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Forums - Gaming - Do you think GTA6 and The Witcher 4 will look as good at launch? (Poll)

 

GTA6 and TW4 will look as good as represented at launch

Yes. 3 18.75%
 
Yes and better. 1 6.25%
 
No. Downgraded. 11 68.75%
 
I'm unsure. 1 6.25%
 
Total:16
Mummelmann said:

The Witcher 4 won't look anywhere near what they showed overall. The detail on the horse model alone was a dead give-away. UE5 simply isn't capable of delivering that and still actually run on any hardware - look at the whole "Hell is Us" situation (even a RTX 5090 struggles on 4K Ultra settings). I have yet to play a single UE5 game that runs properly, and I've tried quite a few. Even CDPR themselves were adamant that this was simply a tech demo and not representative of actual gameplay. 

The talked about the use of Nanite to simplify the process of rendering vegetation and foliage, for instance, but Nanite has been around for years and not a single developer has made it work they way it was advertised from the beginning. Lumen is another issue; it's jaggy and taxing, and clashes with reflections on any liquid surface (extreme AA issues in most cases). 

Quite simply; UE5 is not an engine that can deliver what we saw in actual, playable form, not to mention on aging hardware like a PS5 base or Xbox Series S (the latter will be a real challenge). That said, I'm prepared for massive downgrades and I'd rather be able to run the damn thing properly and have it be a solid game.

Hellblade 2 has essentially acheievd everything promised with UE5, so I wouldn't go that far.

The engine can definitely run this on modern hardware, I just don't expect the same fidelity on consoles/mid range and certainly not at 60fps. The sacrifices will pile in quick as developement grows but I think something approaching this is achievable for the 30fps mode at sub 1440p.

Hellblade 2 has already achieved equal/better visuals albeit on a  much smaller scale and a very stable performance. Naturally CD Projejkt Red working with Epic will escalate improvements in engine where most needed for their open world ambitions. Hell is Us meanwhile is more or less an AA game, less resources and probably just working with out the box UE5 features so I wouldn't put too much weight on that... but for sure it is not easy to have performant UE5 games on current gen platforms but we're seeing a turn of quality in output in the coming year or so. The new Mafia game is another one to watch





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Pemalite said:
Mummelmann said:

The Witcher 4 won't look anywhere near what they showed overall. The detail on the horse model alone was a dead give-away. UE5 simply isn't capable of delivering that and still actually run on any hardware - look at the whole "Hell is Us" situation (even a RTX 5090 struggles on 4K Ultra settings). I have yet to play a single UE5 game that runs properly, and I've tried quite a few. Even CDPR themselves were adamant that this was simply a tech demo and not representative of actual gameplay. 

The talked about the use of Nanite to simplify the process of rendering vegetation and foliage, for instance, but Nanite has been around for years and not a single developer has made it work they way it was advertised from the beginning. Lumen is another issue; it's jaggy and taxing, and clashes with reflections on any liquid surface (extreme AA issues in most cases). 

Quite simply; UE5 is not an engine that can deliver what we saw in actual, playable form, not to mention on aging hardware like a PS5 base or Xbox Series S (the latter will be a real challenge). That said, I'm prepared for massive downgrades and I'd rather be able to run the damn thing properly and have it be a solid game.

It's doable from the perspective that it's still a game that is still years from being released... I wouldn't be surprised if it's 2027 or 2028 that it comes out.

Which means it may land on Xbox Series X2 and Playstation 6 as a cross-gen title.

That might be true, but they made it a point that the demo was running on a base PS5 and with RT on. I think for the size of the installed base alone, they would want to release on current consoles to net them sales. Cross-gen is very possible, but that would still entail compromises to fit both generations, especially in the case of the woefully incapable Series S. From a technical standpoint, a next-gen only release would de desirable, but that's unrealistic. I agree with the time-frame, leaning more towards 2028, which would further increase the chances of it being a cross-gen release.

@Otter: Hellblade 2 is very impressive, but that's also a linear game, by and large. It does run pretty well though. Open-world games take a lot more effort from both developer and hardware, at least on average. That, and more narrative simplicity, is the among the main reasons why smaller studios often opt to go for more linear design. Mafia: The Old Country is also a linear game lacking the demands of open-world design.

Look; it might look and run amazingly when it releases, but as of right now, there's nothing from CDPR themselves, or the engine in question, to indicate that this is a given. It'll be a challenge for them for sure. While CDPR are terrific developers, they have lost some edge since TW3, and they have a history of over-promising in certain key aspects. Regardless of how it looks when it comes out, I'm likely among the day-one buyers. 



Mummelmann said:
Pemalite said:

It's doable from the perspective that it's still a game that is still years from being released... I wouldn't be surprised if it's 2027 or 2028 that it comes out.

Which means it may land on Xbox Series X2 and Playstation 6 as a cross-gen title.

That might be true, but they made it a point that the demo was running on a base PS5 and with RT on. I think for the size of the installed base alone, they would want to release on current consoles to net them sales. Cross-gen is very possible, but that would still entail compromises to fit both generations, especially in the case of the woefully incapable Series S. From a technical standpoint, a next-gen only release would de desirable, but that's unrealistic. I agree with the time-frame, leaning more towards 2028, which would further increase the chances of it being a cross-gen release.

@Otter: Hellblade 2 is very impressive, but that's also a linear game, by and large. It does run pretty well though. Open-world games take a lot more effort from both developer and hardware, at least on average. That, and more narrative simplicity, is the among the main reasons why smaller studios often opt to go for more linear design. Mafia: The Old Country is also a linear game lacking the demands of open-world design.

