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Forums - PC Discussion - Dota 2 announced for PC and Mac, coming 2011, brings huge innovations

"Valve's approach to Dota 2 is unusual in that the gameplay itself is remaining almost entirely untouched."

"This approach means that Dota 2 basically is DotA-Allstars with new technology."

So why should I play it as opposed to something like league of legends that is trying to improve the gameplay.  You may criticize LoL for being "DOTA like", but it is the game that has been trying to evolve the genre the most (other than Demigod).  I criticized HoN for being too much like DOTA (from what I have read about it).

Is DOTA 2 going to have any amazing gameplay innovations or is it just going to look pretty with a better matchmaking system.  Don't get me wrong, a great matchmaking system is awesome, but I was hoping for more.




 

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Senlis said:

"Valve's approach to Dota 2 is unusual in that the gameplay itself is remaining almost entirely untouched."

"This approach means that Dota 2 basically is DotA-Allstars with new technology."

So why should I play it as opposed to something like league of legends that is trying to improve the gameplay.  You may criticize LoL for being "DOTA like", but it is the game that has been trying to evolve the genre the most (other than Demigod).  I criticized HoN for being too much like DOTA (from what I have read about it).

Is DOTA 2 going to have any amazing gameplay innovations or is it just going to look pretty with a better matchmaking system.  Don't get me wrong, a great matchmaking system is awesome, but I was hoping for more.

Well, it will be under the HAVOX physics engine and an improved SOURCE engine as well, so I bet that they can achieve some good gameplay innovations like physics and distance affecting ranged attackers like Traxxex or Nevermore. 

I can see some pretty nifty applications to a physics engine, like Sniper's Scattershot doing more damage from an above-enemy position and so on.



Current PC Build

CPU - i7 8700K 3.7 GHz (4.7 GHz turbo) 6 cores OC'd to 5.2 GHz with Watercooling (Hydro Series H110i) | MB - Gigabyte Z370 HD3P ATX | Gigabyte GTX 1080ti Gaming OC BLACK 11G (1657 MHz Boost Core / 11010 MHz Memory) | RAM - Corsair DIMM 32GB DDR4, 2400 MHz | PSU - Corsair CX650M (80+ Bronze) 650W | Audio - Asus Essence STX II 7.1 | Monitor - Samsung U28E590D 4K UHD, Freesync, 1 ms, 60 Hz, 28"

lestatdark said:
Senlis said:

"Valve's approach to Dota 2 is unusual in that the gameplay itself is remaining almost entirely untouched."

"This approach means that Dota 2 basically is DotA-Allstars with new technology."

So why should I play it as opposed to something like league of legends that is trying to improve the gameplay.  You may criticize LoL for being "DOTA like", but it is the game that has been trying to evolve the genre the most (other than Demigod).  I criticized HoN for being too much like DOTA (from what I have read about it).

Is DOTA 2 going to have any amazing gameplay innovations or is it just going to look pretty with a better matchmaking system.  Don't get me wrong, a great matchmaking system is awesome, but I was hoping for more.

Well, it will be under the HAVOX physics engine and an improved SOURCE engine as well, so I bet that they can achieve some good gameplay innovations like physics and distance affecting ranged attackers like Traxxex or Nevermore. 

I can see some pretty nifty applications to a physics engine, like Sniper's Scattershot doing more damage from an above-enemy position and so on.


LoL already has a hero that has an attack that has attack that's damage is based on distance, and if you go to far with the physics you will screw up the 'tightness' of the gameplay, which probably isn't a good idea for a competitive game like dota IMO. And I know Valve will want to get the game into the professional gaming circuit and anything that would jeopardise that would be cut. And from the fact that they make a point of saying the gameplay will be almost exactly the same as DotA any new additions like that would have to wait until they have implemented the over 100 existing heroes if ever, as they mentioned that the gameplay will be untouched so none of the existing heroes will be changed much if at all. 



