By using this site, you agree to our Privacy Policy and our Terms of Use. Close

Forums - Gaming - The Final Fantasy XIII conspiracy: Why the controversy?

http://www.thekoalition.com/why-the-controversy-for-final-fantasy-xiii/

Final Fantasy XIII is the upcoming role playing game/RPG  in the Fabula Nova Crystallis Final Fantasy XIII Compilation  by Japanese developer and publisher Square Enix. The game is due exclusively in Japan for the Sony PlayStation 3. However in North America and European territories, it is due for the PlayStation 3 and the Microsoft Xbox 360 next spring.  Square Enix is also known for such IPs as Dragon Quest (Dragon Warrior in the US until 2005), Kingdom Hearts, Star Ocean, Fullmetal Alchemist, and etc. The producer of this title is Kitase Yoshinori. He was the director of Final Fantasy VI (Final Fantasy III in the US back in 1994), and Chrono Trigger on the Super Famicom/Super Nintendo. He did Final Fantasy VII and Final Fantasy VIII on the PlayStation/PSone. He also did Final Fantasy X and Final Fantasy X-2 on the PlayStation 2. He is currently the executive producer on the long sought sequel to Parasite Eve 2 titled Parasite Eve The 3rd Birthday exclusively on the Sony PlayStation Portable/PSP.

The game was first unveiled as an exclusive to the PlayStation 3 platform at Sony’s E3 Press Conference in 2006. The US version of Final Fantasy XII was also shown at this time. The game was to run on Square Enix’s proprietary White Engine that was specifically designed exclusively for the PlayStation 3 platform. It was slated to use four of the seven processors in the Cell processor just for graphics alone. The White Engine was designed according to world renowned developer Tetsuya Nomura (Final Fantasy VII Advent Children, The Bouncer, etc) to simulate battle sequences similar to Final Fantasy VII Advent Children Complete.  He at one time via Famitsu stated that “all visions come true” when a game is exclusive. Also on his stance on the PlayStation 3 in regards to Final Fantasy XIII at that time being exclusive to that platform, Nomura stated via QJ.net “It’s not just about how pretty the graphics are but more of how much limited amount of movement we can put on one go and how big our imagination and ideas are. The PS3 is the machine that is closest to being able to express our imagination.”

At the 2008 Game Developers Conference, Square Enix scrapped the White Engine and introduced a multiplatform engine named the Crystal Tools Engine during a session at GDC entitled “The Technology of Final Fantasy” by Square Enix’s Taku Murata. At this time several sources within the interactive entertainment media and the community began to speculate and some regards encourage that Final Fantasy XIII would be a Microsoft Xbox 360 title in addition to the PlayStation 3 version. In other words, the game would be multiplatform which is a FIRST for the IP. At around this same period, Star Ocean 4, despite the fact that the trailer was featured on the Japanese PlayStation Portable/PSP version of Star Ocean The Second Departure, was unveiled as a 360 exclusive. Of course, everyone by now remembers that day when Microsoft’s Don Mattrick and Square Enix’s Yoichi Wada basically shitted on PS3 gamers by announcing Final Fantasy XIII coming to Xbox 360 right? Gamers knew the deal behind the deal but of course Microsoft as usual stated otherwise. Albert Pennello who is the Global Marketing Manager from Microsoft stated and quote “I think the most obvious reason that they made the announcement is just looking at the success of our console…Square has done games for us in the past, and I think there’s a point where Square just has to look at the Xbox 360, the install base and attach rates that we’re seeing and actually has to make a decision on their own that it’s the right thing to do for them…I think it’s easy to assume that something’s going on behind the scenes, I think the more obvious answer is we’re doing really well and the game creators want their games to be where the most people and the most consoles [are], and right now that’s the Xbox 360.” Shane Kim stated that the deal was made also to convince Japanese developers/publishers to no longer deny the 360 platform. To this very day, they will no disclose the terms of the deal unlike what they did with Grand Theft Auto IV.

