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Forums - Gaming - Black sheep of the series that are great actually (and why)

SvennoJ said:
curl-6 said:

If Wii level graphics and motion controls aren't a dealbreaker for you, I'd definitely recommend it, it's an interesting little spinoff with some cool ideas.

You just described VR :p 

I'll keep it in mind next time I visit my local game store, lots of Wii games there.

Don't play the PS2 version. It's a port of the PSP version, which looks significantly worse. Be prepared to pay out the ass for Shattered Memories tho. All Silent Hill games shot way up in price last year or so. SM is over 100 sometimes.

Last edited by Leynos - on 23 October 2025

Bite my shiny metal cockpit!

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@SvennoJ

I don't know man, I remember that pretty much both me and all of my PC gaming buddies were quite disappointed with Doom 3. Not only it was not "proper" Doom, but just couple months before it sublime The Chronicles of Riddick: Escape from Butcher Bay launched, which was, both visually and gameplay wise much better game. And then few months later both Half-Life 2 and HALO 2 launched.

2004 was not kind to DOOM3, even in FPS genre, let alone when you account for all other releases.



I may have very not-mainstream opinions, I guess. Here we go.

  • Final Fantasy XIII did'nt deserve that amount of backlash. At that time I spent a lot of time with this game and I thought the story was insanely tight and intense.
  • Castlevania II: Simon's Quest. While it is admittedly very confusing, it's awesome once you know what you're doing.
  • I second Castlevania Lament of Innocence and Curse of Darkness, these two were super dope for me.
  • Doom 3 is much better in every way than the first two.
  • I love Kirby and the Rainbow Course (the one on the Wii U that looks like clay).
  • I love Super Mario Bros. 2
  • I loved loved loved Metroid Prime: Federation Force online with three strangers. It was absolutely fantastic.
  • I love Metroid: Other M and still replay that every now and then.
  • Paper Mario: Color Splash was tons of fun.
  • I second Silent Hill: Downpour. Combat may be shit but the atmosphere is what drives SH games. 
  • Star Fox Zero. Learn the controls, it's worth it.
  • Tekken 4 is the best in the series for me.


HoloDust said:

@SvennoJ

I don't know man, I remember that pretty much both me and all of my PC gaming buddies were quite disappointed with Doom 3. Not only it was not "proper" Doom, but just couple months before it sublime The Chronicles of Riddick: Escape from Butcher Bay launched, which was, both visually and gameplay wise much better game. And then few months later both Half-Life 2 and HALO 2 launched.

2004 was not kind to DOOM3, even in FPS genre, let alone when you account for all other releases.

2004 wanted fast paced action, Unreal Tournament style fps. 

Maybe it was ahead of its time, it played a lot like like Dead Space, or rather Dead Space is a 3rd person version of Doom 3.

I never liked the Chronicles of Riddick, nor Halo 2 (repetitive level design). HL2 was slower paced as well, that got its own criticism at the time. I loved the slower paced sections and puzzles. 

I enjoyed the slower pace of Doom 3 a lot. The lighting and use of terminals with rendered interactive screens instead of a texture was revolutionary at the time as well. There was a lot of 'bitching' about the flashlight, but that made the game, added the tension and turned it towards horror survival rather than a horror shooter..

"The flashlight in Doom 3 cannot be tied to a weapon because it is a deliberate game design choice to increase tension. The original PC version of Doom 3 requires the player to manually switch between the flashlight and their weapon, creating a risk of being in the dark with a weapon out."

People were bitching everywhere that a futuristic game couldn't have the flashlight part of the gun.

Doom 3 was groundbreaking like HL2. Story telling through PDA's you pick up became standard as well as creating a bridge between survival and action horror, laying the groundwork for Dead Space and Alien Isolation type games.



Usually I do not think black sheep type of games are comparable to the other good games in a series. There are multiple games that made a detour from the franchise usual formula but become beloved and therefore not seen as black sheep as a whole, Resident Evil 4 being one of the games.

Maybe Donkey Konga is the closest. But even if it share the name of a platform legend the game has nothing in common with those games, making it more of a subseries. I played this game basically every day after school for 6 months. The controls was so simple and it made me move my body, even if it was just my arms, something I need.



