By using this site, you agree to our Privacy Policy and our Terms of Use. Close

Forums - Sony Discussion - PS EYE can do what NATAL can:

account2099 said:
PS eye cant do what Natal will do: Actually SELL (lol)

MS spends 4x the advertising money as Sony does in gaming. For every 1 PS Eye ad your gonna see 5 Natal ads.

so what if they do let MS spend away, I still think Sony's motion control's may outsell Microsoft's

an

sofar with little advertising sony was able to sell 10 million EYETOY'S on the Playstation 2 last generation.

this time I think their going to sell many more over that due to the way they are running their AD's for Playstation Kevin Butler ad's are doing very well for for the playstation platform's

this generation Sony's been advertising their 1st an 2nd party like crazy. unless you keep missing those Kevin butler add's that Sony keep running on TV.

 there's been already more than one TV . AD for Move already.

and that Playstation Move controller has been creeping up in other game's being advertised as well.

once we get near fall your going to see more ad's for Playstation move in more of their game's, not just playstation move only game's.

EYEPET

LBP 2



I AM BOLO

100% lover "nothing else matter's" after that...

ps:

Proud psOne/2/3/p owner.  I survived Aplcalyps3 and all I got was this lousy Signature.

Around the Network
joeorc said:
account2099 said:
PS eye cant do what Natal will do: Actually SELL (lol)

MS spends 4x the advertising money as Sony does in gaming. For every 1 PS Eye ad your gonna see 5 Natal ads.

so what if they do let MS spend away, I still think Sony's motion control's may outsell Microsoft's

an

sofar with little advertising sony was able to sell 10 million EYETOY'S on the Playstation 2 last generation.

this time I think their going to sell many more over that due to the way they are running their AD's for Playstation Kevin Butler ad's are doing very well for for the playstation platform's

this generation Sony's been advertising their 1st an 2nd party like crazy. unless you keep missing those Kevin butler add's that Sony keep running on TV.

already there's been already more than one TV . AD for Move already.

and that Playstation Move controller has been creeping up in other game's being advertised as well.

once we get near fall your going to see more ad's for Playstation move in more of their game's, not just playstation move only game's.

EYEPET

LBP 2

not to mention socom 4, the fight lights out, ps move has shown more interesting games than natal, sorry but it will sell more, just look at the wii story which was posted: a couple who was going to buy a black wii saw the ps move advert and bought a ps3 instead for preparation for ps move, sorry but i think the masses are already wanting ps move due to familiarity and the fact it is better than wiimote.



joeorc said:
ironman said:
Smidlee said:
Theo said:
Isamu said:
Solid_Snake4RD said:

you forgot to highlight and post your previous comments

still stinging huh?

 

keep commenting cause i'm stopping now


K Thx, bye.  I don't mind, you admitted you posted a bad opening post, took 8 pages, but we got there.  Thanks for playing.

 

You talk about 3D depth perception that Natal has over the eye with it's two cameras, but there aren't any videos showing games using depth perception, all there has been so far is motion tracking which the eye clearly can do.

The only accurate depth perception I've seen is with the move controllers and one camera. And there's video proof of that working effectively and usefully in a number of move titles.

 

You are right about one point , Eye can also do 3d depth perception just like Natal. Natal has an extra IR camera while Eye uses normal colors which means it need something like Move ball to gain more accurate 3D perception. The Move ball predictable color and size makes it easier to program and track. Even Natal at the beginning had trouble with tracking people with different skin tones as this affect on how IR light bounce off their skin. (Microsoft claimed this was fixed)

That's not true 3D depth perception, the camera uses the perceived size of the ball  to gage how close or far away it is. It also cannot track things as small as fingers, and it's definitely different than Natal. 

umm yes it can, though the lighting must be real good to do so , that's one of the main reason's why the lighted sphere on the playstation move is there because not everyone will have real good light in the room where the EYETOY is going to be . thus with a lighted sphere it make's it much better for the EYETOY to track the move. or body part's and motion's of a person, yes The 3D cam's that in Natal are better at it than The EYETOY, the EYETOY can indeed track small object's like finger's.

example:

The most interesting of the demos came from Richard Marks, Manager of Special Projects at Sony Computer Entertainment America, and involved his increasingly popular EyeToy.