In an interview via MTV Multiplayer with Peter Dillie who is the Senior Vice President for Marketing and PlayStation Network from Sony Computer Entertainment America, Stephen Totilo asked “You guys talked about exclusives. And there’s a lot of really cool exclusives coming out. But I wanted to talk to you about an exclusive that’s no longer an exclusive, and that’s “Final Fantasy XIII.” Microsoft made a whole big deal about it. They showed it at the end of their press conference as their big surprise. You guys are saying exclusives are really important. So does not having “Final Fantasy XIII” anymore just for PS3 hurt you guys?” Peter Dillie answered by stating that “What you have with “Final Fantasy XIII” is a lot like what they’ve paid for with “GTA.” It’s not an exclusive on their platform. It’s now a cross-platform game. Sand I think if you look at how “GTA” behaved in the marketplace and how it drove — or didn’t drive — either console, that’s what I’m talking about. Consumers responded to “GTA” on the PS3 just as they did on the 360. And it becomes a bit of a jump ball. But it didn’t rise the tide for them. And I think if you fast forward to when “Final Fantasy XIII” comes out I think you’re going to have millions of people who grew up playing “Final Fantasy” on the PlayStation playing it on a PlayStation 3. They spent a lot of money, I’m sure, to get “Final Fantasy” onto the 360 but at the end of the day it’s on our platform as well. Which is why we focus on, “Let’s look at what happens when you have “Metal Gear Solid” on your platform … when the NPD numbers come out … I think you’ll see the value of what a real exclusive title does and how it raised the bar for PS3 versus 360.” It’s interesting to note that EEDAR analyst Jesse Divinich stated that exclusives sell 45% better than multiplatform titles on PS3.

Square Enix tried their best attempt at damage control. Here’s a few of their examples below.

-Gamespot article (August 2, 2008)
In the video, director Motomu Toriyama didn’t beat around the bush when Nomura asked him questions about the 360 FFXIII. Starting off, he reconfirmed that, “We haven’t changed the direction of the development. We’re making the PS3 version first, and then porting to the 360 later.” That means that since the game will be released simultaneously on both platforms in North America and Europe, the PS3 release will be held back in those territories until the 360 version is complete.
Furthermore, Toriyama also revealed that, as of July 29, his team hasn’t yet received the tools needed to begin work on the Xbox 360 version of FFXIII. “I’m telling them to not think about the Xbox 360 right now,” he said. “We can think about it after the development kits arrive.”
The director also reassured PS3 owners that the game’s quality would not suffer due to the 360 port. “We aren’t going to change any specifications [of FFXIII] because of the multi-platform announcement,” he declared. “Right now, we’re fully concentrating on the PS3 version.”

-Kikizo.com via an interview (November 2008) “It’s well known by now that FFXIII is no longer PS3 exclusive. Some PS3 fans are extremely disappointed, and have become quite vocal about their dissatisfaction. What would you say to them?”
Kitase: “I’d like to add… I think that maybe because it’s going multi-platform that some fans are worried about the game’s scope being reduced to fit onto both consoles. The fact is, the PS3 version is what’s in development right now, and the team is working to specialize that version to the very best of the PS3’s abilities. After that, we’ll do the 360 port and optimize it to that particular hardware. There will be no decrease in quality as a result of the game appearing across two platforms.”

-Kitase via Japanese magazine Dengeki PlayStation 3 (March 2009)- “Doesn’t the demo use about 50 percent of its power? Of course, I think the retail version will make use of nearly 100 percent.”

-Kitase via VideoGamer.com (June 2009) “The team is targeting to create an equal experience on both the 360 and the PS3, so there are no limitations. For example, right now we’re working on the PS3 version first, and once we’ve completed that we’ll really know how much game there will be to fit onto the Xbox 360 discs.
“So we don’t know how many discs it’ll be housed on for 360, but there won’t be a chance that we’ll compromise anything because, oh it didn’t fit in the 360 discs so we’ll have to take it out of the PS3 version, or vice versa.”

