Pemalite said:
Chrkeller said:
Based on numerous leaks the absolute maximum memory bandwidth is 112 gb/s which is a bottleneck. And it will make porting Black Myth, GTA6, Snake Eater and Avowed difficult and time consuming.
No worries if you disagree. But it is a derailment because nobody wants to see us go back and forth on every page.
My logic is sound, logical and on topic. You can be mad all day, but I'm not wrong. Sadly you know it.
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You cannot assert that your statements are "fact" based on "leaks and rumors". - They are unsubstantiated. - Leaks often end up being wrong.
Remember when the Switch had the endless NX leaks and it was going to be Radeon powered? Yeah. Exactly.
As for the bandwidth issue itself... 112GB/s is fine.
It's not a console that is chasing 1440P like the Series S... It's not a console that is chasing 2160P/4k like the Xbox One X/Playstation 4 Pro/Playstation 5/Xbox Series X.
It's a console that will likely try and obtain 1080P and if it does end up failing that target... Tegra does have DLSS which is the best form of frame reconstruction in the entire industry.
The real-world bandwidth of a modern Tegra would be roughly inline with the Playstation 4 once you start to account for Delta Colour Compression... The DCC jump to Pascal gave an extra 20% and the jump to Volta is another 20% and Ampere takes that further again... So 112GB/s would be around 150GB/s - 160GB/s or more.
Larger and faster caches, increased registers... Did you not ever wonder how the Switch was able to get Playstation 5 ports like Hogwarts Legacy despite having Ram bandwidth equivalent to a Playstation 3? It's about architectural efficiency over raw numbers. Delta Colour Compression allowed the Switch to punch above it's weight, even though it's DCC is not as advanced as current nVidia DCC implementations.
And then we can compare it to other handhelds like the Asus Rog Ally with 120GB/s which is running current console ports like Cyberpunk 2077, Hogwarts Legacy, Horizon Forbidden West and more.
I think you may just be surprised on what you can do with "just" 112GB/s and the current spate of AMD powered handhelds which are factually less efficient than nVidia's hardware and are turning in some amazing results.
112GB/s is not going to be the issue you think it is when current handhelds are doing just fine with that bandwidth.
It will not hold back ports.
Radek said:
Switch 2 RDR2 port day one, and GTA V please
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The irony is... The current Switch can run GTA5. That game has spanned 3x console generations remember.
HoloDust said:
No need to point out what Ray Tracing is to me Perm - I did it back on Amiga 500 in 80s. ;)
I was making distinction between what is currently called Ray Tracing vs Path tracing in modern games - Cyberpunk 2077 being good example of it - RT is fine, but nothing to write home about compared to rasterized only (so, IMO, for most part, kinda waste of GPU resources) - PT, on the other hand, is something much better in most cases, while hitting GPU a lot harder than RT - but it's really worth it, IMO.
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Noted.
HoloDust said:
I honestly don't know anything about how difficult is to translate CPU code from X86 to ARM - but from the amount of games on Switch, that are also on Steam, I'm guessing it's not THAT difficult.
Sure, it's always easier to have the same code and just turn the sliders down. And then there's CoDs on Wii, and especially Star Wars: Force Unleashed on Wii, which had another studio making it from the ground up - it's projection of ROI that will decide in the end (CoDs and SW:FU sold really good).
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It's not hard. We need to remember that despite x86 being CISC on the exterior, it's actually RISC on the interior, so code can translate very easily.
And with Billions of ARM devices on the planet, there are significant tools to aid in development and porting.
Binary translation exists as well, which historically allowed Intel X86 Atom chips in phones/tablets to execute ARM compiled code, it came at a slight performance hit, but it was an impressive achievement... I think I recall nVidia going down that road at some point, not sure if they abandoned that.
Transmeta is another one that comes to mind with their code morphing technology.
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I have a 3050, 4070 and a 4090. I can factually tell you memory bandwidth is a bottleneck.
And I'm not going to be surprised. I've played dozens of games on a big screen via a 3050, 4070 and a 4090.
The memory bandwidth of the switch 2 is going require numerous downgrades. On a big screen via a dock it will be very noticeable. It will be a bottleneck like I said on page 1.
If games are ported will be a function of time, money and effort. I suspect it will be hit or miss based on the developer. Could I see some developers not wanting to port because of the memory bandwidth issue? Absolutely. Could I see some developers putting in the effort? Absolutely.
How people feel about those downgrades is an opinion. I fully support anyone and everyone's preferred gaming preferences.
But I'm not going to pretend a low memory bandwidth doesn't impact ease of porting, because it does. And Hogwarts is a great example. It isn't a port of the original version. It had to be customized due to hardware limitations. Not all developers are going to put in the effort.
Hardware constraints 100% will have an impact on ports. There is absolutely no denying this.
Last edited by Chrkeller - on 01 September 2024
