You're right - there's no such thing anymore because MS didn't think that it was worth having a separate division for gaming. For all their money, MS still isn't able to compete with Sony in terms of first party support.

How many divisions does MS have? I don't know so tell me. But the end result is the same - MS cannot compete with Sony when it comes to gaming. This is clearly shown by the number of titles released by MS for the 360 this year.

I did read what he said and you're blatantly putting words in his mouth.

He basically said that Sony needs to price it to where they make a profit like MSFT is doing with XBO.  Which he made it pretty clear what he meant which once again makes me say "It made perfect sense."

  He sbasically said it would be smart to price it more because they are selling at a loss and then you said it makes no sense.  It does make sense that a company would want to make a profit, but for some reason you act as if it is a crime to want to make a profit on PS4 as well . It is fine that sony is taking a loss on each console sold but it would be preferred if they were selling it at a profit.

The ignorance in this thread is to damn high

Nope. This is Selnor's exact words:

"Maybe they should have priced PS4 with The One."

That sentence has only one meaning. If he meant that Sony should have priced the PS4 at a profit then he should have said that. He specifically said with the One. Thats $500. Like I said it makes no sense.

Arent you the guy myself and Jay520 had a argument with where you refused to admit you were wrong even though it was blatantly obvious? I feel like we going down that road again. In which case I'll excuse myself.

If they priced it with the one they would be selling for a profit now wouldnt they? ;)  Hence the meaning of what he said.

Preferrably PS4 at $450 ($500 with camera "with the one") would likely be a profit or close to it.   Just to make this absolutely clear, if PS4 raised the price $50 to make a profit you do realize that it would be the same price (With camera) as XBO right?

The rest of the conversation is a derailment.  Go read the rules and maybe stop with the "What I say goes type attitude" 

It's not a derailment. You have a particular posting style that refuses to accept you are wrong. It makes it hard to continue the discussion. So its very relevant when you reply to my post.

I will repeat what i said earlier because now you are once again mixing up arguments (you did this in the previous thread as well which makes it relevant here).

Selnor said PS4 should be priced with the One. That is $500. Without any additional value that would price sony out of competition as the Xbox One would have Kinect that is tremendous perceived value over the standalone PS4. It would have been the biggest talking point right now if that was the case. Because there would be no justification for the price to the average consumer. Pre-order  numbers would be the opposite of what it is now. That is why i said what Selnor proposed "price it with the one" made no sense.

It Sony was to include the Eye then that changes things because we have no idea what the Eye costs. Selling it at $400, $450, $500 is meaningless because we know nothing about the Eye and its costs. So its pointless to even talk about the eye.

The reason why we can talk about Kinect with estimates is because MS has already stated that they will break even or have a slight profit margin at launch.

Btw...what i say usually goes. I dont post that often and when i do I make sure of what i type and I make sure its backed up, factual and logical. Now we can do this again as it went in the other thread, its up to you. But lets face you know you lost that one

It is derailment and off-topic.  Unless you see the name JayWood2010, Jay520, and Shinobi-san in the OP somewhere?  Now the petty back and forth remarks really should stop.

How am I wrong again?  Selnor said they should have priced the PS4 with the ONe making it profitable.  Ps4 is $450 with the camera right now being sold for a loss.  $50 increase makes it $500 and likely profitable or $450 without the camera. What is wrong with any of this?

And more importantly what is factual about anythig you have said?  The only thing factual about your last post  for example is that XBO is $500.  Other than that you are just stating an opinion on what you "believe" is correct.

Im not accepting im wrong in this case because what I said isnt wrong.  PS4 IS BEING SOLD AT A LOSS.  That is a fact.  and"IF" they increased the price by $50 it would be the "exact" same price as XBO and likely profitably with the camera.  That is all 100% true unless the PS4 is taking a bigger loss then we are lead to believe.

If you are going to reply, tell me and everybody else how the bolded italics is false.  Because if it is true then you need to accept that and move on.  If it is false then show everybody how it is false instead of going off-topic then posting opinions and stating them as facts.

That is not what derailment is. Do you see Sony in the article?

Yet here we are discussing Sony and a range of other sub related topics. If someone replies to my post in an unreasonable manner then that persons posting history is relevant to our discussion. If you feel strongly about it being off topic then report me and lets see where that goes.

Everything i said is factual, logical and backed up. What part of what i said isnt? Point it out.

Jay what you are saying is different from what Selnor said. Please realise here that you jumped onto a a post i made to Selnor not to you. This is why i pointed out that you mixing up arguments. I am not trying to attack you. Selnor was very clear in his post. I use quotation marks for a reason. "Maybe they should have priced PS4 with The One." Price the PS4 at $500. That is what "with" means in that context. He didnt say close to it...he didnt say at break even for Sony he didnt say at profit for Sony. He said with the One. That is the statement i said didnt make sense.

Discussion about the eye is really pointless unless we know what the hell it costs. We dont know what it costs. So how do you $500 is at a profit? Then you back where you started.

And why on earth are bolding " PS4 IS BEING SOLD AT A LOSS." not once have I questioned that in this thread.

Wait, some people actually thought MS was in trouble? wtf lol?