To my expectation it came to no surprise that a 360 version of Final Fantasy XIII was demoed earlier this year at Microsoft’s Press Conference at this year’s E3. They tried to stimulate the unveiling by showing the Guardian Force Odin. Now remember this? They stated many times that they would PORT the game over to the 360 AFTER the PS3 version was COMPLETED. Now answer this question. Did Final Fantasy XIII came out in Japan yet or better yet did it came out at all? No. So then why is there even a 360 version of the game in existence? The answer is plain and fucking simple. The game is a MULTIPLATFORM title to begin with. No timed exclusive bullshit. No. This game was and always has been developed side by side.  Earlier at this year’s gamescom, Kitase stated that the PS3 is at 90% complete and that the 360 version is at 70% complete. Only a 20% difference. Just around the same estimated percent most of the time when developers make games multiplatform with the 360 version as the lead SKU, denominator or whatever you want to call it.

Now of course you may ask yourself, so what did they dumb down supposedly? Well first take into account that whenever a game is in development for multiple platforms,  the developer always has to sacrifice concepts so that the scale will be fit onto the desired platforms. That’s why most developers make their games on the lowest common denominator which in this case this generation is the 360. DVD technology which dates back to 1996 is easier to develop for but severely outdated by today’s standard set by Blu Ray and/or the former HD DVD. With this in mind if you watch the clip from YouTube below, after the 3:00 mark, you’ll see a real time scene from the Japanese exclusive Final Fantasy XIII demo that was included with the First Print Limited Edition version of the Blu Ray Final Fantasy VII Advent Children Complete. Now that scene was originally supposed to be CG rendered as evident in the first trailer from E3 2006. Now why is this important? The reason is that developing real time scenes is less efficient and more costly in the development process. Any game tester will tell you the hell that they go through, as they have to check for bugs which is the least of their worries. Bottom line. It’s a waste of time. That time can be reserved to further develop actual concepts of the game i.e. gameplay, presentation, etc. Also Kitase stated that the PS3 version will NOT have a dual language option, despite the fact that the game is on Blu Ray.

It’s already proven time and again that the majority gamers on the 360 platform don’t respect nor have interest in the controversially termed JRPG genre. Where do you think the term JRPG started? Let me answer that for you. It started back in 2003 when Star Wars Knights of The Old Republic was released. XBOX gamers frustrated with the lack of support from Square Enix and other Japanese developers, found that the RPG (KOTOR) was very well received and before you know it, Japanese developed RPGs were heavily criticized and later denied acknowledgment. Is that the case now that XIII is no longer an exclusive to PS3? Well let’s see. To this date there hasn’t been a Japanese RPG on the 360 platform that went platinum or sold over a million copies.

To demonstrate the “interest” that 360 owners showcase in the genre, let’s look at the most recent Xbox Live Top Ten.

01) Call of Duty World at War
02) Halo 3
03) Call of Duty 4 Modern Warfare
04) Gears of War 2
05) Madden NFL 10
06) LOST PLANET 2 Co-op Demo
07) Grand Theft Auto IV
08) Shadow Complex
09) Trials HD
10) FIFA 09

What?!?  The point is that Final Fantasy XIII didn’t even come close to the vision set by Tetsuya Nomura back in 2006 which I wonder why he left the project earlier this summer. The gameplay showcased then is very possible. Sure there will be uninformed detractors that say otherwise, however they probably never experienced a PS3 exclusive. Naughty Dog’s Uncharted 2 Among Thieves and Guerrilla Games Killzone 2 come to mind.   The point is that this is yet another example of PR and Microsoft’s bullshit. Multiplatform doesn’t go both ways. PS3 owners get once exclusives dumbed down and/or released day and date with the 360 i.e. Tekken 6. On the other hand 360 owners get timed exclusives to games they don’t even know or give a shit about i.e. Star Ocean 4. This led to the degradation and quality of Japanese RPGs this generation, simply because Microsoft can’t compete with Sony. They basically tell Japanese developers and publishers, remember that shit that you made last generation, yeah do that, but you have a deadline. We’ll pay for incentives, and anything you missed afterwards, release it as DLC (downloadable content). 1984. I think history may repeat itself if this goes on.

Be sure to listen to this week’s Co Op podcast featuring killakap, Swiff, htown, Mills and myself, Haipa Sonikku (Hai-pa So-nik-ku) for the team’s view on this controversial topic.



      

      

      

Greatness Awaits

PSN:Forevercloud (looking for Soul Sacrifice Partners!!!)

