By using this site, you agree to our Privacy Policy and our Terms of Use. Close

Forums - Nintendo - Was Nintendo's 2008 flop of a lineup merely an issue with perception?

SnowFlow on 09 April 2009

Mario Kart and Smash Bros? First half of the year was excellent for Nintendo. They just needed something more than Animal Crossing and Wii Music later in the year.



Around the Network
68soul on 09 April 2009


It's always strange to read the 1st party 2008 line-up was weak or was a flop...

Sure, the end of the year was boring if like me, you had no interest in Wii Music or Animal Crossing... and the shame is most 3rd parties didn't take any advantage of the situation... but if you look at the whole year, it's a very decent line-up, for sure...

Now, not from a user perspective, but from a business perspective:

Wii Fit: 18 millions - Mario Kart: 15,5 millions - Brawl: 8,5 millions - Animal Crossing: 3 millions - Wii Music: 2,5 millions - Wario Land: 0.5 millions - Endless Ocean: 1 million - Sluggers: 1 million...

8 games, 50 million copies so far, still counting: who in this industry could do better? If that's a flop, then what about 90% of the games out there?

Now, back to my own user perspective: i've got 4 of these games (Wii Fit, Wario Land, Kart and Smash), and two were my most played games in 2008 (Kart and Smash), so if i look at the amount of hours played versus the price paid, i can't complain...

Of course, i'd like more... if Nintendo was releasing a masterpiece each month, i'd (nearly) buy them all... but we all know it's impossible, there's only 3000 Nintendo workers worldwide, they just can't do miracles month after month... year after year, maybe, but not each month or each quarter, so we just have to deal with it, and be patient like we always had to be with Nintendo's delays and so on...

Now, if 3rd parties could fill the gap(s)... that's the main problem with Wii actually... maybe it will change... in 2010... maybe... it's beginning, but will it be enough in 2009? We will all know after E3...



 

"A beautiful drawing in 480i will stay beautiful forever...

and an ugly drawing in 1080p will stay ugly forever..."

taxman on 09 April 2009

I don't think anyone argued that the first part of the year was good for Nintendo releases.

Just as no one can argue that the final part was pretty dismal...

(And no, sales have nothing to do with it)



PSN ID: T_Gears

End of 2009 ltd sales:

Wii = 67-68m

X360 = 38-39m

PS3 = 34-35m

Prediction: The PS3 will surpass the 360 on weekly sales after it drops to $299 on all regular weeks (no big releases).

NinjaKido on 09 April 2009
BengaBenga said:
NinjaKido said:
BengaBenga said:
NinjaKido said:

@Soriku I think you'll find the HD consoles still beat the in terms of quantity at least if you take away FPS's but that's irrelevant . I won't dispute the fact that people may use the Wii purely for the core experience , i'm not trying to call anyone who does a casual gamer or a fanboy .

But when you look at what the HD consoles offer to the core gamer , it seems hard to justify using the Wii as your only core console. This gen Sony and MS and seem to have a greater respect for the core gamer than Nintendo do, probably due to the fact that their success relies more heavily on the core gamer, traditional developers seem to have more respect and confidence in the HD consoles which translates to more 3rd party support .

I read Nitnendo was considering not releasing a core game released in Japan in the US , this may even shed light on Nintendo's stance with the core gamer.

 

I think you're way too narrowminded to determine what core games actually are. I see this behaviour so often and it's really dumb. I use my Wii as a core console, just as I use my 360 and DS as core consoles. They serve different needs, but one need is not less or more important than the other. If you like what Wii offers it's more than sufficient to serve as your only console. It's the narrowminded elitist that somehow don't want to see that.

Could I have played Fire Emblem on 360? No. Could I have played Mass Effect on Wii? No. Just two of my favorite games this gen. Both are definitely core games.

Above I posted a list of games Nintendo has released in just two years. If you see that as "no respect for the core gamer" you're dilusional, really.

