Bdbdbd: Ignoring the fact that your post is quite confusing, I could probably argue with you, but I'll settle with the fact that we probably wouldn't be worrying about any government if life was a such a dance on roses.

And no, Chinese Communism is not Capitalism, and Capitalism is not superior to it. Capitalism is the belief in a free market - something that has yet to be realized in the real world. The Chinese government however (at times) evokes complete control of the market. Someone once described it as the worst parts of Communism and Capitalism put together, but it clearly works. It just goes to show that a dictatorship, if handled correctly, is a more efficient form of government than a democracy.

I'd be estatic if Ron Paul got the Republican nomination. I'd prefer to vote for him instead of anyone else that is currently running for office. Libertarian viewpoints best match up with my beliefs and I do see a huge increase in the number of people (especially younger people) that fall into the Libertarian mold then they do as a Republican or Democrat. Even though Ron Paul is a "republican" he's still a Libertarian deep down.

@jjseth - That's just the internet. It's the haven of libertarians.

No, really.

I've run into a lot of them that I never met on the internet. They are out there, just most who talk and have libertarian views refer to themselves as a independent or republican just because it's the closest they can find that fits their ideology the best and don't think that it's "cool" or practical to consider themselves a libertarian out in the open.

The key is to still maintain skill at that age. I may be able to play baseball today, but being able to do it at his age and being able to do it well are two different things.

hibikir said: While I want the Republican Party to pay libertarians more attention, his economic policies are complete and utter madness, so I hope he doesn't get elected. Flat sales tax and no income tax means one thing: You'll be worse off the more money you spend, compared to your income. If you save a lot of money, you pay less taxes. If you spend most of your money, you get taxed out of the wazoo. Who happens to spend most of the money they earn? Poor people. Who invests most of their money? Rich people, that cover most of their needs with a fraction of their earnings. So a tax system like that would crush the poor and make the biggest fortunes in the country very happy... precisely the opposite of what the country needs. I think that leaving people unable to pay for their healthcare due to 'market conditions' is the sign of a third world country, and that's precisely what a libertarian economic policy would get us. I agree with him on most constitutional issues though, so I do share more with him than with any other Republican candidate.

If you are talking about Liberalism, you have to remember that the ideals of the French revolution are the true goals for any libertarian: not only liberté, but also fraternité and especially égalité are important. That means that people should have the same chances at the beginning and therefore the educational system and the healthcare should not depend on your income; it should be something that everyone can get. That shows that social questions are not neglected by Libertarians, and something highly unsocial like a taxe system based solely on sales taxes can't be the goal of a libertarian politic. On the other hand, it is a fact that the tax system nowadays is way too complicated, especially the income taxe. Due to that, the income tax should be made easier radically, you should have to pay a certain percentage of your income without any exceptions.

Ending Irag war
Fair Tax
No way he's gonna win
He makes too much sense for a politician.

But if the evangelicals would . . .

Oh Crap!  Pat Robertson is endorsing Guiliani

oh well  

His tax wouldn't be fair if it's a flat sales tax across the board!

Rich people don't spend money. They INVEST money.

The poorer you are, the higher the percentage of your income is SPENT rather than INVESTED. Therefore, a flat sales tax actually overtaxes the poor and undertaxes the rich, who shouldn't care less about taxes, but oooooh how badly they do!

"Death tax" like what? Stupid doublespeaking bastards.

Helios said: Sqrl said: Parokki said: I'm about 3/4 of the entire political spectrum to the left from this guy, greatly enjoying the free healthcare and university education my country provides, but I wouldn't at all if this guy became the next president of the United States. He reminds me of James Kirk, John Sheridan, and all the other awesome American leaders in fiction that never seem to exist in real life. FYI - Your healthcare nor your education is free, thats why you pay taxes. The only thing you really have is less say in what you get for that money, next time you get annoyed with high prices in the EU relative to other regions you should remember that. If people want to support this idealogy thats their choice, but lets not call it what it isn't. And it most certainly isn't free. Way to patronize the guy. Do you honestly think he doesn't know how his own tax system works? In the case of Parokki, yes, it is technically ‘free’, because he hasn't paid a lot of tax yet. But that's not the point of Socialism, obviously. The system exists primarily for the less fortunate - because they would never be able to pay for private services - as well as a means for the government to regulate how society grows and works. Yes, over here (Scandinavia/Europe), the government isn't considered evil. So, for those who pay very little taxes (they exist, of course, and enjoy a much superior life to their American-poverty brethren), it's ‘free’. And those who do pay for those people, well, they can afford it. Now, Americans deluding themselves into thinking their country/ideology/garden/whatever is actually superior to others, rather than a functioning one... That’s another matter. Me? I don’t favour any system, but (Chinese) Communism is clearly where it’s at if you want progress. Also, when I complain about prices, I complain about the difference after the VAT has been accounted for. Needless to say, it's still quite monumental, and is mostly a result of corporate greed.

Not sure what gave you the impression of patronizing the guy.  The fact is that he made a mistake in saying it was free.  A mistake that is almost certainly born out of the politicians propaganda that started the idea.  I hardly see how my pointing out that it isn't free is anything but pointing out the truth of the matter.  And if that truth scathes you then that is not my fault.

As far as which system is better and specifically bringing up Americans, thats on your head.  I didn't mention it in the slightest yet you assumed because you are defensive about such things.  Perhaps you should re-read what I said and understand that I wasn't attacking his system but rather correcting a false belief about that system.  Each soverign nation and it's citizens are entitled to determine the type of government and laws they shall adhere to, but a part of that is that each citizen should be keenly aware of what those laws entail.  And far too often socialism spreads under the guise of "free" this or that.  Its not free its something that people pay for and the government decides what you get.  If that is the system those countries want then that is their choice but the people should at least understand the system, or would you disagree with that?

I would argue that most people do not understand how the system works or statements like "I have free healthcare" would never be made.

In closing, if it is your opinion that my stance that people should know exactly how the system works is a position opposed to that system then I would ask what kind of honesty exists within that system?  What kind of legitimacy is there in a system that to explain it is to stand against it?

 

Rubang B said: His tax wouldn't be fair if it's a flat sales tax across the board! Rich people don't spend money. They INVEST money. The poorer you are, the higher the percentage of your income is SPENT rather than INVESTED. Therefore, a flat sales tax actually overtaxes the poor and undertaxes the rich, who shouldn't care less about taxes, but oooooh how badly they do! "Death tax" like what? Stupid doublespeaking bastards.

 If you had noticed or read up on teh fair tax that many politicians are beginning to back, there would be a prebate given that would account for average costs of necessities.

 

http://www.fairtax.org/PDF/FairTaxPrebateExplained2007.pdf

 

This PDF will explain to you how the prebate works so poor families aren't hit as hard from teh sales tax increase.