let's just to choose to ignore the PSP profit's, the PS2 profit's and software from those 2 other platform's including the PS3 software profit's and PSN digital sales and the profit's from Home, and now PSN plus.....

PSP,PS2,PSN,PSN(PLUS),Home,psp software, PS2 software,ps3 software

is greater than just the

"PS3"



I AM BOLO

100% lover "nothing else matter's" after that...

ps:

Proud psOne/2/3/p owner.  I survived Aplcalyps3 and all I got was this lousy Signature.

rutea7 on 07 July 2010
miqdadi said:

In the USA I am sure the PS3 will not catch  360 , It's over there , If I owned a 360 I don't need a PS3 , the games are one and the same , I don't remember seeing two similar consoles in my gaming history , OK U can't play gran turismo (U got Forza) U can't play Killzone (U have Halo) this is not much of a big differance .

The only bright side I see is Blue-Ray support by PS3 (U can purchase a Blue-ray machine still) , Had microsoft choosed to support HD-DVD then it would't have died and Toshiba would be still fighting for it's market share till date.

Anyway in Europe we will have to see if The price cut will change the market there because the PS3 is leading there , The gap has shrunk to 5 Million because of Europe & Japan market.


i'd like to know what are the replacements for other ps3 exclusives in ur opinion, cause just because u might not like them or care about those they are still there and make the ps3 games library a pretty impressive one.

what's the substitute for god of war, uncharted, infamous, yakuza and other franchises that you cant find anywhere else?

@OP: like other people have stated before, i cant say i care that much about the ps3 beating xbox360 in sales. i'm happy with my console of choice, it has a respectable install base that cant be ignored and a great library of games. i know the console still has at least 3 more years to live up to it's full potential, the games will keep coming. that's all i want and expect when i buy a playstation console.



kitler53 on 07 July 2010
rutea7 said:
miqdadi said:

In the USA I am sure the PS3 will not catch  360 , It's over there , If I owned a 360 I don't need a PS3 , the games are one and the same , I don't remember seeing two similar consoles in my gaming history , OK U can't play gran turismo (U got Forza) U can't play Killzone (U have Halo) this is not much of a big differance .

The only bright side I see is Blue-Ray support by PS3 (U can purchase a Blue-ray machine still) , Had microsoft choosed to support HD-DVD then it would't have died and Toshiba would be still fighting for it's market share till date.

Anyway in Europe we will have to see if The price cut will change the market there because the PS3 is leading there , The gap has shrunk to 5 Million because of Europe & Japan market.


i'd like to know what are the replacements for other ps3 exclusives in ur opinion, cause just because u might not like them or care about those they are still there and make the ps3 games library a pretty impressive one.

what's the substitute for god of war, uncharted, infamous, yakuza and other franchises that you cant find anywhere else?

@OP: like other people have stated before, i cant say i care that much about the ps3 beating xbox360 in sales. i'm happy with my console of choice, it has a respectable install base that cant be ignored and a great library of games. i know the console still has at least 3 more years to live up to it's full potential, the games will keep coming. that's all i want and expect when i buy a playstation console.

god of war = bayonetta, dante's inferno

uncharted = tomb raider

infamous = crackdown

yakuza = GTA (i'm sort of guessing cause i'm not too familur with yakuza)