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KLXVER said:

Why has me not wanting to be lectured in video games suddenly turned into that I dont have sympathy for people in the LGBTQIA+ community?

The whole crux of the issue is that you're trying to tie in "wokeness" with "being lectured".

There's no issue with talking about "this writing could be better, it feels overly like a lecture." As I've said, people on the left have these kinds of conversations all the time without being regarded as unsympathetic or racist or sexist or whatever. 

But when you have to make this a bigger issue and tie in groups that directly attack the other groups, or when you have to attack those groups yourself, that becomes problematic. 

"Jeremy might be a racist, but he was right that this black character was poorly written" => all around crappy comment.

"This black character was poorly written, they could have made different choices" => potentially a great comment.

KLXVER said:

Im trying to explain how some people may behave the way they do from past experiences, but all you guys see are hate. 

This goes both ways. 

KLXVER said:

I have tried to find common ground with you guys, but thats just a waste of time obviously.

I've repeatedly opened the door for better common ground, and for some reason you've never taken it. 

You keep insisting that you don't want to be lectured and don't want bad writing; and I'm just saying you can absolutely 100% complain about those things without making the issue about "wokeness". But for whatever reason you don't want to drop the "wokeness" part. 



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the-pi-guy said:
KLXVER said:

Why has me not wanting to be lectured in video games suddenly turned into that I dont have sympathy for people in the LGBTQIA+ community?

The whole crux of the issue is that you're trying to tie in "wokeness" with "being lectured".

There's no issue with talking about "this writing could be better, it feels overly like a lecture." As I've said, people on the left have these kinds of conversations all the time without being regarded as unsympathetic or racist or sexist or whatever. 

But when you have to make this a bigger issue and tie in groups that directly attack the other groups, or when you have to attack those groups yourself, that becomes problematic. 

"Jeremy might be a racist, but he was right that this black character was poorly written" => all around crappy comment.

"This black character was poorly written, they could have made different choices" => potentially a great comment.

KLXVER said:

Im trying to explain how some people may behave the way they do from past experiences, but all you guys see are hate. 

This goes both ways. 

KLXVER said:

I have tried to find common ground with you guys, but thats just a waste of time obviously.

I've repeatedly opened the door for better common ground, and for some reason you've never taken it. 

You keep insisting that you don't want to be lectured and don't want bad writing; and I'm just saying you can absolutely 100% complain about those things without making the issue about "wokeness". But for whatever reason you don't want to drop the "wokeness" part. 

I wont drop wokeness, no. I believe that is what is dividing people more than anything in todays society. I refuse to be lectured to by woke people that pretend to have peoples best interest in heart. They dont want equality, they want superiority. They pretend to care about minorities and the LGBT community, but as soon as anybody from any of those groups dont agree with them and their beliefs 100%, they are suddenly not so important anymore.   

I think this video (even though it is a comdey sketch) nails what many people now think about woke people:

Not anything I say will ever come close to this video, so I wont post here anymore. Not because of you, but I need to focus on my mental well being at this point. Runa said that I think you guys are snowflakes, but that is not true. If anything, Im the snowflake. I have a tendency to let my emotions take over when I become frustrated. You guys are as cold as ice. 

Last edited by KLXVER - 1 day ago

KLXVER said:

I wont drop wokeness, no. I believe that is what is dividing people more than anything in todays society. I refuse to be lectured to by woke people that pretend to have peoples best interest in heart. They dont want equality, they want superiority. They pretend to care about minorities and the LGBT community, but as soon as anybody from any of those groups dont agree with them and their beliefs 100%, they are suddenly not so important anymore.   

I think this video (even though it is a comdey sketch) nails what many people now think about woke people:

You are literally not being "lectured", stop using that as a bullshit scapegoat... You are using a Ad Hominem - Poisoning the Well Logical Fallacy.

What people are trying to do is engage in an Adult and Constructive discussion... And you are literally coming up with any excuse possible to stick your fingers in your ears and decline any formal or reasonable discussion.

***

If by your definition someone who is woke is someone who truly doesn't want equality... Then Dragon Age: Veilguard is not woke, no one in this thread is woke.
And that means you have nothing to complain about.



--::{PC Gaming Master Race}::--

KLXVER said:
Machiavellian said:

Which game do you think I am saying you have not played when you have already stated you have not played the game we are talking about.

We were talking about Mass Effect as well, so I assumed you meant that. My bad.

I have seen several cutscenes and gameplay, heard from people who have played it and read about it. Im not gonna spend my money on something I dont want to play. I gather information from various sources and then I decide if I want to play a game or not. Its like that for most games/franchises Im not already familiar with.

The key point is I have no clue you have or have not played Mass Effect while I definitely know you have not played the new Dragon Age.

The thing is, every game from Bioware has had gay or trans characters, stories, backstories etc in them and it just seems like you woke up today and found out that the game has those themes.  You always have the choice to either go down that route if you so choose or not just like with every Bioware game. 