 

 

That is by far the most annoying thing about arguing with Wii supporter , your not any better than me because you support the Wii, because I own and support a console that's in 3rd place , stop trying to claim high ground , if you want to counter argue just use logic , i'm not an idiot I'll conceede if I feel i've been beat.

Excuse me? Where did I mention the PS3. Nowhere.
I also don't claim I'm better, I just claim you have a narrowminded view on what core actually is.


It's prety clear that i'm a ps3 owner/supporter and your statement IMO was an atempt to downplay my ability to anylise the Wii's relation to core gaming , it's a tool typicaly used by Wii supporters when they are unable to make their argument convincing enough on their own. You first called me "narrow minded" ,then called my point of view "dumb" before saying anything about the topic matter , it wasn't even a conclusion(these are quotes not intepritations) if you saying your equal to me then surely you should treat me with a level of respect , as I do you.

I think one of the problems arise with our definitions of core titles , maybe yours differs from mine , i'm not going to call you "narrow minded" or your point of view "dumb" for that reason.

The difference between me and you is that I don't exclude any games and/or consoles from being "core". I most certainly have a different taste than most gamers, but I won't claim that other tastes are not core games.

I never excluded any games from the "core" lable , it seems we'ere on the same boat here , stop making false distinctions.

Like I said before I won't dispute the notion of the Wii being used exclusivley as core console , but like you said you use the Wii alongside other consoles 360, DS etc which all fulfil different needs,this somewhat supports the idea that the Wii is inadequet as a standalone core experience . your speaking anedotaly which pretty much means nothing , in order to proove a point we have to use to most objective information availible to us( it may not be totaly objective but it's better than anecdotes.

Time for a quote: ""it seems hard to justify using the Wii as your only core console"
Sounds pretty dismissive to me.

And yes, for ME the Wii alone would not be enough. But nor would the 360 alone.

I originaly wasn't going to elaborate on my point but then I  realised I was talking about the Wii so had to , yes I agree I was very dismissive but only because I didn't originaly intend to elabourate on the point I was making.

And please quote me properly , I never at any point said "no respect for the core gamer" , debate fairly please .

Yes Nintendo has released a fair number of core titles but  that's irrelevant , the core consumer doesn't care about how many core titles Nintendo released , they care about a libary of core titles availbile to them , what they can buy . If you compare the number of core titles availble on the Wii in that period to what was availible on either the PS3/360 then I think you'll find that the Wii get's blown out of the water.

Again, you assume a certain type of gamer to be THE core gamer and a certain type of games to be THE core games. This is what's wrong with your argument and what I'm trying to tell you.

Well it's certain a core gamer exist and it's certain that core games exist , if your going to argue that my opinion of what they are is wrong then we're going to have a problem discussing.

What is also important is that there is a steady and constant flow of core titles availble to the consumer , it's not just about the total number of titles availble . This spring has seen no major 1st party offerings a fairly insignificant 3rd party offering Madworld ( which may go on to sell a million but that's irrelevant ) , when I speak of respect i'm not talking about respect in the mind but respect through action , Nintendo might very well love and adore the core gamer but their actions make them apear very neglectful.

I'm pretty sure Nintendo has released as much or more games than Microsoft and Sony, so I don't see how they should do more. That third party developers don't deliver is definitely true, but not Nintendo's fault. Besides we come back to the whole taste debate again. Q1 I bought 3 Wii games and just 1 360 game, so for ME Wii had the best Q1 lineup.

 

Your not getting my point , what you bought for your console is irrelevant again stop reffering to anecdotes.  What Nintendo released is also irrelevant , the consumer doesn't care about how many core titles Nintendo release THEY DON'T IT GOES WITHOUT SAYING !!. What matters to any consumer (we're talking about the core gamer) is the libary availible to them in total , the Wii lacks in this department. The average customer doesn't walk into a shop and say " yes I know there are a toal of XXX Wii games but how many of them were made by Nintnendo ?"

