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Forums - Gaming Discussion - Is DVD-9 enough this generation?

windbane said:

1. Considering I'm morally against porn, I really don't care if Sony tries to block it.  I'm sure you are in favor of friend codes, though, because Nintendo is always trying to "protect kids."  Which is worse?  Friend codes.  Oh, and protecting kids from third parties having the same access to online kits.  Much worse.

2. The greatest features are already in use for blu-ray:  video, audio, scratch proof, more space.  Movie studios all want copy protection.  They would not support a format that didn't at least try to stop piracy.

3. I think Sony has a great optical format track record.  The CD and DVD worked out great.  There many problems with DVD-9:  it doesn't provide the best audio, it has inferior video quality for HDTVs, it doesn't have the space neccesary for that audio and video, and it's easily damaged.  HD-TV is going to be there no matter what movie format we use, because in 2009 every station much broadcast in HD.  People want HD because it looks better.  Blu-ray is the best format to move forward with HDTVs.  Also, I want a quote stating the actual penetration.

4. "While Companies like Nintendo respond to market trends and try to enable new audiences within a market, Sony tries to make, force and enforce trends at the cost of whoever gets in their way."  I know you are a hopeless Nintendo fanboy, but Nintendo certainly wants money as much as any other company.  They tried to charge way too much for cartridge use for generations and lost third party support for the N64 and Gamecube.  Sony is trying to advance the market to HD to make money.  Of course they want to make money, but if consumers didn't enjoy the products they wouldn't keep buying them.  Saying Sony is forcing people to buy HDTVs is just ignorance.  Nintendo is trying to expand the videogame market because they want to make money.  All 3 console companies have screwed over fans at many points.  Btw...responding to market trends?  I think Nintendo is a little late on that internet thing... 


1. So its okay for Sony to tell everyone what they can or can't watch because it personally doesn't bother you. Wonderful logic.

2. But how far should piracy protection go? Do you think the root kits on CDs were ethical? What of Sony's abandoned plans of making it so the PS3 game discs couldn't be played on any other PS3 but the one it was registered to was ethical?

3. But the question is, do we absolutely really need something better than DVD-9 right now when less than 10% of the market has a HD TV? And if its only problems are that its not as good as Blu-Ray, I don't see a need to replace it.

4. A hopeless fanboy? Yes, because I'm the one who tried to supplementing their own personal opinion as justification for a corporation playing the role of Big Brother. Listen. You just simply make one excuse after another to defend Sony's ethics despite damning evidence to the contrary. That is fanboyism. Sure Nintendo wants money, but how are they screwing over the consumer? The Wii's graphics? That's a matter of taste, not a sin against man, I can live with them and obviously the majority of gamers can too. The Wii's disc format? Again I fail to see how this is a sin against the consumer. The Wii not supporting HD? Since HD has so little market penetration, why should they make their system more expensive for something most people won't have until the next Nintendo console comes out? Nintendo isn't the same company that said no blood on the SNES or launched the N64, hell its not even the same Company that launched the Game cube. They completely reformated the itself and its leading members and staff during the Gamecube's run to adress their repeated failure and as a result went from the worst selling Nintendo console ever (Gamecube) to the best selling (Wii). What is screwing over the consumer though is Sony forcing an unproven propriotary disc format on the consumer as a trojan vehicle in their gaming console, putting maliscious root kits in CDs and telling the consumer what they can or can't watch through big brother media censorship. Any argument you can make against Nintendo is purely opinionative, irrelevant or without factual basis. And no, not providing the consumer with the top of the line technology isn't unethical nor does it make them a bad company, it makes them a patient company, unlike Sony.

All you see is what's more technologically advanced and you make any justification after the fact you need to in order to defend it. Simple as that. and your reply proves it.



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akuma587 said:
Apparently GBallzack thought everything in my last post was a direct reply to (or attack on) him, not one that also replied to Dryden and other people. Seriously, GBallzack, don't take things personal, and don't make things personal. It is pretty childish and I really don't think, and can tell that other people think, you add little if anything to these forums.

Does anyone else think Sony killed GBallzack's parents? Maybe he is just a rabid fanboy.

So instead of actually providing anything to support your claims, you just proceed to make even more unfounded claims and personal attacks. And I'm the troll? *rolls eyes*

(btw, I'm female)



Just looked at DIRT: Colin McRae Off-Road minimal Requirements on PC:
Game of 2007 - - 12.5 Gb Hard Drive Space.



Every 5 seconds on earth one child dies from hunger...

2009.04.30 - PS3 will OUTSELL x360 atleast by the middle of 2010. Japan+Europe > NA.


Gran Turismo 3 - 1,06 mln. in 3 weeks with around 4 mln. PS2 on the launch.
Gran Turismo 4 - 1,16 mln. with 18 mln. PS2 on the launch.

Final Fantasy X - around 2 mln. with 5 mln. PS2 on the launch.
Final Fantasy X-2 - 2.4 mln. with 12 mln. PS2 on the launch.

 

1.8 mln. PS3 today(2008.01.17) in Japan. Now(2009.04.30) 3.16 mln. PS3 were sold in Japan.
PS3 will reach 4 mln. in Japan by the end of 2009 with average weekly sales 25k.

PS3 may reach 5 mln. in Japan by the end of 2009 with average weekly sales 50k.
PS2 2001 vs PS3 2008 sales numbers =) + New games released in Japan by 2009 that passed 100k so far

CrazzyMan said:
Just looked at DIRT: Colin McRae Off-Road minimal Requirements on PC:
Game of 2007 - - 12.5 Gb Hard Drive Space.

