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Forums - Gaming Discussion - How bad has square enix been for sony this gen

ClaudeLv250 on 14 December 2008
forevercloud3000 said:
LordTheNightKnight said:
"I love it when people try to denounce my claim yet have no real argument. how about you give some concrete reasoning for a MP game selling better then an exclusive one and we will talk."

Liar. You don't "love" it. You just selectively look at sales of certain games while ignoring others, and refuse to look at all factors in the sales.

 

You missed the two main points.

You missed that you have no points. You basically fabricated an argument based on fanboyism around multiplat game sales, listed a bunch of convenient games (half of which are 1st and 2nd party...ROFFLE!) and then vehemently deny that anyone that doesn't agree with you knows what they're talking about. 

Even if you had a point, which you don't, it's not going to change that FF13 is multiplat. Let it go.



Tag - "No trolling on my watch!"

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LordTheNightKnight on 14 December 2008
SnowWhitesDrug said:
LordTheNightKnight said:
"I just thought "whats a game thats allways on a nintendo system" and mario came to mind"

The thing is that Final Fantasy hasn't always been on any one system, so your statement just seemed wrong, no matter how sentimental.

The thing is that feelings and opinions can still be wrong if they are based on incorrect data. Final Fantasy is a third party game, so even if you felt it would be the same as Mario, that feeling is based on ignorance.

Trust me, you don't get a pass for ignorance, especially on the web.

 

 lol the funny thing is you talk about ignorance while being completly ignorant to what im trying to say, so lets just forget about it, I'll let you win what ever it is your trying to win/prove because your completly off my point. Have a nice night, or day :)

 

I saw your point. It was still based on a factual inaccuracy.



A flashy-first game is awesome when it comes out. A great-first game is awesome forever.

Plus, just for the hell of it: Kelly Brook at the 2008 BAFTAs

FaRmLaNd on 14 December 2008
forevercloud3000 said:
FaRmLaNd said:
If FF13 was exclusive to the ps3 I and millions of other 360 only owners wouldn't get to play. That is why its multi-platform.

 

No, you , and millions of other 360 owners would have bought PS3s, one way or another. Dont pull that crap. If you are a fan of the series you WERE goingto buy a PS3, until the MP thing, no use denying it. Yea its exspensive, but you would have found a way to get it just how you got your 360. It really is not that hard to figure out.

PS2 took up an estimated 80% of the userbase last gen. It was cheaper then Xbox was. FF games of late on average sell about 5million. Do you really think that if it was multiplat then that another 5million people were going to miraculously appear as fans on the XBOX for it. NO. USerbase does not equal sales unless your taget audience is included. If XIII is good its good, it will sell 5mill+, but it would have been just the same if it was on PS3. Maybe 10% less at the most. Is that 10% worth shelling out man power to work on an adjacent title so it can "widen userbase"?

The whole MP equals Sales logic is flawed....

 

 

The ps2 might have had "80%" of the market but the ps3 most certainly does not. Do you honestly think all ps2 owners are upgrading exclusively to the ps3? No, most are upgrading to the wii with some upgrading to the 360 aswell. Most people don't have multiple consoles and since the 360 was out first many had already upraded to it. Couple this with Microsofts push for JRPG on the 360 (which led to LO selling over 800 thousand copies) and it makes perfect sense to port it to the 360 (since surely a final fantasy will sell even more?).

The reality is the ps3 isn't dominating the market like the wii is. But since SE has already invested heavily in the ps3 version with its hd graphics etc it is makes a lot of sense to port it to a system that has a larger userbase and similar graphic capabilities. It would have been more costly to develop a wii port at this point. The reality is just releasing something on the ps3 doesn't cover "80%" of the market like releasing something on the ps2 did so if they're going to do high definition graphics then it makes plain business sense to release it on the 360 aswell as it will increase this versions sales buy a few million. Sqare Enix is not a charity and they have acted like a business, as one can expect.

EDIT your argument about people buying a ps3 just for this game makes zero sense. Why would SE care if the ps3 sells because of its game or not? WHY would they increase the barrier of entry by making people BUY a console! Thats just stupid! By making it multi-format they've lowered the barrier for entry. More people with 360's are more likely to buy ff13 on the 360 then purchase a ps3 just for the game. They will get more sales because of it being multi-platform then if it were exclusive because the ps3 is not the ps2 or the wii.



theprof00 on 14 December 2008
Rei said:
theprof00 said:
I think this is going to be one of those games where they might have sold more if it was exclusive.

