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Forums - Nintendo - I can live without the Zelda Overworld Theme Now

Mr.Awsome on 11 December 2009
Pineapple said:
Khuutra said:
Pineapple said:

Hasn't there always been a difference between the music in the 3D Zeldas and the 2D Zeldas? At a quick glance right now, nearly all the titles in the 2D titles (including the 2D ones) are far higher pitched than the 3D Zeldas.

I would say that this isn't a radical change at all. Essentially, what this might be is

In the original titles, the music was higher pitched and rather hectic.

Then OoT comes and it turns into 3D, with lower pitched music that's less hectic. It plays a less important role, actually.

And now this is more of a continuation and development of the 2D style again.  It's the logical continuation, isn't it?

I.... think it's more complicated than that. Melody and harmony for overworld themes in this series tend to be based at least somewhat on the original Overworld Theme.

I admit I never thought of the games' soundtracks in terms of pitch, though, that's a new perspective for me

But it is a wide departure from the ancient Overworld Theme of yore

Oh, I'd say that the Overworld Theme is an exception. Most of the themes that were taken from LttP and added to OoT probably were.

what themes from alttp are present in oot besides zelda's lullaby and kakariko village? none, thats how many.



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Helios on 11 December 2009
Mr.Awsome said:
Soriku said:

There was a standard overworld theme? OoT, TWW, MM, TP, PH all had different themes...

lol. a young gamer. ill give you a hint in addition to khuutra's: MM has the standard overworld theme. last game (i believe) to feature it in the overworld.

Nope.



c0rd on 11 December 2009
Helios said:

This man speaks the truth!

However, re-used music is actually one of my pet-peves with SMW (and Sunshine) as well. Nearly every song is an arrangement of one single main theme, and while the theme isn't bad by any means, it's still lazy and drab work by the composer. That is why Yoshi's Island's soundtrack is better than that of it's precursor, much like everything else about the game.

The arrangements of the Zelda series, on the other hand, are only subtly based on the Zelda main theme, and such variations form the basis of my favorite kind of music. I hope Zelda Wii's soundtrack is as large a leap for the series music as OoT's was (please let it be orchestrated/composed by Kondo, please let it be orchestrated/composed by Kondo, please let it...).

Oh, I understand that. Super Mario World wasn't a great example, I guess I was only comparing the overworld themes between games rather than overall soundtracks.

Game soundtracks nowadays seem to re-use music way too often. Now, I could be wrong, but I don't think it was the same a decade ago. I'm not sure if it's because of laziness or higher demands due to improved sound quality (I'm no expert here), but the result is meh. I'd take a wide assortment of SNES music over orchestrated rehashes any day.


@Khuutra: I kid you not. I guess that's what happens when you grow up with stuff like Duke Nukem, Goldeneye and Diablo...



Khuutra on 11 December 2009
c0rd said:

Oh, I understand that. Super Mario World wasn't a great example, I guess I was only comparing the overworld themes between games rather than overall soundtracks.

Game soundtracks nowadays seem to re-use music way too often. Now, I could be wrong, but I don't think it was the same a decade ago. I'm not sure if it's because of laziness or higher demands due to improved sound quality (I'm no expert here), but the result is meh. I'd take a wide assortment of SNES music over orchestrated rehashes any day.


@Khuutra: I kid you not. I guess that's what happens when you grow up with stuff like Duke Nukem, Goldeneye and Diablo...

Part of it is the fact that coming up with wildly different melodies and harmonies for many different songs is very, very, very difficult! Ocarina of Time must have been a Herculean effort.

More, building on a single theme is a legitimate mode of composition: I think God of War is a good example of how this can be done well.

As to the comment directed at me. it's really just bizarre. I mean, he's never even heard of it? Did he never play the GBA games, or New Super Mario Bros.?



Pineapple on 11 December 2009
Mr.Awsome said:
Pineapple said:
Khuutra said:
Pineapple said:

Hasn't there always been a difference between the music in the 3D Zeldas and the 2D Zeldas? At a quick glance right now, nearly all the titles in the 2D titles (including the 2D ones) are far higher pitched than the 3D Zeldas.

I would say that this isn't a radical change at all. Essentially, what this might be is

In the original titles, the music was higher pitched and rather hectic.

Then OoT comes and it turns into 3D, with lower pitched music that's less hectic. It plays a less important role, actually.

And now this is more of a continuation and development of the 2D style again.  It's the logical continuation, isn't it?

I.... think it's more complicated than that. Melody and harmony for overworld themes in this series tend to be based at least somewhat on the original Overworld Theme.

I admit I never thought of the games' soundtracks in terms of pitch, though, that's a new perspective for me

But it is a wide departure from the ancient Overworld Theme of yore

Oh, I'd say that the Overworld Theme is an exception. Most of the themes that were taken from LttP and added to OoT probably were.

what themes from alttp are present in oot besides zelda's lullaby and kakariko village? none, thats how many.

Ugh, I messed up there. I intended to say "most of the themes that were taken from the 2D titles and added to the 3D titles probably were", but that's still a sentence that's both malformed and could be incorrect. My point was essentially that the songs that are in both the 2D and 3D games cannot be compared to prove a point here.

But, as you mentioned, not a lot of songs are in both the 2D ones and 3D ones, and what I said is really rather obvious.