The first demo highlighted a “View Tracking” system that allows the EyeToy to adjust the in-game camera based on movements of the player's head in space. Marks played a first-person shooter for the audience, and when his character came to a corner, he was able to “duck” his head around for a brief peek at his opponent. View Tracking uses about 25% of the CPU power of a PS2, Marks said – but less than 1% of the power of the PS3.

The second demo featured a gestural interface in which the EyeToy tracks and translates a user's hand motions, based on simple color keying. Holding a simple wedge of neon-colored Styrofoam in his hand, Marks was able to select and rotate objects in the game, effectively turning his hand into a spatial mouse. In addition to eliminating the need for gloves or other devices, he noted that this allows the EyeToy to track multiple objects at once, allowing for two-handed gestural control and other gameplay innovations.

Sony has filed a patent number 2006-178948

“Basically, a camera will recognize every move and position of an object and will translate these actions accordingly to an object inside a game. Via this new technology, the 2D camera is analyzing an object in full 3D through a patented mapping technique.

Until now, more than one camera was needed to capture an object’s movement in 3D.

both Natal and the EYETOY DO THIS

No they do not, the eye toy measures size differences in objects to calculate how far or close to the camera they are. This is, always has been, and always will be, 2D. Furthermore, it will NEVER be as accurate as 3D.  Natal is the ONLY console system at this point that actually does 3D with an in-depth multi point system that is capable of tracking down to fingers, so far, you haven't proven to me that the eyetoy is capable of such a feat. 



Past Avatar picture!!!

Don't forget your helmet there, Master Chief!

FF_Fanatic said:
joeorc said:
account2099 said:
PS eye cant do what Natal will do: Actually SELL (lol)

MS spends 4x the advertising money as Sony does in gaming. For every 1 PS Eye ad your gonna see 5 Natal ads.

so what if they do let MS spend away, I still think Sony's motion control's may outsell Microsoft's

Whatever makes you happy.

an

sofar with little advertising sony was able to sell 10 million EYETOY'S on the Playstation 2 last generation.

I wonder why??? Oh yeah, because there was no competition.

this time I think their going to sell many more over that due to the way they are running their AD's for Playstation Kevin Butler ad's are doing very well for for the playstation platform's

No, price-cuts, and slim formfacter are, the adds are only slightly less dismal than they used to be.

this generation Sony's been advertising their 1st an 2nd party like crazy. unless you keep missing those Kevin butler add's that Sony keep running on TV.

already there's been already more than one TV . AD for Move already.

and that Playstation Move controller has been creeping up in other game's being advertised as well.

once we get near fall your going to see more ad's for Playstation move in more of their game's, not just playstation move only game's.

EYEPET

LBP 2

not to mention socom 4, the fight lights out, ps move has shown more interesting games than natal, sorry but it will sell more, just look at the wii story which was posted: a couple who was going to buy a black wii saw the ps move advert and bought a ps3 instead for preparation for ps move, sorry but i think the masses are already wanting ps move due to familiarity and the fact it is better than wiimote.

The masses? By the masses you mean the couple, yourself, and few other fringe gamers??? Trust me, move is going to be seen as a wiimote copy (a bad clunky one at that) and unless some killer games come out for it, it's not gonna do well at all. The public has all but forgotten about the flop that was the eyetoy, so Natal will look even more like innovative new tech. The only thing I see at this point keeping Natal from absolutely obliterating sales of Move, are games, and there is still plenty of time for those to be announced. I wouldn't keep my hopes up if I were you. Move isn't going to sell that great.

 



Past Avatar picture!!!

Don't forget your helmet there, Master Chief!

ironman said:
joeorc said:
ironman said:
Smidlee said:
Theo said:
Isamu said:
Solid_Snake4RD said:

you forgot to highlight and post your previous comments

still stinging huh?

 

keep commenting cause i'm stopping now


K Thx, bye.  I don't mind, you admitted you posted a bad opening post, took 8 pages, but we got there.  Thanks for playing.

 

You talk about 3D depth perception that Natal has over the eye with it's two cameras, but there aren't any videos showing games using depth perception, all there has been so far is motion tracking which the eye clearly can do.

The only accurate depth perception I've seen is with the move controllers and one camera. And there's video proof of that working effectively and usefully in a number of move titles.