 

 There are no games like this.

yes there are

 



Slimebeast on 14 December 2008

It's not Square Enix who got arrogant, it's Sony who got arrogant this gen.

Kaz Hirai became megalomaniac with statements like "the PS3 will sell 10 million units by brand name alone" and "people will get a 2nd job just to be able to buy a PS3".

Kaz stopped the Sony tradition of feeding Square Enix with all that cash to secure exclusives.

But Square Enix said "F U" and chose MS money instead lol.



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radioioRobert on 14 December 2008
forevercloud3000 said:
FaRmLaNd said:
If FF13 was exclusive to the ps3 I and millions of other 360 only owners wouldn't get to play. That is why its multi-platform.

 

No, you , and millions of other 360 owners would have bought PS3s, one way or another. Dont pull that crap. If you are a fan of the series you WERE goingto buy a PS3, until the MP thing, no use denying it. Yea  its exspensive, but you would have found a way to get it just how you got your 360. It really is not that hard to figure out.

PS2 took up an estimated 80% of the userbase last gen. It was cheaper then Xbox was. FF games of late on average sell about 5million. Do you really think that if it was multiplat then that another 5million people were going to miraculously appear as fans on the XBOX for it. NO. USerbase does not equal sales unless your taget audience is included. If XIII is good its good, it will sell 5mill+, but it would have been just the same if it was on PS3. Maybe 10% less at the most. Is that 10% worth shelling out man power to work on an adjacent title so it can "widen userbase"?

The whole MP equals Sales logic is flawed....

Square-Enix's job is to sell games for profit and please both gamers and stockholders. Nowhere in the job description does it say to sell consoles for the Sony Corporation. THAT is the Sony corporation's job.

 



BAM! There it is!
 
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radioioRobert on 14 December 2008
forevercloud3000 said:Now lets got to the Top 5 selling franchises of all time!
  1. Mario
  2. Pokemon
  3. The Sims
  4. Final Fantasy
  5. Need For Speed

3/5 are exclusive franchises to a console or another (except 1/2 of the FF games but they do nto factor into statistics)FIXED

What does this Prove? That making a game Multiplat does not equal better sales. Now What Have we learned?

 

Only 2 of those games are console exclusive. FF made 6 mainline games for Nintendo, then 6 for Sony. So they ultimately have favored no one. 13 is the first mutliplat release at it's launch. And the console who originally built FF into a successful franchise is left out. 

We have learned from you:

*Top 2 franchises of all time are exclusive to Nintendo consoles, and are first party (hence they stay exclusive).

*Sony & M$ have zero first party games in the top five franchises (hence NO exclusives).

*3/5 of the most successful franchises have not been married to one brand of console and have done just fine.

Thank you for bringing these things to light....   



BAM! There it is!
 
Wii Code 3456 7941 4060 2924
COD MW Reflex 541192229709
BengaBenga on 14 December 2008
forevercloud3000 said:
Madanial said:
SE doing business,they neither friend nor brother with Sony.SE just goes anywhere that make money.

Same as make FFVII for PS and leave N64 behind.

 

I love it when the misinformed use this, that way I can set it straight.....again.

Square did not leave Nintendo in search of better profits, if anything Nintend would have been able to offer them more in actual incentive. This was a day in age where Square cared more about quality then profits. Square had already developed their game, FFVII, for CD format as the N64 was meant to have a disc drive add on. After Nintendo decided that idea would be scraped in order to keep the system economically pleasing(cheap) Square would be at a loss. Do they start from scratch on a hindering format and console? 1. Or go to the stronger more powerful console which also uses the CD format. DING! and Square and Sony lived happily ever after.

You see, Nintendo started the issue that caused them to abandon them, as a matter of fact, Square did not do business with Nintendo for a while until their leadership changed.

This Time of course it is very different. Sony has been doing plenty with supplying SE with the best tools and such to make a game on PS3 work. Yea, the 360 userbase is bigger, but it also came out a year before so that is a duh. 2. Userbase means nothing if it is not your target audience, which it is not. After the onlsaught PS3 was putting on 360 for almost a year, MS had to do something about it. That is where E3 came in, and it has been a nightmare ever since.

3. None of their new IPs are any good.

Sales down 74% for SE.

Userbase is simply not catching hold on 360

There best selling title was for the PSP,Crisis Core. WHo knew that a SE RPG would sell well on a PS system?

4. THey have yet to put out a PS3 game which is where their fanbase is

They have blatently lied to fans all around and lost many of their approval and devotion

They just all around sux right now.