@TheVoxelman on twitter

Check out my hype threads: Cyberpunk, and The Witcher 3!

zarx said:
lestatdark said:

Well, it will be under the HAVOX physics engine and an improved SOURCE engine as well, so I bet that they can achieve some good gameplay innovations like physics and distance affecting ranged attackers like Traxxex or Nevermore. 

I can see some pretty nifty applications to a physics engine, like Sniper's Scattershot doing more damage from an above-enemy position and so on.


LoL already has a hero that has an attack that has attack that's damage is based on distance, and if you go to far with the physics you will screw up the 'tightness' of the gameplay, which probably isn't a good idea for a competitive game like dota IMO. And I know Valve will want to get the game into the professional gaming circuit and anything that would jeopardise that would be cut. And from the fact that they make a point of saying the gameplay will be almost exactly the same as DotA any new additions like that would have to wait until they have implemented the over 100 existing heroes if ever, as they mentioned that the gameplay will be untouched so none of the existing heroes will be changed much if at all. 

Well, that sucks




 

Senlis said:
zarx said:
lestatdark said:

Well, it will be under the HAVOX physics engine and an improved SOURCE engine as well, so I bet that they can achieve some good gameplay innovations like physics and distance affecting ranged attackers like Traxxex or Nevermore. 

I can see some pretty nifty applications to a physics engine, like Sniper's Scattershot doing more damage from an above-enemy position and so on.


LoL already has a hero that has an attack that has attack that's damage is based on distance, and if you go to far with the physics you will screw up the 'tightness' of the gameplay, which probably isn't a good idea for a competitive game like dota IMO. And I know Valve will want to get the game into the professional gaming circuit and anything that would jeopardise that would be cut. And from the fact that they make a point of saying the gameplay will be almost exactly the same as DotA any new additions like that would have to wait until they have implemented the over 100 existing heroes if ever, as they mentioned that the gameplay will be untouched so none of the existing heroes will be changed much if at all. 

Well, that sucks

yup looks like DotA 2 is going to be HoN with a few more old dota heroes and running in the source engine. At least LoL is trying to bring new elements and heroes into the genre. I don't think we really need another cut & passed DotA allstars but I still know because it's valve DotA 2 will probably still end up being the most popular Multiplayer Online Battle Arena in the world...



@TheVoxelman on twitter

Check out my hype threads: Cyberpunk, and The Witcher 3!

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zarx said:
lestatdark said:
zarx said:

if this is true http://icefrogtruth.blogspot.com/2010/10/truth.html I'm calling a boycott.

Probably fake tho...

I personally love those type of blogs, it's almost in the same level of "A friend of mine was told by his friend that someone he knows told him that..."

Defamation via the internet, one of the most cowardly and fake-prone tools of the modern day. 


What makes it even funnier is the fact that the EA Mythic guy was about the same time lol. Also this http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2010/10/14/the-truth-about-rock-paper-shotgun/

THE PLOT THICKENS http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2010/10/15/an-anonymous-email-arrives-from-valve/



@TheVoxelman on twitter

Check out my hype threads: Cyberpunk, and The Witcher 3!

I dont think they should UP the graphics too much and change the art style much either because DOTA players like their game because of what it looks like and how fluid it plays (not laggy, depending on their connections). I have a feeling that the people playing DOTA will not move on to DOTA 2 for long... I guess it'll depend on how good this game will be for DOTA players (Since for the most part, they dont like playing anything else other than DOTA).



zarx said:
lestatdark said:
Senlis said:

"Valve's approach to Dota 2 is unusual in that the gameplay itself is remaining almost entirely untouched."

"This approach means that Dota 2 basically is DotA-Allstars with new technology."

So why should I play it as opposed to something like league of legends that is trying to improve the gameplay.  You may criticize LoL for being "DOTA like", but it is the game that has been trying to evolve the genre the most (other than Demigod).  I criticized HoN for being too much like DOTA (from what I have read about it).

Is DOTA 2 going to have any amazing gameplay innovations or is it just going to look pretty with a better matchmaking system.  Don't get me wrong, a great matchmaking system is awesome, but I was hoping for more.