Look; it might look and run amazingly when it releases, but as of right now, there's nothing from CDPR themselves, or the engine in question, to indicate that this is a given. It'll be a challenge for them for sure. While CDPR are terrific developers, they have lost some edge since TW3, and they have a history of over-promising in certain key aspects. Regardless of how it looks when it comes out, I'm likely among the day-one buyers. 

Just because it releases on PS5, doesn't mean it should. 

Case in point: Cyberpunk 2077 on PS4. It could and did release on PS4, but it probably shouldn't have.

Again though, it's still years away from release, so it will be a cross-gen title.- RT is an expectation for all AAA games these days regardless of platform if it supports it in hardware.
But RT is a broad-umbrella of rendering technologies, we don't actually know the extent of RT.



--::{PC Gaming Master Race}::--

Pemalite said:
Mummelmann said:

That might be true, but they made it a point that the demo was running on a base PS5 and with RT on. I think for the size of the installed base alone, they would want to release on current consoles to net them sales. Cross-gen is very possible, but that would still entail compromises to fit both generations, especially in the case of the woefully incapable Series S. From a technical standpoint, a next-gen only release would de desirable, but that's unrealistic. I agree with the time-frame, leaning more towards 2028, which would further increase the chances of it being a cross-gen release.

@Otter: Hellblade 2 is very impressive, but that's also a linear game, by and large. It does run pretty well though. Open-world games take a lot more effort from both developer and hardware, at least on average. That, and more narrative simplicity, is the among the main reasons why smaller studios often opt to go for more linear design. Mafia: The Old Country is also a linear game lacking the demands of open-world design.

Look; it might look and run amazingly when it releases, but as of right now, there's nothing from CDPR themselves, or the engine in question, to indicate that this is a given. It'll be a challenge for them for sure. While CDPR are terrific developers, they have lost some edge since TW3, and they have a history of over-promising in certain key aspects. Regardless of how it looks when it comes out, I'm likely among the day-one buyers. 

Just because it releases on PS5, doesn't mean it should. 

Case in point: Cyberpunk 2077 on PS4. It could and did release on PS4, but it probably shouldn't have.

Again though, it's still years away from release, so it will be a cross-gen title.- RT is an expectation for all AAA games these days regardless of platform if it supports it in hardware.
But RT is a broad-umbrella of rendering technologies, we don't actually know the extent of RT.

Yeah, CP 2077 on PS4 is one of the most embarrassing releases of the past decade. It's always a concern when cross-gen time arrive; you run the risk of either lacking an actual audience for your release, or having to compromise too much on tech. It's not an enviable position for any developer to be in for sure. 

RT has much the same issues as UE itself; it's wielded by many as blunt instrument, when it has potential to be implemented in a much more productive and sensible way. Indiana Jones has mandatory RT, it ran quite well by most accounts (but that's built in some form of idTech, I believe).



Mummelmann said:

Yeah, CP 2077 on PS4 is one of the most embarrassing releases of the past decade. It's always a concern when cross-gen time arrive; you run the risk of either lacking an actual audience for your release, or having to compromise too much on tech. It's not an enviable position for any developer to be in for sure. 

RT has much the same issues as UE itself; it's wielded by many as blunt instrument, when it has potential to be implemented in a much more productive and sensible way. Indiana Jones has mandatory RT, it ran quite well by most accounts (but that's built in some form of idTech, I believe).

It was quite a bit worse than embarrassing, deliberate deception to get those million pre-orders cashed in. It's one of the very few games ever taken off the PSN store with refunds given. It led to lawsuits etc. Criminal would be a better word. 

I wouldn't buy TW4 at release for current gen systems, not a chance. It's already on the same path as CP2077, early announcements / 'gameplay' footage to start the hype machine with bullshit trailers. CDPR is putting themselves in the same position again, delay and anger the hype machine or release prematurely, likely with inhuman crunch again and thousands of bugs still to solve.

And now they can blame UE for performance issues. 



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SvennoJ said:
Mummelmann said:

Yeah, CP 2077 on PS4 is one of the most embarrassing releases of the past decade. It's always a concern when cross-gen time arrive; you run the risk of either lacking an actual audience for your release, or having to compromise too much on tech. It's not an enviable position for any developer to be in for sure. 

RT has much the same issues as UE itself; it's wielded by many as blunt instrument, when it has potential to be implemented in a much more productive and sensible way. Indiana Jones has mandatory RT, it ran quite well by most accounts (but that's built in some form of idTech, I believe).

It was quite a bit worse than embarrassing, deliberate deception to get those million pre-orders cashed in. It's one of the very few games ever taken off the PSN store with refunds given. It led to lawsuits etc. Criminal would be a better word. 

I wouldn't buy TW4 at release for current gen systems, not a chance. It's already on the same path as CP2077, early announcements / 'gameplay' footage to start the hype machine with bullshit trailers. CDPR is putting themselves in the same position again, delay and anger the hype machine or release prematurely, likely with inhuman crunch again and thousands of bugs still to solve.

And now they can blame UE for performance issues. 

Apparently, this is "800p-1080p Graphic + DoF and upscaled by TSR to 1440p for post processing and then spatially upscaled to 4K with native 4K UI"  on actual PS5.

I think they deliberately choose not to show PC footage, because of the issues in the past.