Well it is for the PC, with higher graphics and more content.



i dont think dvd9 will be enough... just look at gran turismo 4... it was 9 gigs alone which is why they cut the online portion out of the game...



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Bonafide732 said:
i dont think dvd9 will be enough... just look at gran turismo 4... it was 9 gigs alone which is why they cut the online portion out of the game...

 You can't compare PS2 games for DVD size. A lot of them used padding to shorten loading times. GTAIII was over 4GB on the PS2, but was just over 700MB on the Xbox. Vice City was also over 4GB on the PS2, but just 1.2GB on the Xbox.

  Do not think I am bashing the PS2 for this. The method worked, but it does mean the size of PS2 games isn't a good indicator of the size for another system.

 Besides, Gran Turismo 4 had FMVs.



A flashy-first game is awesome when it comes out. A great-first game is awesome forever.

Plus, just for the hell of it: Kelly Brook at the 2008 BAFTAs

LordTheNightKnight said:
Bonafide732 said:
i dont think dvd9 will be enough... just look at gran turismo 4... it was 9 gigs alone which is why they cut the online portion out of the game...

 You can't compare PS2 games for DVD size. A lot of them used padding to shorten loading times. GTAIII was over 4GB on the PS2, but was just over 700MB on the Xbox. Vice City was also over 4GB on the PS2, but just 1.2GB on the Xbox.

  Do not think I am bashing the PS2 for this. The method worked, but it does mean the size of PS2 games isn't a good indicator of the size for another system.

 Besides, Gran Turismo 4 had FMVs.

my point was that they could not fit everything on the disc that they wanted to without going to a 2nd disc..

 



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Bonafide732 said:
i dont think dvd9 will be enough... just look at gran turismo 4... it was 9 gigs alone which is why they cut the online portion out of the game...

That's a joke... right?

GT3 had 5 times more cars than GT4.

Online was dropped because they couldn't get it to work properly. GT4 was originally delayed by x(?) months for this reason, then online was dropped completely (and there were rumours about a special add-on pack/new budget release with multiplayer).

Any programmer could tell you that the online component for a game like this, takes NO extra disc space. Its just code - not assets. Even if they needed lower LODs ("level of detail" meshes/textures) for all the cars, this would already be in the game.

...

If number of cars is a reason for not using DVD-9 - IMO, that's a WANK - not a friggin reason. You pick the number of cars BASED on the size of the media - not the other way around!!

I can say - I want 100,000 different cars - so sorry, BluRay isn't big enough - develop media that is 1000x larger.

This is the exact point of downloadable content. They can have 100,000 cars on the server - and people can download/access the cars they want. And it fits just fine on DVD-9!

And if they REALLY want to ship the game with 1000 cars in the game - and only 500 fit on a DVD-9 disc (20MB for a single car? With shared assets? I don't think so - much, much smaller than this if developed properly!) - put 2 discs in the box. The 2nd disc can install straight to the hard-disc, and never be needed again. Might help with those load times as well ;)

 

 



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Bonafide732 said:
LordTheNightKnight said:
Bonafide732 said:
i dont think dvd9 will be enough... just look at gran turismo 4... it was 9 gigs alone which is why they cut the online portion out of the game...

You can't compare PS2 games for DVD size. A lot of them used padding to shorten loading times. GTAIII was over 4GB on the PS2, but was just over 700MB on the Xbox. Vice City was also over 4GB on the PS2, but just 1.2GB on the Xbox.

Do not think I am bashing the PS2 for this. The method worked, but it does mean the size of PS2 games isn't a good indicator of the size for another system.

Besides, Gran Turismo 4 had FMVs.

my point was that they could not fit everything on the disc that they wanted to without going to a 2nd disc..

 


 But my point was that space on the PS2 is a lot bigger due to padding, so PS2 games do not prove DVD9 won't be enough.



A flashy-first game is awesome when it comes out. A great-first game is awesome forever.

Plus, just for the hell of it: Kelly Brook at the 2008 BAFTAs

shams said:
Bonafide732 said:
i dont think dvd9 will be enough... just look at gran turismo 4... it was 9 gigs alone which is why they cut the online portion out of the game...

That's a joke... right?

GT3 had 5 times more cars than GT4.

Online was dropped because they couldn't get it to work properly. GT4 was originally delayed by x(?) months for this reason, then online was dropped completely (and there were rumours about a special add-on pack/new budget release with multiplayer).

Any programmer could tell you that the online component for a game like this, takes NO extra disc space. Its just code - not assets. Even if they needed lower LODs ("level of detail" meshes/textures) for all the cars, this would already be in the game.

...

If number of cars is a reason for not using DVD-9 - IMO, that's a WANK - not a friggin reason. You pick the number of cars BASED on the size of the media - not the other way around!!

I can say - I want 100,000 different cars - so sorry, BluRay isn't big enough - develop media that is 1000x larger.

This is the exact point of downloadable content. They can have 100,000 cars on the server - and people can download/access the cars they want. And it fits just fine on DVD-9!

And if they REALLY want to ship the game with 1000 cars in the game - and only 500 fit on a DVD-9 disc (20MB for a single car? With shared assets? I don't think so - much, much smaller than this if developed properly!) - put 2 discs in the box. The 2nd disc can install straight to the hard-disc, and never be needed again. Might help with those load times as well ;)

 

 


you really typed alot.. and you really said nothing... i have been playing gran turismo since gran turismo 1 so i think i know a little something about the series... it is my favorite series of all time... with that being said... obviously you dont know what you are talking about



THe oNLY TRue STuPiDiTY iS THe aCCePTaNCe oF iGNoRaNCe 

PSNTAG K_I_N_G__COKE

  The King Of The Iron Fist tournament