It's also important that there is a steady and constant flow of good core titles availble to the consumer, Nintendo release alot of their big guns last year so it's hard to forsee how they are going to reproduce that consistency for this year and years to come.

 

 

 

 



jlauro on 09 April 2009

I think many are forgetting that Nintendo wanted to release SSBB earlier, but it was delayed and that's why it was so close to MK. Still wouldn't of helped the fall lineup, but I think Nintendo was expecting 3rd parties to have better offerings available.

Honestly though, it's all about new hardware sales for fall, and they knew they would have trouble meeting demand. They didn't need a strong fall lineup to move the hardware. They need it other parts of the year to keep demand up. It's not like they would of sold any more wiis if they had any better games in the fall.

Now that supply is meeting demand, it's going to be a little more important, although there is a decent catalog of good games it's not really a problem for new customers, especially as wii software has the most shelf space in most stores.



Around the Network
Alby_da_Wolf on 09 April 2009

The flop was nintended!

...

(buries himself)

...



Stwike him, Centuwion. Stwike him vewy wuffly! (Pontius Pilate, "Life of Brian")
A fart without stink is like a sky without stars.
TGS, Third Grade Shooter: brand new genre invented by Kevin Butler exclusively for Natal WiiToo Kinect. PEW! PEW-PEW-PEW!   


woopah on 09 April 2009

you missed batallion wars 2 out as well. and yeah i think your right.

but thwe release dates shouldnt actually matter. thats the weird thing. had nintendo released wario, batallion wars and fire emblem in Q4 2008 alongside animal crossing. people would have been hyped and got them. but because they had released earleir in the year people simply dismissed them. nintendo should have hypedup wario at E3,i thing that would have helped



 nintendo fanboy, but the good kind

proud soldier of nintopia

 

im_sneaky on 09 April 2009

It didn't flop. Sales were great. Games? I liked Brawl. Last game I bought for Wii. I mainly play PC, sometimes 360 and once in a while Wii.



 

 

Khuutra on 09 April 2009

NinjaKido said:
What matters to any consumer (we're talking about the core gamer) is the libary availible to them in total , the Wii lacks in this department. The average customer doesn't walk into a shop and say " yes I know there are a toal of XXX Wii games but how many of them were made by Nintnendo ?"
You're right, but your conclusion is wrong.

The Wii's library is exactly why it's outselling the HD twins.



BengaBenga on 09 April 2009
NinjaKido said:
BengaBenga said:
NinjaKido said:

 

That is by far the most annoying thing about arguing with Wii supporter , your not any better than me because you support the Wii, because I own and support a console that's in 3rd place , stop trying to claim high ground , if you want to counter argue just use logic , i'm not an idiot I'll conceede if I feel i've been beat.

Excuse me? Where did I mention the PS3. Nowhere.
I also don't claim I'm better, I just claim you have a narrowminded view on what core actually is.


It's prety clear that i'm a ps3 owner/supporter and your statement IMO was an atempt to downplay my ability to anylise the Wii's relation to core gaming , it's a tool typicaly used by Wii supporters when they are unable to make their argument convincing enough on their own. You first called me "narrow minded" ,then called my point of view "dumb" before saying anything about the topic matter , it wasn't even a conclusion(these are quotes not intepritations) if you saying your equal to me then surely you should treat me with a level of respect , as I do you.

I don't see how it's clear that you're a PS3 supporter. Anyway my statement has absolutely zero to do with the PS3 so I don't see how it's relevant. I agree my words were too harsh, however this discussion has been going on for 2 years now and it's really annoying.

I think one of the problems arise with our definitions of core titles , maybe yours differs from mine , i'm not going to call you "narrow minded" or your point of view "dumb" for that reason.

The difference between me and you is that I don't exclude any games and/or consoles from being "core". I most certainly have a different taste than most gamers, but I won't claim that other tastes are not core games.

