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Forums - Gaming - If 3D Dot Game Heroes was an actual Zelda game...

Euphoria14 on 31 May 2010
MaxwellGT2000 said:
I think it could have been rated higher, I think if it was a similar game but put on the DS with the zelda name on it for sure it would have gotten the higher ratings, partially because of the weird standards for DS games and if it was still 3D Dot on the DS it seems like people would have ignored it.

But you could also say if it wasn't exclusive would it have gotten higher ratings or perhaps lower?

Really it's a lot of what if's, a lot of reviewers with questionable judgment, and none of it can really be proven ever.

I personally believe in the whole DS situation just based on Phantom Hourglass scores but you are probably right, none of this can be ctually proven, but the reasoning for the lower scores makes me think otherwise.

When someone says a game is fun, has plenty of charm, has plenty of stuff to keep you busy but hits it real hard just because it is similar to Zelda makes think it would be higher if it was Zelda just because that con would become a pro, and that is in fact it's biggest "con".

Funny though because for an old school Zelda fan that "con" would be a HUGE "pro".



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miz1q2w3e on 31 May 2010
Euphoria14 said:

Do you feel that is right though? Sometimes a parody and/or homage is what is needed and if it arises it shouldn't just be bashed to all hell. The game is something that many people like myself have been wanting for so long and 80% of the reviews reflect this. Unfortunately we have 20% butt hurt reviewers who instead opt to give it 50-60 because it is exactly what it is supposed to be.

Also, even though it is "unevolved", it shows just how great that style of gaming was. It is still fun, it is still rewarding, and most of all it is still worth all $40 of your hard earned dollars, especially since it gives you more than most $50-60 games do these days.

Also think about it, should they bash every single game that is based on the old old school PC FPS titles? It seems like they don't. They just ignore the fact that these games have been done over and over and over again.

CoD: Black Ops will release this year and most likely average 90+ on Meta, but other than some dynamic set pieces, what has it added since say, CoD and CoD2 in terms of the run and gun style gameplay?

I don't remember PS2 JRPGs being bashed because they were so similar to PS1 JRPGs.


** yeah, those are undeserved imo

**** Reviewers don't seem to care about "fun" anymore, which is sad 

noname2200 said:

What's unbelievable is how lazy, uninspired, unimaginative, and derivative.  It's a crappier game than a indie digital title, and you should be ashamed of supporting it.

 ** Critics seem to base a lot of a game's score off of production values & hype, CoD has plenty of that, also they must be doing something right! :p  (though i haven't played any CoDs) but 3DDGH doesn't seem to have that big budget going for it

and RPGs innovated planty in the PS2 era, how can you say that! :p  and anyways, there aren't many highly rated PS2 JRPGs on meta anyways, only FF which i think innovates plenty between itterations, and they're bashed a lot as well

i don't think people are thinking of the game as a parody/homage, they view it as a ripoff, but there are those who see it for what it really is: "Definitely a love letter to old-school gaming fans" - Gaming Age (100/100) do it isn't THAT bad of a situation :p (and lol at all this text! XD)



Khuutra on 31 May 2010
Euphoria14 said:
MaxwellGT2000 said:
I think it could have been rated higher, I think if it was a similar game but put on the DS with the zelda name on it for sure it would have gotten the higher ratings, partially because of the weird standards for DS games and if it was still 3D Dot on the DS it seems like people would have ignored it.

But you could also say if it wasn't exclusive would it have gotten higher ratings or perhaps lower?

Really it's a lot of what if's, a lot of reviewers with questionable judgment, and none of it can really be proven ever.

I personally believe in the whole DS situation just based on Phantom Hourglass scores but you are probably right, none of this can be ctually proven, but the reasoning for the lower scores makes me think otherwise.

When someone says a game is fun, has plenty of charm, has plenty of stuff to keep you busy but hits it real hard just because it is similar to Zelda makes think it would be higher if it was Zelda just because that con would become a pro, and that is in fact it's biggest "con".

Funny though because for an old school Zelda fan that "con" would be a HUGE "pro".

I think you undersell how much Phantom Hourglass managed to differentiate itself from the rest of the series in terms of structure and design.



MaxwellGT2000 on 31 May 2010
Euphoria14 said:
MaxwellGT2000 said:
I think it could have been rated higher, I think if it was a similar game but put on the DS with the zelda name on it for sure it would have gotten the higher ratings, partially because of the weird standards for DS games and if it was still 3D Dot on the DS it seems like people would have ignored it.

But you could also say if it wasn't exclusive would it have gotten higher ratings or perhaps lower?

Really it's a lot of what if's, a lot of reviewers with questionable judgment, and none of it can really be proven ever.

I personally believe in the whole DS situation just based on Phantom Hourglass scores but you are probably right, none of this can be ctually proven, but the reasoning for the lower scores makes me think otherwise.

When someone says a game is fun, has plenty of charm, has plenty of stuff to keep you busy but hits it real hard just because it is similar to Zelda makes think it would be higher if it was Zelda just because that con would become a pro, and that is in fact it's biggest "con".

Funny though because for an old school Zelda fan that "con" would be a HUGE "pro".

Yeah I brought up DS because for some reason reviews don't seem to mind that Zelda on the DS is top down but they get upset at the controls, and if you have 3DDGH controls on the DS with the game game new name it wouldn't get it's ass handed to it like NSMB Wii did by some reviewers.  Cause for some reason having a DS which is more powerful than the N64 not have traditional 3D games is alright, while on home consoles anything classic seems like it's an automatic point off unless its a download title and even then it better not look like an NES game like Megaman lol



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Euphoria14 on 31 May 2010
Khuutra said:
Euphoria14 said:
MaxwellGT2000 said:
I think it could have been rated higher, I think if it was a similar game but put on the DS with the zelda name on it for sure it would have gotten the higher ratings, partially because of the weird standards for DS games and if it was still 3D Dot on the DS it seems like people would have ignored it.