Well, it will be under the HAVOX physics engine and an improved SOURCE engine as well, so I bet that they can achieve some good gameplay innovations like physics and distance affecting ranged attackers like Traxxex or Nevermore. 

I can see some pretty nifty applications to a physics engine, like Sniper's Scattershot doing more damage from an above-enemy position and so on.


LoL already has a hero that has an attack that has attack that's damage is based on distance, and if you go to far with the physics you will screw up the 'tightness' of the gameplay, which probably isn't a good idea for a competitive game like dota IMO. And I know Valve will want to get the game into the professional gaming circuit and anything that would jeopardise that would be cut. And from the fact that they make a point of saying the gameplay will be almost exactly the same as DotA any new additions like that would have to wait until they have implemented the over 100 existing heroes if ever, as they mentioned that the gameplay will be untouched so none of the existing heroes will be changed much if at all. 

DoTA had that way before LoL. Mirana's Elune's Arrow does 0.5 extra stun damage for every 150 steps that the arrow travels; Enchantress Impetus deals variable Úmage of the number of distance travelled by the attack (from 15% to 25%); Storm Spirit's Ball Lightning deals 16 damage per 100 steps travelled. And these are just some very few examples. 

I disagree on the physics department, an actual physics engine will make for a far more balanced game, making ranged attacks more deadly and with far more strategic play than it current is. 

For example, most of the Long Range stun attacks from various characters (Nerubian Assasin, Demon Witch and so on) travel a straight path that still go over a slight gap, especially on the middle lane of the map, which has that small valley like path when it's crossed by the river. With a proper physics engine and actual height difference, it could completely block out those kind of attacks. 

I could see tons of applications and balancing for such a physics engine that could bring a more competitive edge to DoTA.



Current PC Build

CPU - i7 8700K 3.7 GHz (4.7 GHz turbo) 6 cores OC'd to 5.2 GHz with Watercooling (Hydro Series H110i) | MB - Gigabyte Z370 HD3P ATX | Gigabyte GTX 1080ti Gaming OC BLACK 11G (1657 MHz Boost Core / 11010 MHz Memory) | RAM - Corsair DIMM 32GB DDR4, 2400 MHz | PSU - Corsair CX650M (80+ Bronze) 650W | Audio - Asus Essence STX II 7.1 | Monitor - Samsung U28E590D 4K UHD, Freesync, 1 ms, 60 Hz, 28"

zarx said:
zarx said:
lestatdark said:
zarx said:

if this is true http://icefrogtruth.blogspot.com/2010/10/truth.html I'm calling a boycott.

Probably fake tho...

I personally love those type of blogs, it's almost in the same level of "A friend of mine was told by his friend that someone he knows told him that..."

Defamation via the internet, one of the most cowardly and fake-prone tools of the modern day. 


What makes it even funnier is the fact that the EA Mythic guy was about the same time lol. Also this http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2010/10/14/the-truth-about-rock-paper-shotgun/

THE PLOT THICKENS http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2010/10/15/an-anonymous-email-arrives-from-valve/

"Now that I’ve established who I am and the lengths I’m willing to go to “kick it up a notch” (See Proof #2, above), I want to tell you the real truth. I work on an unrelated project from IceFrog called “Fart Cops.” Now, if you read this blogspot post about IceFrog, you’re probably asking yourself, “Hold on now. Do the police patrol FOR farts, or do they fight crime WITH farts?” Let me just tell you that you will find out the terrifying truth in 2014. Or you would have, if not for IceFrog.

Ever since IceFrog joined Valve he has been poisonous to my “Fart Cops” project. All of the slowly mounting enthusiasm I am convinced I had been building around “Fart Cops” immediately went away once IceFrog and DOTA showed up. He has so far proved incredibly hard to work with on “Fart Cops” and is absolutely impossible to talk to about abandoning his stupid project to work fulltime on mine. This is not just my opinion. Everybody knows that IceFrog refuses to work on “Fart Cops.” Much like society in a dystopian future hates farts. IceFrog’s made me so angry that I just accidentally ruined the twist ending to my own game. Also, IceFrog removed my Backspace key. (This has been controversial and everybody knows this.)