 

You are right about one point , Eye can also do 3d depth perception just like Natal. Natal has an extra IR camera while Eye uses normal colors which means it need something like Move ball to gain more accurate 3D perception. The Move ball predictable color and size makes it easier to program and track. Even Natal at the beginning had trouble with tracking people with different skin tones as this affect on how IR light bounce off their skin. (Microsoft claimed this was fixed)

That's not true 3D depth perception, the camera uses the perceived size of the ball  to gage how close or far away it is. It also cannot track things as small as fingers, and it's definitely different than Natal. 

umm yes it can, though the lighting must be real good to do so , that's one of the main reason's why the lighted sphere on the playstation move is there because not everyone will have real good light in the room where the EYETOY is going to be . thus with a lighted sphere it make's it much better for the EYETOY to track the move. or body part's and motion's of a person, yes The 3D cam's that in Natal are better at it than The EYETOY, the EYETOY can indeed track small object's like finger's.

example:

The most interesting of the demos came from Richard Marks, Manager of Special Projects at Sony Computer Entertainment America, and involved his increasingly popular EyeToy.

The first demo highlighted a “View Tracking” system that allows the EyeToy to adjust the in-game camera based on movements of the player's head in space. Marks played a first-person shooter for the audience, and when his character came to a corner, he was able to “duck” his head around for a brief peek at his opponent. View Tracking uses about 25% of the CPU power of a PS2, Marks said – but less than 1% of the power of the PS3.

The second demo featured a gestural interface in which the EyeToy tracks and translates a user's hand motions, based on simple color keying. Holding a simple wedge of neon-colored Styrofoam in his hand, Marks was able to select and rotate objects in the game, effectively turning his hand into a spatial mouse. In addition to eliminating the need for gloves or other devices, he noted that this allows the EyeToy to track multiple objects at once, allowing for two-handed gestural control and other gameplay innovations.

Sony has filed a patent number 2006-178948

“Basically, a camera will recognize every move and position of an object and will translate these actions accordingly to an object inside a game. Via this new technology, the 2D camera is analyzing an object in full 3D through a patented mapping technique.

Until now, more than one camera was needed to capture an object’s movement in 3D.

both Natal and the EYETOY DO THIS

No they do not, the eye toy measures size differences in objects to calculate how far or close to the camera they are. This is, always has been, and always will be, 2D. Furthermore, it will NEVER be as accurate as 3D.  Natal is the ONLY console system at this point that actually does 3D with an in-depth multi point system that is capable of tracking down to fingers, so far, you haven't proven to me that the eyetoy is capable of such a feat. 

yes it does:

at pax: east 10

Anton Mikhailov, a software engineer in research & development at SCE:

The Eye does all the depth tracking based on its view of the controller.


"The camera does 3D tracking. The Wii has a camera looking at the dots. But the reason it can't do 3D is because, as [people] turn away, [the hardware] loses sight of the dots -- and the dots move around in unpredictable ways.

 



I AM BOLO

100% lover "nothing else matter's" after that...

ps:

Proud psOne/2/3/p owner.  I survived Aplcalyps3 and all I got was this lousy Signature.

Around the Network
ironman said:
FF_Fanatic said:
joeorc said:
account2099 said:
PS eye cant do what Natal will do: Actually SELL (lol)

MS spends 4x the advertising money as Sony does in gaming. For every 1 PS Eye ad your gonna see 5 Natal ads.

so what if they do let MS spend away, I still think Sony's motion control's may outsell Microsoft's

Whatever makes you happy.

an

sofar with little advertising sony was able to sell 10 million EYETOY'S on the Playstation 2 last generation.

I wonder why??? Oh yeah, because there was no competition.

this time I think their going to sell many more over that due to the way they are running their AD's for Playstation Kevin Butler ad's are doing very well for for the playstation platform's

No, price-cuts, and slim formfacter are, the adds are only slightly less dismal than they used to be.

this generation Sony's been advertising their 1st an 2nd party like crazy. unless you keep missing those Kevin butler add's that Sony keep running on TV.

already there's been already more than one TV . AD for Move already.

and that Playstation Move controller has been creeping up in other game's being advertised as well.

once we get near fall your going to see more ad's for Playstation move in more of their game's, not just playstation move only game's.

EYEPET

LBP 2

not to mention socom 4, the fight lights out, ps move has shown more interesting games than natal, sorry but it will sell more, just look at the wii story which was posted: a couple who was going to buy a black wii saw the ps move advert and bought a ps3 instead for preparation for ps move, sorry but i think the masses are already wanting ps move due to familiarity and the fact it is better than wiimote.