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SvennoJ said:
HoloDust said:

@SvennoJ

I don't know man, I remember that pretty much both me and all of my PC gaming buddies were quite disappointed with Doom 3. Not only it was not "proper" Doom, but just couple months before it sublime The Chronicles of Riddick: Escape from Butcher Bay launched, which was, both visually and gameplay wise much better game. And then few months later both Half-Life 2 and HALO 2 launched.

2004 was not kind to DOOM3, even in FPS genre, let alone when you account for all other releases.

2004 wanted fast paced action, Unreal Tournament style fps. 

Maybe it was ahead of its time, it played a lot like like Dead Space, or rather Dead Space is a 3rd person version of Doom 3.

I never liked the Chronicles of Riddick, nor Halo 2 (repetitive level design). HL2 was slower paced as well, that got its own criticism at the time. I loved the slower paced sections and puzzles. 

I enjoyed the slower pace of Doom 3 a lot. The lighting and use of terminals with rendered interactive screens instead of a texture was revolutionary at the time as well. There was a lot of 'bitching' about the flashlight, but that made the game, added the tension and turned it towards horror survival rather than a horror shooter..

"The flashlight in Doom 3 cannot be tied to a weapon because it is a deliberate game design choice to increase tension. The original PC version of Doom 3 requires the player to manually switch between the flashlight and their weapon, creating a risk of being in the dark with a weapon out."

People were bitching everywhere that a futuristic game couldn't have the flashlight part of the gun.

Doom 3 was groundbreaking like HL2. Story telling through PDA's you pick up became standard as well as creating a bridge between survival and action horror, laying the groundwork for Dead Space and Alien Isolation type games.

Hm, I don't know - if anything, DOOM 3 is built on HL1 and System Shock before it (including audio logs). Problem with it was that, while not bad game per se (but not really that good either), it was not DOOM. If it was new IP, then maybe it wouldn't get as much flak.

It's like modern TR is Tomb Raider in name only.



Wipeout Fusion for the PS2. My first Wipeout was 3, but Fusion on the PS2 is the one that hooked me and I played the most. Might have been overtaken by Wipeout HD now if you combine my time on PS3 and in Omega Collection, but I love Wipeout Fusion. All the teams having their own special weapon, upgrading your stats through the campaign. Not just the League, but the challenge medals, zone mode too.

While Pulse/HD really upped the quality of the series, I still really love Wipeout Fusion.



Super Mario Sunshine. I think the only 3D Mario game that could be considered more of a black sheep is 3D Land due to it being the smallest in scale of a 3D Mario game and its few puzzles that are awkward without 3D turned on. 3D Land is great and along with Mario Kart 7 it was a much-needed boost of life (along with a price cut) to 3DS.
Sunshine has awkward moments in the physics (that darn boat ride) and has been surpassed by the Galaxy games and Odyssey, but the atmosphere is amazing. And the gameplay itself? Great at worst.



Lifetime Sales Predictions 

Switch: 161 million (was 73 million, then 96 million, then 113 million, then 125 million, then 144 million, then 151 million, then 156 million)

PS5: 122 million (was 105 million, then 115 million) Xbox Series X/S: 38 million (was 60 million, then 67 million, then 57 million. then 48 million. then 40 million)

Switch 2: 120 million (was 116 million)

PS4: 120 mil (was 100 then 130 million, then 122 million) Xbox One: 51 mil (was 50 then 55 mil)

3DS: 75.5 mil (was 73, then 77 million)

"Let go your earthly tether, enter the void, empty and become wind." - Guru Laghima

I know fans will consider this blasphemy, but I enjoyed DMC 2013.

It diverges massively from the franchise's roots, but as someone who wasn't that attached to the older games, I found its stylish visuals and punchy action very satisfying. 



curl-6 said:

I know fans will consider this blasphemy, but I enjoyed DMC 2013.

It diverges massively from the franchise's roots, but as someone who wasn't that attached to the older games, I found its stylish visuals and punchy action very satisfying. 

No such thing as DMC 2013. There is DmC and it's not the black sheep of DMC because it's its own game and not even a series as one game. DMC2 is the black sheep of the DMC series.



Bite my shiny metal cockpit!