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Helios on 11 December 2009
Pineapple said:
Khuutra said:
Pineapple said:

Hasn't there always been a difference between the music in the 3D Zeldas and the 2D Zeldas? At a quick glance right now, nearly all the titles in the 2D titles (including the 2D ones) are far higher pitched than the 3D Zeldas.

I would say that this isn't a radical change at all. Essentially, what this might be is

In the original titles, the music was higher pitched and rather hectic.

Then OoT comes and it turns into 3D, with lower pitched music that's less hectic. It plays a less important role, actually.

And now this is more of a continuation and development of the 2D style again.  It's the logical continuation, isn't it?

I.... think it's more complicated than that. Melody and harmony for overworld themes in this series tend to be based at least somewhat on the original Overworld Theme.

I admit I never thought of the games' soundtracks in terms of pitch, though, that's a new perspective for me

But it is a wide departure from the ancient Overworld Theme of yore

Oh, I'd say that the Overworld Theme is an exception. Most of the themes that were taken from LttP and added to OoT probably were.

I don't... I don't see any real relevance as pertaining to this psuedo-analytical observation. What does pitch have to do with anything? I also question whatever basis you have for your claim - certainly the 3D games music can be more atmospheric at times, owing to the fact that they are more immersive by nature, but I really don't think of most of the non-ambient OoT/TWW tracks as lower pitched than those of the 2D games.

I guess I'm just having trouble seeing your point, as this thread is mainly about the melodic/harmonic elements of music.

 



ClaudeLv250 on 11 December 2009
Mr.Awsome said:
Pineapple said:
Khuutra said:
Pineapple said:

Hasn't there always been a difference between the music in the 3D Zeldas and the 2D Zeldas? At a quick glance right now, nearly all the titles in the 2D titles (including the 2D ones) are far higher pitched than the 3D Zeldas.

I would say that this isn't a radical change at all. Essentially, what this might be is

In the original titles, the music was higher pitched and rather hectic.

Then OoT comes and it turns into 3D, with lower pitched music that's less hectic. It plays a less important role, actually.

And now this is more of a continuation and development of the 2D style again.  It's the logical continuation, isn't it?

I.... think it's more complicated than that. Melody and harmony for overworld themes in this series tend to be based at least somewhat on the original Overworld Theme.

I admit I never thought of the games' soundtracks in terms of pitch, though, that's a new perspective for me

But it is a wide departure from the ancient Overworld Theme of yore

Oh, I'd say that the Overworld Theme is an exception. Most of the themes that were taken from LttP and added to OoT probably were.

what themes from alttp are present in oot besides zelda's lullaby and kakariko village? none, thats how many.

Ganon's theme, the Fairy theme and the Master Sword theme.

You should at least know what you're talking about before getting a sassy attitude with other members.

 



Tag - "No trolling on my watch!"

Khuutra on 11 December 2009
Helios said:

I don't... I don't see any real relevance as pertaining to this psuedo-analytical observation. What does pitch have to do with anything? I also question whatever basis you have for your claim - certainly the 3D games music can be more atmospheric at times, owing to the fact that they are more immersive by nature, but I really don't think of most of the non-ambient OoT/TWW tracks as lower pitched than those of the 2D games.

I guess I'm just having trouble seeing your point, as this thread is mainly about the melodic/harmonic elements of music.

It's grown in that direction but at heart it's really about how awesome the Spirit Tracks overworld theme is, especially in-game



c0rd on 11 December 2009
Khuutra said:

Part of it is the fact that coming up with wildly different melodies and harmonies for many different songs is very, very, very difficult! Ocarina of Time must have been a Herculean effort.

More, building on a single theme is a legitimate mode of composition: I think God of War is a good example of how this can be done well.

As to the comment directed at me. it's really just bizarre. I mean, he's never even heard of it? Did he never play the GBA games, or New Super Mario Bros.?

Oh, I definitely understand that. I'm just unsure of why they (seem to have) managed to pull it off more often in the past than nowadays.

I've never played God of War, but I'm sure it can be done alright. I'm definitely more annoyed when the games don't have their own themes, and instead borrow heavily from previous games in the franchise.

My bro has definitely heard of 2D Mario, but he's never played it. We're not big on handhelds, I can't even recall what games we had other than Golden Sun and Pokemon (the DS is the first handheld I've really taken seriously). He has played Super Mario 64, Sunshine, and Galaxy, but as you know... they're nothing like 2D Mario. I guess you wouldn't know the gameplay mechanics unless you've actually played the game.



Khuutra on 11 December 2009
c0rd said:

Oh, I definitely understand that. I'm just unsure of why they (seem to have) managed to pull it off more often in the past than nowadays.

I've never played God of War, but I'm sure it can be done alright. I'm definitely more annoyed when the games don't have their own themes, and instead borrow heavily from previous games in the franchise.

My bro has definitely heard of 2D Mario, but he's never played it. We're not big on handhelds, I can't even recall what games we had other than Golden Sun and Pokemon (the DS is the first handheld I've really taken seriously). He has played Super Mario 64, Sunshine, and Galaxy, but as you know... they're nothing like 2D Mario. I guess you wouldn't know the gameplay mechanics unless you've actually played the game.

Generally? Soundtracks were shorter. Tae a guess at how long Link to the Past's soundtrack is if you line all the songs up in a row. Just a ballpark figure!

Now make the same guess for Twilight Princess