But you could also say if it wasn't exclusive would it have gotten higher ratings or perhaps lower?

Really it's a lot of what if's, a lot of reviewers with questionable judgment, and none of it can really be proven ever.

I personally believe in the whole DS situation just based on Phantom Hourglass scores but you are probably right, none of this can be ctually proven, but the reasoning for the lower scores makes me think otherwise.

When someone says a game is fun, has plenty of charm, has plenty of stuff to keep you busy but hits it real hard just because it is similar to Zelda makes think it would be higher if it was Zelda just because that con would become a pro, and that is in fact it's biggest "con".

Funny though because for an old school Zelda fan that "con" would be a HUGE "pro".

I think you undersell how much Phantom Hourglass managed to differentiate itself from the rest of the series in terms of structure and design.

It is still at heart a 2D 3/4 top down Zelda title. My only gripe is the touch screen controls.

If you take away those controls and some of the gimicks that come with the DS (closing an reopening to create the image on the map), it is still the old school fun many Zelda fans are accustomed to.

I am positive that if 3DDGH was a DS title named "Zelda" it would have been received MUCH better than it is on the PS3.

 

The entire time leading up to it's release we had tons of garbage like "Nintendo should sue", "it's a rip-off", etc... even to the point where articles were written to downplay these ridiculous thoughts, although it seems those articles fell on deaf ears. The reviews only prove that. They do not aknowledge the differences between the titles, only choosing to compare them and bash based on them. 

That in my opinion is very very bad gaming journalism.



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SnesTea on 31 May 2010

I thought the game got great scores because it is essentially a Zelda parody.



miz1q2w3e on 31 May 2010
Euphoria14 said:
miz1q2w3e said:
i got an idea, check this out:

Megaman 9: 77(ps3) / 82 (X360) / 83 (Wii)
Megaman 10: 78(ps3) / 79 (X360) / 83 (Wii)

these *new megaman games didn't get free rides, they *copied gameplay from old, unevolved games in the late 80s/early 90s and look at the score they got, they didn't even copy anyone else, only sequels (copied themselves)

face it, games have evolved since the 80s and you can't just make games like those and expect to get positive responses from everyone

Bad rebuttal considering most Megaman titles have averages mid 80's- low 70's and high 60's since the Genesis, GBA and PS1. You're talking about lower scores for over 10+ years now. Not to mention the series has a history of getting lower scores based on difficulty.

http://www.gamerankings.com/browse.html?search=mega+man&numrev=3&site=


those are all newer/later megaman games, i'm talking about the games that megaman 9&10 actually copied in terms of style and gameplay (megaman2-6), and those were HIGHLY praised games for the most part... GameSpot named Mega Man 2 as one of "The Greatest Games of All Time"

yet MM9&10 also failed to acheive the same critical reception as the games they are based off of, much like how 3DDGH is based off of NES/SNES Zeldas

i do agree however that if critics viewed more as a parody/homage, it wouldn't have been bashed as much (check my previous post :p)



Khuutra on 31 May 2010
Euphoria14 said:
Khuutra said:

I think you undersell how much Phantom Hourglass managed to differentiate itself from the rest of the series in terms of structure and design.

It is still at heart a 2D 3/4 top down Zelda title. My only gripe is the touch screen controls.

If you take away those controls and some of the gimicks that come with the DS (closing an reopening to create the image on the map, it is still the old school fun many Zelda fans are accustomed to.

The complete shift in gameplay focus toward puzzle-based dungeons to the exclusion of combat focus - and especially the boss fights - differentiates the game considerably from its 2D predecessors. Nevermind the way the overworld works, and the sectioned off towns and dungeons.

The game is structurally as different from LttP as OoT is.



Euphoria14 on 31 May 2010
miz1q2w3e said:
Euphoria14 said:
miz1q2w3e said:
i got an idea, check this out:

Megaman 9: 77(ps3) / 82 (X360) / 83 (Wii)
Megaman 10: 78(ps3) / 79 (X360) / 83 (Wii)

these *new megaman games didn't get free rides, they *copied gameplay from old, unevolved games in the late 80s/early 90s and look at the score they got, they didn't even copy anyone else, only sequels (copied themselves)

face it, games have evolved since the 80s and you can't just make games like those and expect to get positive responses from everyone

Bad rebuttal considering most Megaman titles have averages mid 80's- low 70's and high 60's since the Genesis, GBA and PS1. You're talking about lower scores for over 10+ years now. Not to mention the series has a history of getting lower scores based on difficulty.

http://www.gamerankings.com/browse.html?search=mega+man&numrev=3&site=


those are all newer/later megaman games, i'm talking about the games that megaman 9&10 actually copied in terms of style and gameplay (megaman2-6), and those were HIGHLY praised games for the most part... GameSpot named Mega Man 2 as one of "The Greatest Games of All Time"

yet MM9&10 also failed to acheive the same critical reception as the games they are based off of, much like how 3DDGH is based off of NES/SNES Zeldas

i do agree however that if critics viewed more as a parody/homage, it wouldn't have been bashed as much (check my previous post :p)

Yes, and therein lies the problem.



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Euphoria14 on 31 May 2010
Snesboy said:
I thought the game got great scores because it is essentially a Zelda parody.

http://www.metacritic.com/games/platforms/ps3/3ddotgameheroes?q=3d%20dot%20game%20heroes    

 

Check out what happens once the game gets passed reviews #35+ from the top down and see the reasoning in the closing comment. It explains all. It also shows just how far apart they are from not only the majority of reviewers, but from the gaming community as well.



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