There saving grace?

Tetsuya Nomura, for without him I would shun them as would many PS3 owners. They have done us and themeselves no justice this gen.

 

1. Talking about misinformed: The N64 was leaps and bounds more powerfull than the PS1.

2. So far I haven't seen any evidence that the PS3 in fact DOES have the JRPG audience either. If anything at least some 360 JRPGs sold ok.

3. I take it you played them all?

4. See my second point.

Anyway, the PS3's userbase is apparently not big enough for SE. No game magically creates millions of console sales. You saw MGS4. Massive success, but in total the PS3 boost was maybe 500.000 at max. In Japan the PS3 userbase is now UNDER the average Final Fantasy sales. Those lost sales have to come from somewhere, and if you can't see that the 360 audience buys loads of games (especially those with high review scores and hype) you must do some research.



ctk495 on 14 December 2008
LordTheNightKnight said:
SnowWhitesDrug said:
I will get it on ps3 because I just couldnt imagen playing it on a 360, it would be like playing mario on anything other then a nintendo system :(

 

No, because one is first party, the other is third party. Denying that isn't going to make S-E magically come back.

 

 

Nah I believe it will stay wii exclusive since it will probably will since the HD consoles and the wii are so different.



jesus kung fu magic on 14 December 2008
forevercloud3000 said:
LordTheNightKnight said:
forevercloud3000 said:
FaRmLaNd said:
If FF13 was exclusive to the ps3 I and millions of other 360 only owners wouldn't get to play. That is why its multi-platform.

 

No, you , and millions of other 360 owners would have bought PS3s, one way or another. Dont pull that crap. If you are a fan of the series you WERE goingto buy a PS3, until the MP thing, no use denying it. Yea  its exspensive, but you would have found a way to get it just how you got your 360. It really is not that hard to figure out.

PS2 took up an estimated 80% of the userbase last gen. It was cheaper then Xbox was. FF games of late on average sell about 5million. Do you really think that if it was multiplat then that another 5million people were going to miraculously appear as fans on the XBOX for it. NO. USerbase does not equal sales unless your taget audience is included. If XIII is good its good, it will sell 5mill+, but it would have been just the same if it was on PS3. Maybe 10% less at the most. Is that 10% worth shelling out man power to work on an adjacent title so it can "widen userbase"?

The whole MP equals Sales logic is flawed....

 

Man, what delusion. If what you claimed was true, there would be no need to put the game on the 360. The sales would be assured. But S-E doesn't rely on fanboys like you, so they put it on two systems to increase sales.

I love it when people try to denounce my claim yet have no real argument. how about you give some concrete reasoning for a MP game selling better then an exclusive one and we will talk.

Halo 3, an exclusive game for 360 that has out sold majority of MP games this gen(8.6 million). It was only barely out sold by COD4 which is somewhere around 10-11million(PS3+360). That is less then either systems entire userbases seperate.

GTAIV was also around 11million.  GTAIII sold 11.6 million while still exclusive to PS2 alone.

DMC4 sold almost 2.5 million. DMC 1 sold 2.77million as a PS2 exclusive.

Ok, Now lets tally up. What are the most successful Games?

Halo3(8mill)

Gran Turismo 3 A Spec (14mill)

Final Fantasy VII10-11mill)

Gears of War (5.5mil)

New Super Mario Bros. (16mill)

Mario Kart Wii(11mil)

Crash Bandicoot 2 (7.5mil)

Jak and Daxter(3.5mil)

Metal Gear Solid (5.6mill)

Pokemon Red/Green/Blue (31mill)

God of War (3.2mil)

Kingdom Hearts (5.5mill)

WOW would you look at that. Majority of the best known and best selling franchise leaders are all exclusive titles. Who would have thunk it?

Now lets got to the Top 5 selling franchises of all time!

  1. Mario
  2. Pokemon
  3. The Sims
  4. Final Fantasy
  5. Need For Speed

3/5 are exclusive franchises to a console or another (except FF of late but they do nto factor into statistics)

What does this Prove?

That making a game Multiplat does not equal better sales.

Now What Have we learned?

 

 Final fantasy was exclusive because there was no reason to release it on any other system because it was on systems who were on top in terms of sales. Does that sound like the ps3? No , hence why ff 13 will be released on the 360.

There is ABSOLUTLY no reason to keep ff 13 exclusive on a console with the weakest sales.



N64 is the ONLY console of the fifth generation!!!