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Forums - Sony Discussion - Sony tackles BBC over 'PS3 failure' report

Cypher1980 on 20 September 2009

Oh GOD read the comments on that Vid link....

The fanboys on You Tube make the VG Chartz fanboys seem like reasonable people.



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mjk45 on 20 September 2009

@ Evocation 1% of 2.5 million is 25,000 so if that figure is correct it's 0.5% of machines



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pterodactyl on 20 September 2009
crumas2 said:
welshbloke said:
In some small way it was inevitable that Sony would get complaints around the YLOD. The comparison will always be drawn to the Microsoft RROD. Rightly or wrongly, I think at the real heart of this is the fact that Sony charge around £150 to repair the console although the price quoted above is less (probably a less vat amount).

The current charge for the warranty repair is driving people to 3rd parties which in turn will mean that Sony figures will not be accurate. I cannot see the figures being much higher though than the quote supplied by Sony. The majority of these repairs are out of warranty so people will always find the cheapest alternative which is not Sony which in turn means Sony may well be partially isolated from the failure rate.

It would make more sense for Sony to tackle the repair costs and spend less time moaing. Having watched this programe before they will likely make Sony out to be the anti christ and the damage will be done.

You bring up an excellent point... if Sony is so determined to prove that the issue exists a tiny percentage of the time, then they should put their money where their mouth is and eat the cost on those repairs.  But of course they won't... Sony is determined to make consumers who purchased the PS3, even those who purchased it for $600, eat that cost.  If I bought a console for $600 and it died 13 months later and Sony refused to fix it for free, I would be going to someone like Watchdog looking for relief.

Sony may win this battle legally, but they're going to lose it in the hearts and minds of consumers.

Going to? They haven't lost the battle for consumers' hearts and minds yet?



Icyedge on 20 September 2009
Cypher1980 said:
alanshearer said:
Cypher1980 said:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aRyRxKlo9-o

Here it is in all its glory. Dont really think SONY have got a lot to complain about.

They might be miffed at the "stunt" attitude that Watchdog took but they were given the right of reply and chose not to use it.

Legally nothing can be done.

The only people who say Sony hasnt got anything to complain about are anti PS3/Sony people. It was a stitchup plain and simple.

Well I beg to differ. I've watched it from start to finish and it seems a little sensationalist, but other than that, on the level.

I dont think the gas pockets are the cause either and give the program makers their due, they did say that SONY told them it was not the cause.

However it still doesnt tell us what is.

The fact that one blast in the magic oven fixed all 16 consoles (4 albeit briefly) tends to point to a single problem causing the failure.

Heck time will bring out the truth so lets no one get het up.

If YLOD's keep occuring SONY will be forced to fix em.

If it really is a small minority of owners with launch machines then the problems should eventually fade away.

Still from a tech perspective its really interesting.

3 Years after we can tell that its not an inherent fault, an inherent fault would have cause problem faster and on a lot more units. Now if you say that a PS3 may overheat and desolder when enclose, this is a good affirmation. The fact that the magic oven fixed all 16 consoles sure point to a single problem, overheating followed by desoldering. But did the owners read the manual, its written to not enclose the PS3 and to leave at least 4 inches from a wall surface. If you think about it, 4 inches is a lot compare to what most people would use for electronic equipment.



Cypher1980 on 21 September 2009
Icyedge said:
Cypher1980 said:
alanshearer said:
Cypher1980 said:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aRyRxKlo9-o

Here it is in all its glory. Dont really think SONY have got a lot to complain about.

They might be miffed at the "stunt" attitude that Watchdog took but they were given the right of reply and chose not to use it.

Legally nothing can be done.

The only people who say Sony hasnt got anything to complain about are anti PS3/Sony people. It was a stitchup plain and simple.

Well I beg to differ. I've watched it from start to finish and it seems a little sensationalist, but other than that, on the level.

I dont think the gas pockets are the cause either and give the program makers their due, they did say that SONY told them it was not the cause.