The masses? By the masses you mean the couple, yourself, and few other fringe gamers??? Trust me, move is going to be seen as a wiimote copy (a bad clunky one at that) and unless some killer games come out for it, it's not gonna do well at all. The public has all but forgotten about the flop that was the eyetoy, so Natal will look even more like innovative new tech. The only thing I see at this point keeping Natal from absolutely obliterating sales of Move, are games, and there is still plenty of time for those to be announced. I wouldn't keep my hopes up if I were you. Move isn't going to sell that great.

 

your can have your Opinion and not that I agree with it.

An so what if it's seen as a copy!

 If anything having something that Augment's the Wii motion control's would be seen by many as an Upgrade.. to already a great way to play game's that's already on the Wii. So getting that and even more function's added to motion control's is a good thing in my opinion.

you mention killer app's if it's one thing this generation, I have Seen Sony has put out some great killer App's for the Playstation 3.

you can doubt if want about Sony being able to put out some quality game's for Playstation Move, but the way I see it Sony's been investing very heavy into 1st AND 2nd party for Playstation 3 game's and their track record for those quality game's are pretty d@mn good.

so i guess we will see how it goes.

 



I AM BOLO

100% lover "nothing else matter's" after that...

ps:

Proud psOne/2/3/p owner.  I survived Aplcalyps3 and all I got was this lousy Signature.

Isamu said:
Theo said:

You're clearly new here. Stop making a fool of yourself. Solid_Snake4RD merely posted this speculating on the similar performance of both technologies with some video evidence to back up his claim.

You talk about 3D depth perception that Natal has over the eye with it's two cameras, but there aren't any videos showing games using depth perception, all there has been so far is motion tracking which the eye clearly can do.

The only accurate depth perception I've seen is with the move controllers and one camera. And there's video proof of that working effectively and usefully in a number of move titles.

So please don't bite on non-existent bait and turn this peaceful website into another fanboy warzone.


Naw, I'm not new, not at all.  I am what you call a lurker.  And to be honest, I didn't want it to turn into this, and as I said, if the opening post had a bit more info it would have been fine, but I've covered everything, and you don't want to read it (I mean, its a of bs to read thru now to find the small nuggets of information ;)


lurker. so your trolling. thats not a good look.



joeorc said:
ironman said:
FF_Fanatic said:
joeorc said:
account2099 said:

 

 

 

 

 

  I wouldn't keep my hopes up if I were you. Move isn't going to sell that great.

 

 

neither is natal! they both suck. and by the way. your agurment is weak and isn't worht debaiting.



MARCUSDJACKSON said:
Isamu said:


Naw, I'm not new, not at all.  I am what you call a lurker.  And to be honest, I didn't want it to turn into this, and as I said, if the opening post had a bit more info it would have been fine, but I've covered everything, and you don't want to read it (I mean, its a of bs to read thru now to find the small nuggets of information ;)


lurker. so your trolling. thats not a good look.


;) lol naw, I just have more time on my hands this week.  Combination of no snow, no sun & rain, and a few other things as well.



MARCUSDJACKSON said:
joeorc said:
ironman said:
FF_Fanatic said:
joeorc said:
account2099 said:

 

 

 

 

 

  I wouldn't keep my hopes up if I were you. Move isn't going to sell that great.

 

 

neither is natal! they both suck. and by the way. your agurment is weak and isn't worht debaiting.

You'll eat those words. I guarantee. (Unless MS fails to gather in devs for this thing...which I don't see since many devs are excited about this.) Anyway, nice to see you taking the cheap way out. Just because you can't argue with common sense does not give you the right to say my argument is weak.

@ Joeorc

No, just no, in order for it to see in true 3D it needs a 2nd camera. It's REPLICATING 3D And it does it fairly well from what I've seen, but it is NOT on par with Natal, and it was seen as a gimmick since it didn't really have any good games. Thats why I say if Natal doesn't have games behind it, it will fail, but I don't think MS is going to let it go the way of the eye since they have invested so heavily in this. Also, Don't get me wrong Move is interesting and fairly innovative tech, were it not for Natal, I think it would have boosted Sony to 1st place for the best conference, but there is a reason Natal stole the show, it is different the what the wii has to offer, it looks new, it looks technologically advanced, and it looks fun. Move looks like a direct ripoff of the Wiimote and as such the people are drawn to Natal because it's different and "New" 



Past Avatar picture!!!

Don't forget your helmet there, Master Chief!