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Forums - PC Discussion - is Emulation killing the gaming industry?

Not really, emulation is mainly for past gen consoles, and less so for the current ones since they aren't very good yet



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Ruler said:

 

Well, the article is 18 months old and the gaming industry still lives... so probably not.



Emulation isn't doing a thing to the industry and if it is, it simply means the rightsholders are simply mismanaging their intellectual properties. If a rightsholder cares about distribution of their old games, they will take the games down if possible. If anything, emulation keeps stuff alive because it spreads knowledge about old titles (and thus makes it easier to capitalize on their names using new games).



CladInShadows said:
Yeah, no. Emulation is barely a pimple on the ass of the video gaming industry. If you think it's killing the industry, you need to be brought back to reality. I swear that a lot of the emulation detractors really have no idea what they're talking about.

1. Emulation takes such computing power that it's nearly impossible to keep up with the technology of today's games. Currently, we're only able to emulate PS2/Wii level games. Technology that stopped being cutting edge 10 years ago. And even that isn't perfect emulation on all games. We won't be able to emulate 7th gen games for many years. And 8th gen? We're not gonna see that for a LONG time. Please tell me how much money Sunsoft is losing by me going and downloading Journey to Silius for the NES. I'll wait. I bet that really killed the games industry.

2. There's this idiotic mindset that emulation is synonymous with piracy. It isn't. Right now I'm playing Dragon Quest 8 on my PC, with my physical copy sitting on my shelf, and my original fat PS3 (with PS2 capabilities). Same thing with the original Xenoblade. My disc and Wii are sitting there on my shelf. I've given Nintendo, Sony, Square-Enix, and Monolith my money already. Why do I play it on the PC instead of original hardware? I can give you 1080 reasons. And anyone getting an NES classic better be down with emulation, because that's all it is. And virtual console, and many games found on today's digital stores, etc. All emulation, with no piracy.

3. The vast majority of games being emulated and/or pirated are no longer available from the original developer/publisher, meant to be played on hardware that is no longer sold new. If you go buy your physical copy of Dragon Quest 8 right now (perfectly legal), and grab a used PS2 to play it on, Square doesn't doesn't get a single penny. Neither does Sony. Some dude on ebay does. I'm not condoning piracy. I like to own the games I emulate. But I'm just being realistic when it comes to the financial impact it has on the industry. Publishers see no money no matter how you play these old games.

This is exactly how I see it.



stupid opinion piece... emulation is probably the only real way old games will ever remain playable for future generations. what kind of lost revenue is being had exactly by emulation?

i have full collections of games from the 8 bit, 16 bit and 32 bit eras taking terabytes of space in one of my hard drives. sure every now and then I might feel like playing 1 or 2 of those games just for nostalgia's sake, but most importantly, I want to be sure that no matter what happens in the future, if I or any of my (possible) kids will want to know what it was like back then, I have access to most if not all legacy games without having to buy a new house to store original hardware and software that sooner or later will stop working anyway.

does that stop me from spending probably much more money in gaming per year than 99% of the population? hell no



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Barozi said:
SvennoJ said:

Let's make the comparison a bit more fair then.

Is it OK to emulate old DOS titles that have been remastered, even if you own the original game?
You still get the enhancements of an emulator plus you think everyone is only emulating the version they had 20 years ago?
Lots of old classics are appearing on mobile platforms, sure it's not exactly the same game anymore, yet you can't get the original version of star wars anymore either. Is it OK to pirate it?

It's not harming the gaming industry, yet let's not pretend people are only emulating games they own and those that can't be found anywhere anymore on any platform as remaster/remake or part of a collection.

And DIzzy? You can buy it here
https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.dnastudios.dizzypoty&hl=en
Or the originals
http://www.ebay.co.uk/bhp/dizzy-game

Dizzy in its original form is not available for sale. At least not from the IP holder. 2nd hand is completely irrelevant. The IP holder won't get a single cent from these sales.

"Everyone knows that downloading a 1993 movie would be piracy, so why treat games from the same year any differently?"
That was the point in the article I was trying to counter. Games are NOT being treated differently because emulators emulate the original game, not a remaster or a super late port that are available to purchase. People nowadays don't pirate VHS versions, they pirate versions that are still available in stores.

"you think everyone is only emulating the version they had 20 years ago?"
Wow where did you get that from? If it's not possible anymore to buy the original game from the IP holder then it's completely irrelevant if you owned the game at one point or not. What else should you do? Wait for the IP holder to rerelease it on floppy discs/cartridges/cassette tapes?

Why are 2nd hand sales irrelevant, why does it suddenly matter whether the original IP holder gets any money? With books and movies, the author, actors, director can be long dead and it's still piracy! Why is it different for games, that's what the article is about.

Movies aren't availale for sale in their original form either. I can't buy 35mm reels for one, nor first release VHS or Laserdisc versions, while many modern movies have limited runs or never even get published over here. So does that make it OK to pirate them? What else should you do? Actually I watched some movies I really wanted to see but aren't available here, on You Tube. For example the TV upload from Wir Kinder vom Bahnhof Zoo. That still doesn't make it right.

Anyway, your stance is that if you can't easily buy it in the shop, go ahead and pirate it. That sounds a lot like entitlement. It's the same with tv shows nowadays. It aired somewhere in the world so now it's public domain, that's simply not the case.

If trade in old games picks up, the chance of actual carefully restored re-releases goes up, plus people will be more careful with the old stuff. We might see more things like the NES classic appearing, and more support for them. It's not hurting new games, it is hurting the chances of official emulation hardware and the value of collecting games.