So all you did was find cutscenes where people went down that route because you wanted something to not like about the game but if you truly have played any Bioware game you would know in their RPGs you always have the option.  I actually watched someone pick 2 separate routes one straight and one not straight within this new Bioware game so I am pretty sure it does the same thing as all Bioware games.

You can like what you like but to act as if what you see in the new Dragon Age is anything different from any other Bioware game is something totally different.  Maybe you should gather sources that does not feed your bias or just understand that every Bioware game is probably not going to have just straight white males in it.



KLXVER said:
the-pi-guy said:

And you feel that these things are being pushed on you, that they feel forced. 

Feelings have real world impact. People make choices based on how they feel. Politicians pass laws based on how people feel about things.

KLXVER said:

 "I dont want puppies to get hurt" Thats weird since alot of us want them to suffer immensly... Dont be silly. 

Some people do want them to suffer.

Even more people don't particularly care until it starts affecting them. 

This goes both ways. 

Many countries in the world pushed back against gay people, criminalized them. Some of that still happens to this day. It wasn't that long ago, that gay people were allowed to get married in some of the freest countries in the world. 

Plenty of gay people are tired of being pushed out of conversations, and they're lashing back. 

Same goes for trans people. They're tired of being pushed out of society. They're lashing out with the little power they have. 

Yet you don't seem to have as much empathy for those people. 

KLXVER said:

Its easy to say you want peace on earth and people to get a long, but you cant even get along with several people on just this site alone. You really dont see any flaws in your logic here?

Getting along with people goes two ways. I'm not able to force people to get along with them. The best I can do most of the time is advocate for people; and be kind when I can. 

Why has me not wanting to be lectured in video games suddenly turned into that I dont have sympathy for people in the LGBTQIA+ community? Im trying to explain how some people may behave the way they do from past experiences, but all you guys see are hate. When have I said anything about not caring about other people? I do care and I want everyone to live their lives the way they want. I also care about people who get blamed for being anti this or anti that. Because I know that people arent born evil and I try to see their side of the argument and what makes them think that way. I have tried to find common ground with you guys, but thats just a waste of time obviously.

I talk about people who have experienced something negative and they see red flags in everything. You guys think that is stupid and then you turn around and call me hateful because "You are seeing the patterns" in how I talk. Red Flags......Seeing the patters.......anything? We are talking about the same thing!

You dont even know that you agree with a lot of what Im saying. You are just so obsessed with coming off as the good guys to see that we are not that different. We just express ourselves in different ways. I have flaws(obviously), but nothing I have said in this thread is in any way hateful towards any kind of person.(Except you and Runa, but you know...) 

Anyways, I need to go to bed. I will dream of world peace and happy puppies.

Is it truly you being lectured or is it that you just have no clue.  Meaning, since I am guessing you are a straight white male, do you have any ideal what its like to be gay, lesbian or trans.  Now I do understand you may not care about them but they do exist and have real stories which could be considered lectured but instead are just stories about lives you have no concept of.  What would be a scene that you would feel isn't lecturing you, one where the gay person is playing a stereotypical role or one where you can easily ignore because its short.

The point I am trying to make is that you seem to only want straight white male stories, which is fine, so play those games.  Instead you want to use a word that is being used to demean anything that is not what you like and champion that word and you are shocked that you are getting push back from it.  If you use a word that is being used in a hateful way then why be shocked you are getting put into that box.

You want to continue to use the word woke, thats fine but you cannot act as if you do not know the context its being used and its overall meaning.



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KLXVER said:
the-pi-guy said:

The whole crux of the issue is that you're trying to tie in "wokeness" with "being lectured".

There's no issue with talking about "this writing could be better, it feels overly like a lecture." As I've said, people on the left have these kinds of conversations all the time without being regarded as unsympathetic or racist or sexist or whatever. 

But when you have to make this a bigger issue and tie in groups that directly attack the other groups, or when you have to attack those groups yourself, that becomes problematic. 

"Jeremy might be a racist, but he was right that this black character was poorly written" => all around crappy comment.

"This black character was poorly written, they could have made different choices" => potentially a great comment.

KLXVER said:

Im trying to explain how some people may behave the way they do from past experiences, but all you guys see are hate. 

This goes both ways. 

I've repeatedly opened the door for better common ground, and for some reason you've never taken it. 

You keep insisting that you don't want to be lectured and don't want bad writing; and I'm just saying you can absolutely 100% complain about those things without making the issue about "wokeness". But for whatever reason you don't want to drop the "wokeness" part. 

I wont drop wokeness, no. I believe that is what is dividing people more than anything in todays society. I refuse to be lectured to by woke people that pretend to have peoples best interest in heart. They dont want equality, they want superiority. They pretend to care about minorities and the LGBT community, but as soon as anybody from any of those groups dont agree with them and their beliefs 100%, they are suddenly not so important anymore.   

I think this video (even though it is a comdey sketch) nails what many people now think about woke people:

Not anything I say will ever come close to this video, so I wont post here anymore. Not because of you, but I need to focus on my mental well being at this point. Runa said that I think you guys are snowflakes, but that is not true. If anything, Im the snowflake. I have a tendency to let my emotions take over when I become frustrated. You guys are as cold as ice. 