Around the Network
forevercloud3000 said:

Where do you think the term JRPG started? Let me answer that for you. It started back in 2003

Oh my fucking god.



@badgenome

I think what he is trying to say is not that JRPGs were invented in 2003, but the term itself. Before no one said JRPG or WRPG, it was simply RPG. And in fact whenever someone said it there was probably a 70% chance he was speaking of a JRPG because they had the most praise. The tables have turned abit now and all of a sudden JRPGs are not good enough(some due to realistic expectations others not so much) and WRPGs are flawless.



      

      

      

Greatness Awaits

PSN:Forevercloud (looking for Soul Sacrifice Partners!!!)

cool story brah



My name is blubeard because rosie has a blue beard. Just not on her chest.

forevercloud3000 said:

@badgenome

I think what he is trying to say is not that JRPGs were invented in 2003, but the term itself. Before no one said JRPG or WRPG, it was simply RPG. And in fact whenever someone said it there was probably a 70% chance he was speaking of a JRPG because they had the most praise. The tables have turned abit now and all of a sudden JRPGs are not good enough(some due to realistic expectations others not so much) and WRPGs are flawless.

False.



Around the Network

They most likely pretended that it was exclusive not to loose hype...they kno SONY crowd is very proud of there exclusives and kno how keep everybody hyped



as long winded as that was, it does raise one good point.

360 version won't start till the ps3 version is complete yet ps3 is at 90% and 360 is at 70%, I always found that suspicious, the rest of the article I don't care for.



PS One/2/p/3slim/Vita owner. I survived the Apocalyps3/Collaps3 and all I got was this lousy signature.


Xbox One: What are you doing Dave?

Fuck you S-E.

And I'll still buy FF XIII!



forevercloud3000 said:

What?!?  The point is that Final Fantasy XIII didn’t even come close to the vision set by Tetsuya Nomura back in 2006 which I wonder why he left the project earlier this summer. The gameplay showcased then is very possible. Sure there will be uninformed detractors that say otherwise, however they probably never experienced a PS3 exclusive. Naughty Dog’s Uncharted 2 Among Thieves and Guerrilla Games Killzone 2 come to mind.   The point is that this is yet another example of PR and Microsoft’s bullshit. Multiplatform doesn’t go both ways. PS3 owners get once exclusives dumbed down and/or released day and date with the 360 i.e. Tekken 6. On the other hand 360 owners get timed exclusives to games they don’t even know or give a shit about i.e. Star Ocean 4. This led to the degradation and quality of Japanese RPGs this generation, simply because Microsoft can’t compete with Sony. They basically tell Japanese developers and publishers, remember that shit that you made last generation, yeah do that, but you have a deadline. We’ll pay for incentives, and anything you missed afterwards, release it as DLC (downloadable content). 1984. I think history may repeat itself if this goes on.

Be sure to listen to this week’s Co Op podcast featuring killakap, Swiff, htown, Mills and myself, Haipa Sonikku (Hai-pa So-nik-ku) for the team’s view on this controversial topic.

I'm going start here. Nomura was never the director nor the producer, so while what his vision is was nice and all, but that's not his job. He left the project because his work as character designer, etc. was over and all that was left was polishing and localization.

 

MS didn't lead to crappy JRPGs from Tri-Ace either. We had a lot of JRPGs last generation. Look at the highest rated ones and you'll see Final Fantasy, Kingdom Hearts, SMT, Dragon Quest, etc.

We haven't had many, if any, at all from those franchises or developers this generation. (Triace made IU and SO4 and the Saga team at SE made TLR)



"We'll toss the dice however they fall,
And snuggle the girls be they short or tall,
Then follow young Mat whenever he calls,
To dance with Jak o' the Shadows."

Check out MyAnimeList and my Game Collection. Owner of the 5 millionth post.

I don't really get the hatred truthfully.
if the majority of 360 users aren't going to be playing, then how does it matter?

I don't really like fanbase for the FF games. 7 was great on it's own but if it would have been 2-D like part 6 no one would have given a damn.

IMHO FFX is the best in the series. For what the game lacks in voice acting and story, it really brings a lot of improvements in the battle system as well as the progression system.



My name is blubeard because rosie has a blue beard. Just not on her chest.