However it still doesnt tell us what is.

The fact that one blast in the magic oven fixed all 16 consoles (4 albeit briefly) tends to point to a single problem causing the failure.

Heck time will bring out the truth so lets no one get het up.

If YLOD's keep occuring SONY will be forced to fix em.

If it really is a small minority of owners with launch machines then the problems should eventually fade away.

Still from a tech perspective its really interesting.

3 Years after we can tell that its not an inherent fault, an inherent fault would have cause problem faster and on a lot more units. Now if you say that a PS3 may overheat and desolder when enclose, this is a good affirmation. The fact that the magic oven fixed all 16 consoles sure point to a single problem, overheating followed by desoldering. But did the owners read the manual, its written to not enclose the PS3 and to leave at least 4 inches from a wall surface. If you think about it, 4 inches is a lot compare to what most people would use for electronic equipment.

I concede that three years is good going, but the RROD was unheard of for the first year after the consoles release and only got to epidemic proportions after 2 years.

The PS3 has done far better but if the YLODS keep happening on launch machines consistently and its caused by solder fractures then this will be correctly called an INHERENT FAULT.

Its not a dirty word and I doubt SONY or MS saw this coming at the design phase but if all machines are prone to the problem then SONY should accept that the fix should be made free.

As for not enclosing the PS3. Yeah its in the manual and I agree with it.

Problem is SONY advertise it as the complete multimedia and entertainment system to be placed in your living room.

Most people put this sort of equipment under the telly in a purpose built multimedia cabinet. Turns out thats the wrong way to behave.

 



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simonutd on 21 September 2009

let me get this right, cause i bought the extended warrentee im a mug, i should have not bothered cause if it breaks after the first year it should get reparied for free,

i dont understand all the fuss, ignore it and it will go away, people who watch watchdog every week, arnt the sort of people who would buy a ps3,



Icyedge on 21 September 2009
Cypher1980 said:
Icyedge said:
Cypher1980 said:
alanshearer said:
Cypher1980 said:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aRyRxKlo9-o

Here it is in all its glory. Dont really think SONY have got a lot to complain about.

They might be miffed at the "stunt" attitude that Watchdog took but they were given the right of reply and chose not to use it.

Legally nothing can be done.

The only people who say Sony hasnt got anything to complain about are anti PS3/Sony people. It was a stitchup plain and simple.

Well I beg to differ. I've watched it from start to finish and it seems a little sensationalist, but other than that, on the level.

I dont think the gas pockets are the cause either and give the program makers their due, they did say that SONY told them it was not the cause.

However it still doesnt tell us what is.

The fact that one blast in the magic oven fixed all 16 consoles (4 albeit briefly) tends to point to a single problem causing the failure.

Heck time will bring out the truth so lets no one get het up.

If YLOD's keep occuring SONY will be forced to fix em.

If it really is a small minority of owners with launch machines then the problems should eventually fade away.

Still from a tech perspective its really interesting.

3 Years after we can tell that its not an inherent fault, an inherent fault would have cause problem faster and on a lot more units. Now if you say that a PS3 may overheat and desolder when enclose, this is a good affirmation. The fact that the magic oven fixed all 16 consoles sure point to a single problem, overheating followed by desoldering. But did the owners read the manual, its written to not enclose the PS3 and to leave at least 4 inches from a wall surface. If you think about it, 4 inches is a lot compare to what most people would use for electronic equipment.

I concede that three years is good going, but the RROD was unheard of for the first year after the consoles release and only got to epidemic proportions after 2 years.

The PS3 has done far better but if the YLODS keep happening on launch machines consistently and its caused by solder fractures then this will be correctly called an INHERENT FAULT.

Its not a dirty word and I doubt SONY or MS saw this coming at the design phase but if all machines are prone to the problem then SONY should accept that the fix should be made free.

As for not enclosing the PS3. Yeah its in the manual and I agree with it.