I never excluded any games from the "core" lable , it seems we'ere on the same boat here , stop making false distinctions.

Huh, if you don't exclude games from being core, how can you at the same time say the Wii is less relevant for core gamers?

Like I said before I won't dispute the notion of the Wii being used exclusivley as core console , but like you said you use the Wii alongside other consoles 360, DS etc which all fulfil different needs,this somewhat supports the idea that the Wii is inadequet as a standalone core experience . your speaking anedotaly which pretty much means nothing , in order to proove a point we have to use to most objective information availible to us( it may not be totaly objective but it's better than anecdotes.

Time for a quote: ""it seems hard to justify using the Wii as your only core console"
Sounds pretty dismissive to me.

And yes, for ME the Wii alone would not be enough. But nor would the 360 alone.

I originaly wasn't going to elaborate on my point but then I  realised I was talking about the Wii so had to , yes I agree I was very dismissive but only because I didn't originaly intend to elabourate on the point I was making.

Ok, point taken.

And please quote me properly , I never at any point said "no respect for the core gamer" , debate fairly please .

Yes Nintendo has released a fair number of core titles but  that's irrelevant , the core consumer doesn't care about how many core titles Nintendo released , they care about a libary of core titles availbile to them , what they can buy . If you compare the number of core titles availble on the Wii in that period to what was availible on either the PS3/360 then I think you'll find that the Wii get's blown out of the water.

Again, you assume a certain type of gamer to be THE core gamer and a certain type of games to be THE core games. This is what's wrong with your argument and what I'm trying to tell you.

Well it's certain a core gamer exist and it's certain that core games exist , if your going to argue that my opinion of what they are is wrong then we're going to have a problem discussing.

Yes, indeed there are core gamers and core games, no issue there. It's your distinction between one or the other that's the issue. You say PS360 has undeniably more core titles. That's nonsense. PS360 has more games for A CERTAIN TYPE of gamer, but that, again, doesn't mean World of Goo is less of a core title than Gears of War.

What is also important is that there is a steady and constant flow of core titles availble to the consumer , it's not just about the total number of titles availble . This spring has seen no major 1st party offerings a fairly insignificant 3rd party offering Madworld ( which may go on to sell a million but that's irrelevant ) , when I speak of respect i'm not talking about respect in the mind but respect through action , Nintendo might very well love and adore the core gamer but their actions make them apear very neglectful.

I'm pretty sure Nintendo has released as much or more games than Microsoft and Sony, so I don't see how they should do more. That third party developers don't deliver is definitely true, but not Nintendo's fault. Besides we come back to the whole taste debate again. Q1 I bought 3 Wii games and just 1 360 game, so for ME Wii had the best Q1 lineup.

Your not getting my point , what you bought for your console is irrelevant again stop reffering to anecdotes.  What Nintendo released is also irrelevant , the consumer doesn't care about how many core titles Nintendo release THEY DON'T IT GOES WITHOUT SAYING !!. What matters to any consumer (we're talking about the core gamer) is the libary availible to them in total , the Wii lacks in this department. The average customer doesn't walk into a shop and say " yes I know there are a toal of XXX Wii games but how many of them were made by Nintnendo ?"

It's also important that there is a steady and constant flow of good core titles availble to the consumer, Nintendo release alot of their big guns last year so it's hard to forsee how they are going to reproduce that consistency for this year and years to come.

This again goes to the same point that YOU THINK Wii lacks a good core library. That's fine, don't buy one. But it's NOT FACT. I would say there are certain core genres where Wii undeniably has a broader and better library than PS360. The opposite is obviously also true. It's simply a matter of taste.

Nintendo has more than enough IP yet to release and obviously sequels. I wouldn't worry about that. Plus 3rd parties are definitely stepping up. Since you like JRPGs I would say that within a year Wii is a must have for anyone that likes that genre.