Clair Obscur: Expedition 33 | 9.7 user rating on Metacritic | Disscussion thread

[LegitHyperbole]

HoloDust said:

Ryuu96 said:

We need an Elder Scrolls thread, Lol.

Luckily for OG Fallout fans, New Vegas was made by Obsidian, who understand Fallout, and not Bethesda.

LegitHyperbole said:

I never played daggerfall nut surely this must be nostalgia. Technically they didn't dumb anything down in Oblivion just improved what needed work... now Skyrim, yes they definitely dumbed it down but would Morrowind sell more than Skyrim if they were released in reverse order and the graphics were swapped about morrowind the best looking game. Very unlikely. Also, Skyrim Sold much cause of Fallout 3 and New Vegas bringing in the casuals, not so much Oblivion fans so it's more that they took what was working from Fallout 3 than dumbing down Oblivion. 

No, they wouldn't sell more than Skyrim, you sort of provided answer for yourself - Skyrim is very mainstream audience oriented design.

Old TES (Arena and Daggerfall, not made by Tod Howard) are made to emulate scope of tabtletop RPGs to a degree, specifically simulationist approach to TTRPGs, doing it with some success - there is no DM alike entity to govern the world, so the concept was sort of semi-sensible from the start, hence semi-successful end results, but Lefay and Peterson (director and designer of Daggerfall) are trying to make actual Daggerfall successor in The Wayward Realms, with Virtual AI, moving factions and simulated world, that could potentially be faithful to original goals.

Morrowind was Ted Howards baby, with different goals, for better or worse.

On the relevant note, TES and Clair Obscur belong to vaguely similar genres, so it's silly comparison to start with - as Ryuu said, TES should be discussed in some TES thread, not here.

Wait. I've made this mistake before, we probably aren't giving gamers enough credit. Baldurs Gate 3 hit main stream... there definitely is a market for more complex games with deeper systems and it's probably the crowd who bought Skyrim 3 times by now. I know I am one of them and would love nothing more than a game like Divinity OS 2 do exactly what it does with all the subtle gears working in the background in the shape of the Witcher 3's open world narrative and quest, witcher contracts and Dungeon design but with the customizable party system of origin characters in Divinity OS2 and a mix of Sekiro and Bloodborne combat. It's probably not possible, as to why perhaps BGS had to dumb down a lot of stuff in Fallout and TES cause it's probably impossible to do outside of maybe Rockstar throwing a billion or two at it. 

Last edited by LegitHyperbole - on 06 May 2025