Now I will provide proof.

1. Go to wikipedia.org.
2. Misspell “Emerel Lagasse” in the search field.
3. Try to hit “Backspace”.
4. If you’re on my computer, YOU CAN’T.

Those of you not in the game industry like I am might not see how important all of this is. Imagine my game idea (“Fart Cops”) was an Arby’s, my Backspace key was a Jamba Juice, and IceFrog is still IceFrog, and HE SMASHES BOTH RESTAURANTS. He would be in jail if he did that! But the rules of metaphor are different and unfair, like being imprisoned for fart crime. Only you can help me change that. Write 
Gabe Newell and tell him you are willing to pay $59.99 for “Fart Cops”. He said earlier that if ten thousand people “were stupid enough” to write him asking for it, he’d make it. Then he laughed and went out for lunch with IceFrog."

I mean seriously?  



Current PC Build

CPU - i7 8700K 3.7 GHz (4.7 GHz turbo) 6 cores OC'd to 5.2 GHz with Watercooling (Hydro Series H110i) | MB - Gigabyte Z370 HD3P ATX | Gigabyte GTX 1080ti Gaming OC BLACK 11G (1657 MHz Boost Core / 11010 MHz Memory) | RAM - Corsair DIMM 32GB DDR4, 2400 MHz | PSU - Corsair CX650M (80+ Bronze) 650W | Audio - Asus Essence STX II 7.1 | Monitor - Samsung U28E590D 4K UHD, Freesync, 1 ms, 60 Hz, 28"

lestatdark said:
zarx said:
lestatdark said:
Senlis said:

"Valve's approach to Dota 2 is unusual in that the gameplay itself is remaining almost entirely untouched."

"This approach means that Dota 2 basically is DotA-Allstars with new technology."

So why should I play it as opposed to something like league of legends that is trying to improve the gameplay.  You may criticize LoL for being "DOTA like", but it is the game that has been trying to evolve the genre the most (other than Demigod).  I criticized HoN for being too much like DOTA (from what I have read about it).

Is DOTA 2 going to have any amazing gameplay innovations or is it just going to look pretty with a better matchmaking system.  Don't get me wrong, a great matchmaking system is awesome, but I was hoping for more.

Well, it will be under the HAVOX physics engine and an improved SOURCE engine as well, so I bet that they can achieve some good gameplay innovations like physics and distance affecting ranged attackers like Traxxex or Nevermore. 

I can see some pretty nifty applications to a physics engine, like Sniper's Scattershot doing more damage from an above-enemy position and so on.


LoL already has a hero that has an attack that has attack that's damage is based on distance, and if you go to far with the physics you will screw up the 'tightness' of the gameplay, which probably isn't a good idea for a competitive game like dota IMO. And I know Valve will want to get the game into the professional gaming circuit and anything that would jeopardise that would be cut. And from the fact that they make a point of saying the gameplay will be almost exactly the same as DotA any new additions like that would have to wait until they have implemented the over 100 existing heroes if ever, as they mentioned that the gameplay will be untouched so none of the existing heroes will be changed much if at all. 

DoTA had that way before LoL. Mirana's Elune's Arrow does 0.5 extra stun damage for every 150 steps that the arrow travels; Enchantress Impetus deals variable Úmage of the number of distance travelled by the attack (from 15% to 25%); Storm Spirit's Ball Lightning deals 16 damage per 100 steps travelled. And these are just some very few examples. 

I disagree on the physics department, an actual physics engine will make for a far more balanced game, making ranged attacks more deadly and with far more strategic play than it current is. 

For example, most of the Long Range stun attacks from various characters (Nerubian Assasin, Demon Witch and so on) travel a straight path that still go over a slight gap, especially on the middle lane of the map, which has that small valley like path when it's crossed by the river. With a proper physics engine and actual height difference, it could completely block out those kind of attacks. 

I could see tons of applications and balancing for such a physics engine that could bring a more competitive edge to DoTA.


Sounds IMBA LOL!

I wonder if faceless void will get some tweaking in DOTA2 he's overpowered.