Problem is SONY advertise it as the complete multimedia and entertainment system to be placed in your living room.

Most people put this sort of equipment under the telly in a purpose built multimedia cabinet. Turns out thats the wrong way to behave.

 

 

I understand your point but it should not be called inherent fault if its due to misuse from the user. I also agree with you that normally you can enclose those type of equipment, and probably a lot of people would enclose it because of their current set-up. But still, reading the instruction manual is important and people should find a way to respect the precaution in it if they dont want problems.



crumas2 on 21 September 2009
Icyedge said:
 

 

I understand your point but it should not be called inherent fault if its due to misuse from the user. I also agree with you that normally you can enclose those type of equipment, and probably a lot of people would enclose it because of their current set-up. But still, reading the instruction manual is important and people should find a way to respect the precaution in it if they dont want problems.

I think the concept is called "expected product use".  Here are a few humorous examples of products that require "special" and unexpected handling like the PS3 and 360:

http://www.goodexperience.com/tib/archives/2007/05/toastmaster_pro.html

http://www.goodexperience.com/tib/archives/2006/10/dryer_rack.html

 

EDIT: Look up "contradicted affordances"... that's the concept of designing a product in such a way as to make it unusable in ways expected from previous products.  In this instance, consumers expect to be able to place audio/video equipment in cabinets made to contain audio/video equipment.  Sony, and to a lesser degree MS, are advertizing their current generation of consoles as being part of the audio/video equipment to be used in a living room.  Unfortunately, they more closely resemble computers in their thermal operating characteristics, making them unsuitable for use in audio/video cabinets.  But remember, consumers should have to assume that their brand new game console can't be used like the game console they bought last time.  Right?  They should probably read all EULAs before using any new and/or upgraded software, too.

 



Cypher1980 on 21 September 2009

Oh Please dont let them have to put one of those stupid disclaimers in the box.

===========================================================

YOUR SONY PS3 is the ultimate entertainment center.

WARNING DO NOT place your PS3 in an entertainment center.



Icyedge on 21 September 2009
crumas2 said:
Icyedge said:
 

 

I understand your point but it should not be called inherent fault if its due to misuse from the user. I also agree with you that normally you can enclose those type of equipment, and probably a lot of people would enclose it because of their current set-up. But still, reading the instruction manual is important and people should find a way to respect the precaution in it if they dont want problems.

I think the concept is called "expected product use".  Here are a few humorous examples of products that require "special" and unexpected handling like the PS3 and 360:

http://www.goodexperience.com/tib/archives/2007/05/toastmaster_pro.html

http://www.goodexperience.com/tib/archives/2006/10/dryer_rack.html

 

EDIT: Look up "contradicted affordances"... that's the concept of designing a product in such a way as to make it unusable in ways expected from previous products.  In this instance, consumers expect to be able to place audio/video equipment in cabinets made to contain audio/video equipment.  Sony, and to a lesser degree MS, are advertizing their current generation of consoles as being part of the audio/video equipment to be used in a living room.  Unfortunately, they more closely resemble computers in their thermal operating characteristics, making them unsuitable for use in audio/video cabinets.  But remember, consumers should have to assume that their brand new game console can't be used like the game console they bought last time.  Right?  They should probably read all EULAs before using any new and/or upgraded software, too.

 

 

Yeah I already know of this "expected product use", but It would be more like : do not operate the PS3 more than 3 hours due to risk of overheating. Since all gamer expect to be able to play more than 3 hours on a day off this would be real contradicted affordance since gaming is the main purpose of the console.  I tell you this example because one of my friend, in the beginning era of the Xbox 360, have been told by Xbox customer service that he should not leave his console on more than 3 consecutives hours. A good example of localisation being a contradicted affordance would be asking to leave 4 inches on each side of a refrigerator.

 

P.S.: I always take a look into the manual but I dont read EULAs agreement, but yes we should ;).

 

Edit: Youre also not suppose to enclose sound amplifier, with powerful electronics, not enclosing is standard.