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At what point is this child abuse? Trans kids.

Forums - Politics Discussion - At what point is this child abuse? Trans kids.

Encouraging prepubescent gender transformation is...

A good thing. Not child abuse. 10 15.15%
 
A bad thing. Child abuse. 39 59.09%
 
Depends on the situation. (In comments) 17 25.76%
 
Total:66
eva01beserk said:
Torillian said:

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4955762/#R40

"Children as young as 2 years learn to label themselves as a boy or a girl, and by age 4–5, are able to understand that gender is a stable and lasting aspect of their identity.40 Boys and girls have group differences in toy preference by as early as 12 months and can label other children as boys or girls by age 2.41"

Research seems to indicate that 3 year olds are not that far off from the normal age by which children understand the concept of gender. What information do you have that indicates otherwise?

https://www.kqed.org/futureofyou/441784/the-controversial-research-on-desistance-in-transgender-youth

about 65-94 percent of those confused kids just grow out of it. 

Appears that the most recent and legitimate study claims 65% but includes anyone that they had no information on as someone that desisted which is arguable so that number is likely decreased. So what is your prescription for parents whose children say they are transgender given that half will desist? You think it's illegitimate to support these children in their conclusion because half of them will reverse the decision in their teen years?

I mean the article I linked previously concluded that trans children who were supported in their decision showed no increased mental health issues compared to their peers so what exactly is the downside to supporting a child who thinks they are transgender?

I will also state that the idea that half of these kids were wrong still shows that most of them had a pretty good idea of what gender is and what their gender is in particular. Only 0.5-0.6% of people identify as transgender so the idea that these kids were only wrong half the time seems to indicate they have a pretty good idea of their gender even at that age. Otherwise there would be 99.5% desistance to match the numbers seen in the general population. 



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I don't think any child should be put through transitioning: too young to make such a life-altering decision.



sundin13 said:
John2290 said:

Immersiveunreality made me reply for me pretty much one to one. I just want to state that you are putting words in my mouth before I write anything, please ask the question and not state it as something factual, I do not think that the anything wrong with being transgender. What I do think Is wrong is this trend of considering kids to be transgender before their brain has even half developed to adulthood. I think there should be an age limit into he same way other life altering choices are age restricted. 16 would seem to be a reasonable age to start considering this with exceptions in rare cases under the examintmation of experts. 

We are not talking about physical transitioning here. No three year old is undertaking hormone therapy. As such, we are not talking about life altering decisions. There is nothing life altering about a child who was born a male wearing a dress and growing their hair out. If it is determined that the child is not transgendered at the time in which physical transitioning typically starts, they could simply not transition.

I understand what you mean but mental development is evenly important for a child and if treated wrongly it might make them depressed for the rest of their lives.

And if you think that all people working as "experts"on that field act humane then you should consider that ideology can seep into even the medical and mental health departments like a plague,some are in for profit and others are ignorant.

I have been very much invested into the treatment of autistic kids and maybe you think that is a bad comparison but i learned people in those fields sometimes just care about their own wellbeings and they see those kids as moneymachines and we are some good steps ahead with autists compared to transgender kids.

Consider those possibilities please and consider we are far away from having perfect treatment and support for those poor kids and that was clearly the concern of the OP so no need to put a HATER stamp on his forehead because he made this thread out of worry.



In Charlize Theron's case it seems that since the kid has no father-figure in his life and that has affected the child in some ways. The only role-model he has to look up to is his mother and grandmother so no wonder he wants to be a girl



Switch friend-code: 6700-1526-7903

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A person that underwent surgery with irreversible changes and then when looking at the mirror the person says: I am happy with how I look = success, happy story

A person that underwent surgery with irreversible changes and then when looking at the mirror the person says: This is not what I wanted, I feel bad and regret what I did = tragedy

The definition of genders is contested and there is nothing but "suggestions" to define the genders. The Right has their definition for genders, the Left doesn't give a fuck about defining gender, but they want us all to pretend like genders are defined.

I lean to the Left in most situations and want pretty much nothing to do with the Right in most of their positions. I thought I should give some background information about my positions, just in case.



Nintendo is selling their IPs to Microsoft and this is true because:

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/thread.php?id=221391&page=1

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Immersiveunreality said:

Consider those possibilities please and consider we are far away from having perfect treatment and support for those poor kids and that was clearly the concern of the OP so no need to put a HATER stamp on his forehead because he made this thread out of worry.

I don't think a thread that asks if supporting a child's view of themselves as transgender is child abuse is worried that our current treatment and understanding of these children is imperfect. Imperfect treatment is not child abuse. 



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Torillian said:
Immersiveunreality said:

Consider those possibilities please and consider we are far away from having perfect treatment and support for those poor kids and that was clearly the concern of the OP so no need to put a HATER stamp on his forehead because he made this thread out of worry.

I don't think a thread that asks if supporting a child's view of themselves as transgender is child abuse is worried that our current treatment and understanding of these children is imperfect. Imperfect treatment is not child abuse. 

If it results in suffering of said child it IS abuse.

If i take a swing at you while thinking it heals you ,would you consider that imperfect treatment or abuse?



Torillian said:
https://pediatrics.aappublications.org/content/137/3/e20153223
Interesting research I found while looking around. Conclusion is that children who are supported in their transgender identification show no differences in mental health indicators compared to the average population. Kinda goes against the "transgender people are sick and we shouldn't encourage them" meme that people like Ben Shapiro like to trot out there while they antagonize every trans person they see.

I dont remember anyone here claiming that those people are sick. I could be wrong. But what the op claimed at least is that parents pushing for it is sick. If they are then thats fine, its not 200 years ago where they would be lobotomized. But parents or guardians pushing for it and confusing kids more is disgusting.

And you are aware that trans have an insane suicide rate?

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-health-transgender-teen-suicide/trans-teens-much-more-likely-to-attempt-suicide-idUSKCN1LS39K

Thats no reason to discourage them in any way. But why not let kids grow a little and then decide when they are a little older. 



It takes genuine talent to see greatness in yourself despite your absence of genuine talent.

Just remembered this one. There was the case of a mom who forced her son to live like a girl
https://www.lifesitenews.com/news/6-year-old-boy-forced-to-live-as-a-girl-while-mom-threatens-dad-for-not-goi



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eva01beserk said:
Torillian said:
https://pediatrics.aappublications.org/content/137/3/e20153223
Interesting research I found while looking around. Conclusion is that children who are supported in their transgender identification show no differences in mental health indicators compared to the average population. Kinda goes against the "transgender people are sick and we shouldn't encourage them" meme that people like Ben Shapiro like to trot out there while they antagonize every trans person they see.

I dont remember anyone here claiming that those people are sick. I could be wrong. But what the op claimed at least is that parents pushing for it is sick. If they are then thats fine, its not 200 years ago where they would be lobotomized. But parents or guardians pushing for it and confusing kids more is disgusting.

And you are aware that trans have an insane suicide rate?

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-health-transgender-teen-suicide/trans-teens-much-more-likely-to-attempt-suicide-idUSKCN1LS39K

Thats no reason to discourage them in any way. But why not let kids grow a little and then decide when they are a little older. 

What I'm saying is that the research I cited is consistent with this "insane suicide rate" being caused by environmental factors (like people not supporting them in their decisions) rather than inherent in being transgender. Thus, supporting your child if they think they are transgender appears to not have any deleterious effects. 

What will you tell a 3 year old that says they are a girl when they were assigned as a boy at birth? If you don't support them in how they identify themselves do you discourage this behavior? 



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