But yeah, with books and movies, you wait for a rerelease, or find a second hand copy. Why are games different. Yet I do realize it has a positive aspect on the industry too. From the few movies I've pirated, I went on to buy them on blu-ray once released here. I'm still waiting for Stalker to release on blu-ray over here. (At least games don't suffer from region codes anymore) It's not any easier to get old movies. The director and original writer are long dead, still not ok to pirate it!



setsunatenshi said:
stupid opinion piece... emulation is probably the only real way old games will ever remain playable for future generations. what kind of lost revenue is being had exactly by emulation?

i have full collections of games from the 8 bit, 16 bit and 32 bit eras taking terabytes of space in one of my hard drives. sure every now and then I might feel like playing 1 or 2 of those games just for nostalgia's sake, but most importantly, I want to be sure that no matter what happens in the future, if I or any of my (possible) kids will want to know what it was like back then, I have access to most if not all legacy games without having to buy a new house to store original hardware and software that sooner or later will stop working anyway.

does that stop me from spending probably much more money in gaming per year than 99% of the population? hell no

Prepare to be disappointed (with kids). I have plenty old games too, yet they are far more interested to play with old hardware instead of trying old games on new systems. And even that is very limited. Shiny new games, especially those seen on you tube, is what they want. Same with movies. I have well over a 1000 movies on dvd and blu-ray, spanning 6 decades, plenty of fantasy and cartoons, and all they want to watch is the same few modern ones over and over!

The title is clickbait, it's not killing anything. The questions in the article are legitimate though, why are games treated differently. Why does the movie archive https://archive.org/details/moviesandfilms have to bother with copyrights and not any game archives?



fatslob-:O said:

I would believe that emulation is killing the industry if it weren't so damn inaccessible ...

I wonder how many publishers still print new copies for games that are 10+ years old, let alone 5+ years old so it's not like were hurting their software revenue when they abandon it ... 

Pretty much every argument against emultaion is closed with this.

I mean I get the movie analogy, the issue is I can get ever major hollywood movie that was released in the last 100 years easily on any major streaming services. Games, not so much. This is yet again just another perk of the medium. Killing the gaming industry? The title is screaming attention :))



Vote the Mayor for Mayor!

SvennoJ said:
Barozi said:

Dizzy in its original form is not available for sale. At least not from the IP holder. 2nd hand is completely irrelevant. The IP holder won't get a single cent from these sales.

"Everyone knows that downloading a 1993 movie would be piracy, so why treat games from the same year any differently?"
That was the point in the article I was trying to counter. Games are NOT being treated differently because emulators emulate the original game, not a remaster or a super late port that are available to purchase. People nowadays don't pirate VHS versions, they pirate versions that are still available in stores.

"you think everyone is only emulating the version they had 20 years ago?"
Wow where did you get that from? If it's not possible anymore to buy the original game from the IP holder then it's completely irrelevant if you owned the game at one point or not. What else should you do? Wait for the IP holder to rerelease it on floppy discs/cartridges/cassette tapes?

Why are 2nd hand sales irrelevant, why does it suddenly matter whether the original IP holder gets any money? With books and movies, the author, actors, director can be long dead and it's still piracy! Why is it different for games, that's what the article is about.

Movies aren't availale for sale in their original form either. I can't buy 35mm reels for one, nor first release VHS or Laserdisc versions, while many modern movies have limited runs or never even get published over here. So does that make it OK to pirate them? What else should you do? Actually I watched some movies I really wanted to see but aren't available here, on You Tube. For example the TV upload from Wir Kinder vom Bahnhof Zoo. That still doesn't make it right.

Anyway, your stance is that if you can't easily buy it in the shop, go ahead and pirate it. That sounds a lot like entitlement. It's the same with tv shows nowadays. It aired somewhere in the world so now it's public domain, that's simply not the case.

If trade in old games picks up, the chance of actual carefully restored re-releases goes up, plus people will be more careful with the old stuff. We might see more things like the NES classic appearing, and more support for them. It's not hurting new games, it is hurting the chances of official emulation hardware and the value of collecting games.

But yeah, with books and movies, you wait for a rerelease, or find a second hand copy. Why are games different. Yet I do realize it has a positive aspect on the industry too. From the few movies I've pirated, I went on to buy them on blu-ray once released here. I'm still waiting for Stalker to release on blu-ray over here. (At least games don't suffer from region codes anymore) It's not any easier to get old movies. The director and original writer are long dead, still not ok to pirate it!

"With books and movies, the author, actors, director can be long dead and it's still piracy! Why is it different for games, that's what the article is about."
But it's not different at all. If the movie or book or game is still being sold by a legal successor of the creator, they are still getting the money they earned.
If it's not available to buy they wouldn't get anything.
It's not about what's right. It's well known that it still IS piracy and I don't see anyone disputing this. But it's at least morally justifiable and that's what especially emulation is about.



As someone who's long collected for old systems I really have not seen the effects of this... prices have gotten so absurd that even fairly common old games for many (if not most) retro systems frequently cost equal to or more than new modern games. Some systems, like the turbografx 16, are so expensive that it simply isn't worth it for anyone outside of determined collectors.

In reality, the video game industry is larger and healthier than it has ever been. I haven't seen many negative effects of emulating; if anything, it's lead to an increased interest in older games and consoles among people who previously didn't even realize they existed.