'Wokeness' has existed in some form or another for as long as there have been people. There have always been those in power who are comfortable in their power and those who don't have rights seeking those rights. 

It's how we get stuff like civil rights movements, women's rights, etc. IT's how we ended slavery; we had a war over that one. Every single progressive motion or positive change in this world has been driven by 'woke' ideology. The fact that you can't see that is not something I can teach. It's not something I can explain. If you still don't get it, then you're kind of a lost cause. 



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PS4, PS3, PS2, PS1, WiiU, Wii, GCN, N64 SNES, XBO, 360

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"Woke" is not a word I like to use but if I had to give an example, I would consider the following Google Pixel ad from 2022's superbowl as a "woke" ad.

https://youtu.be/3obixhGZ5ds?si=NRhYbZF3ce-SuYDW

The framing of it just sets up camera tech as being 'racially insensitive' but anyone with two brain cells should be able to tell that the problem is one of lighting, not of skin tone. It's especially obnoxious how initial photos are ones with bad lighting that would betray anyone regardless of their skin color. Ad must think of me an idiot. And the music. Where would we be without that good ol' Google and their socially-conscious tech!?

Round of applause for our savior, Google! That damn light is racially insensitive and has had a thorough sensitivity lesson coming since the big bang.

Whatever the case, if I had to define a 'woke' game, I would say one that attempted to address a social ill that in fact wasn't a social ill.



KLAMarine said:

"Woke" is not a word I like to use but if I had to give an example, I would consider the following Google Pixel ad from 2022's superbowl as a "woke" ad.

https://youtu.be/3obixhGZ5ds?si=NRhYbZF3ce-SuYDW

The framing of it just sets up camera tech as being 'racially insensitive' but anyone with two brain cells should be able to tell that the problem is one of lighting, not of skin tone. It's especially obnoxious how initial photos are ones with bad lighting that would betray anyone regardless of their skin color. Ad must think of me an idiot. And the music. Where would we be without that good ol' Google and their socially-conscious tech!?

Round of applause for our savior, Google! That damn light is racially insensitive and has had a thorough sensitivity lesson coming since the big bang.

Whatever the case, if I had to define a 'woke' game, I would say one that attempted to address a social ill that in fact wasn't a social ill.

Lighting and photochemicals were long calibrated for white people. 

They were called Shirley cards. 

And we still have issues today. Facial recognition technology doesn't get trained on black people to the same extent. And it doesn't work as well, even when they're clearly visible. 

Did Google claim to be a savior? 



the-pi-guy said:
KLAMarine said:

"Woke" is not a word I like to use but if I had to give an example, I would consider the following Google Pixel ad from 2022's superbowl as a "woke" ad.

https://youtu.be/3obixhGZ5ds?si=NRhYbZF3ce-SuYDW

The framing of it just sets up camera tech as being 'racially insensitive' but anyone with two brain cells should be able to tell that the problem is one of lighting, not of skin tone. It's especially obnoxious how initial photos are ones with bad lighting that would betray anyone regardless of their skin color. Ad must think of me an idiot. And the music. Where would we be without that good ol' Google and their socially-conscious tech!?

Round of applause for our savior, Google! That damn light is racially insensitive and has had a thorough sensitivity lesson coming since the big bang.

Whatever the case, if I had to define a 'woke' game, I would say one that attempted to address a social ill that in fact wasn't a social ill.

Lighting and photochemicals were long calibrated for white people. 

They were called Shirley cards. 

And we still have issues today. Facial recognition technology doesn't get trained on black people to the same extent. And it doesn't work as well, even when they're clearly visible. 

Did Google claim to be a savior? 

There's zero mention of Shirley cards, ad just shows photos with poor lighting in them at the start. Then it contrasts them with photos with excellent amounts of lighting later in the same ad.

As for the savior talk, I'm referring to the whole vibe of the commercial: it feels like Google patting themselves on the back for phone camera tech that solves a problem that really just needed better lighting.



KLAMarine said:
the-pi-guy said:

Lighting and photochemicals were long calibrated for white people. 

They were called Shirley cards. 

And we still have issues today. Facial recognition technology doesn't get trained on black people to the same extent. And it doesn't work as well, even when they're clearly visible. 

Did Google claim to be a savior? 

There's zero mention of Shirley cards, ad just shows photos with poor lighting in them at the start. Then it contrasts them with photos with excellent amounts of lighting later in the same ad.

As for the savior talk, I'm referring to the whole vibe of the commercial: it feels like Google patting themselves on the back for phone camera tech that solves a problem that really just needed better lighting.

There's nothing wrong with a camera advertising that it is better at taking photos of dark skin. This is a good feature and something that has historically been an issue in photography, and no, it isn't just a problem that needs better lighting. I have gotten professionally lit photos taken like once in my life and even amateur photographers taking pics on their phone don't tend to have a problem capturing my face (I'm white, btw)...

Yeah, the before photos are bad (obviously) and the after photos look professional. Welcome to just about every before/after commercial since the dawn of time.