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Forums - Gaming Discussion - Elden Ring: Scadu of the Nerdtree. 94 OC/95 MC. Is it too hard? Poll.

 

Is the DLC too difficult...

Yes 5 17.24%
 
No 13 44.83%
 
A bit but manageable 8 27.59%
 
No opinion 3 10.34%
 
Total:29
haxxiy said:
LegitHyperbole said:

They can never get it right though, Mortal shell got the gameplay down, improved on the animations quite a bit even but other games just can't get the secret sauce. There's something more than the level design in DS games and base ER that makes it great and hard to quantify, right down to the atmosphere and ambience and itemization. Only From Soft can do that. Pity they get carried away with the git gud shit at times after they get praised and can't help but shoot themselves in the foot but people asked for it this time, they said Elden Ring was too easy, we got what the try hards wanted and not what the 99% of the rest of us wanted... just more Elden Ring. 

I'd say Lies of P is a better game than at least Demon's Souls and Dark Souls 2 (subjective, of course).

Nioh, maybe, in terms of gameplay, but the levels are horrible.

Niohs levels are indeed terrible and the gameplay was better than souls until they went too far with the weapon arts. Itemization is absolutely atrocious too. Nioh 2 had a chance to be one of the greatest had they went with community feedback, alas, a pity. 



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Asmongold rage quit Messmer but has started with a new build. Strange how souls brings you back. It's like an abusive relationship. I'ma wait for Nerfs or boosts.... I may be waiting a while.



LegitHyperbole said:
Mummelmann said:

I think summons are much more important in the DLC, I'm certainly not good enough to beat some of these bosses without them. Took down two bosses, both took well over 10 tries each, even with summons. I'm at Level 7 right now, and my Ashes are level 6, it really makes a difference. Oh; and don't use the NPC summons, the bosses health balloon to crazy amounts and they still die rather quickly.

Wait, the NPC summons is why I was doing chip damage then? I feel slightly less disappointed in myself. What's the highest level you can get to with Scadutree and ashes before Rellana?

I think the max is 5, at least that's all the fragments I could muster. I used my clone to great effect; we proced bleed in a massive lump and took the last third of her HP in one smash. After dumping the NPC summon, it took me 3 tries, I recommend it!

I took down another bothersome knight as well, the arena was really tight and the camera killed me more often than not. I found a clever strategy though, and managed to no-hit him in the end (I'm a bit ashamed of the cheese).

I'm Scadutree level 9 now and doing good damage, most mobs don't hit that hard anymore either. It's been fun, for the most part. I just arrived at a junction where I assume another boss is waiting, I need some rest before I try any more now.



I really want to be in love with this game again so I espec'd to 50 vigor and now I can take 2 or 3 hits. Doing shit for damage but those 10 points made a big difference, waaaay more than it should have had and same for the loss of damage. I'm going 50 vigor, 50 endurance and 70 in my main stat plus item requirements. Does this seem about right folks, or should I sacrifice more Endurance/main stat for vigor? Is my endurance too high?



Mummelmann said:
LegitHyperbole said:

Wait, the NPC summons is why I was doing chip damage then? I feel slightly less disappointed in myself. What's the highest level you can get to with Scadutree and ashes before Rellana?

I think the max is 5, at least that's all the fragments I could muster. I used my clone to great effect; we proced bleed in a massive lump and took the last third of her HP in one smash. After dumping the NPC summon, it took me 3 tries, I recommend it!

I took down another bothersome knight as well, the arena was really tight and the camera killed me more often than not. I found a clever strategy though, and managed to no-hit him in the end (I'm a bit ashamed of the cheese).

I'm Scadutree level 9 now and doing good damage, most mobs don't hit that hard anymore either. It's been fun, for the most part. I just arrived at a junction where I assume another boss is waiting, I need some rest before I try any more now.

Thanks so much man, Taking the summons is where I was going wrong, the bosses HP bar doubles. Rellana is so much more manageable now, I got her to 20% a few times with mimic tear alone. And yes, the camera sucks but what's new for souls/borne and cramped areas. 



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LegitHyperbole said:

I really want to be in love with this game again so I espec'd to 50 vigor and now I can take 2 or 3 hits. Doing shit for damage but those 10 points made a big difference, waaaay more than it should have had and same for the loss of damage. I'm going 50 vigor, 50 endurance and 70 in my main stat plus item requirements. Does this seem about right folks, or should I sacrifice more Endurance/main stat for vigor? Is my endurance too high?

Were you not even at 50 vigor? I'm curious, how did your build looks like? 

Rule of thumb: 50 to 60 vigor ALWAYS. Forget about being a glass cannon, it's not worth it. If you still not feeling 60 vigor is enough try Morgotts Rune. Otherwise use defensive talismans

Survivability comes before damage. There are too many flasks and recover options to save your ass if you know how to recover in the right moment. In practice you have very good health options to kill bosses slowly in attrition battles. It's safer than going for higher damage but getting killed quickly before getting the opportunity to use flasks to recover 

50 endurance is way too much unless you're using strength builds with very heavy greatweapons, in any case if you are one-handing a strength weapon don't go past 54 strength, single handing gives you a 50% boost in str and the soft cap past 80 strength makes the returns minimal 

Don't wield great weapon if you main stat is not strength, this kind of weapon needs big endurance investment which imo is not worth it 

If you're not doing strength build, use whatever endurance you need to equip a good armor (target 51 poise), wield your weapon(s) and still mid-rolling 

Never go over 80 in your main damage stat. 70 can work. If you weapons scale with two stats sometimes 60-60 works better than 80-40, you need to see how is your weapon scalling and decide which attributes makes sense to raise 

Instead of upgrading endurance and other damage stats, see if you have enough faith to use a sacred seal and use buffs.  The boost in defense and damage done is often bigger than what you could get investing directly in stats damage or investing in endurance to use heavier Armour (clawmark seal only needs 10 FAI)



IcaroRibeiro said:
LegitHyperbole said:

I really want to be in love with this game again so I espec'd to 50 vigor and now I can take 2 or 3 hits. Doing shit for damage but those 10 points made a big difference, waaaay more than it should have had and same for the loss of damage. I'm going 50 vigor, 50 endurance and 70 in my main stat plus item requirements. Does this seem about right folks, or should I sacrifice more Endurance/main stat for vigor? Is my endurance too high?

Were you not even at 50 vigor? I'm curious, how did your build looks like? 

Rule of thumb: 50 to 60 vigor ALWAYS. Forget about being a glass cannon, it's not worth it. If you still not feeling 60 vigor is enough try Morgotts Rune. Otherwise use defensive talismans

Survivability comes before damage. There are too many flasks and recover options to save your ass if you know how to recover in the right moment. In practice you have very good health options to kill bosses slowly in attrition battles. It's safer than going for higher damage but getting killed quickly before getting the opportunity to use flasks to recover 

50 endurance is way too much unless you're using strength builds with very heavy greatweapons, in any case if you are one-handing a strength weapon don't go past 54 strength, single handing gives you a 50% boost in str and the soft cap past 80 strength makes the returns minimal 

Don't wield great weapon if you main stat is not strength, this kind of weapon needs big endurance investment which imo is not worth it 

If you're not doing strength build, use whatever endurance you need to equip a good armor (target 51 poise), wield your weapon(s) and still mid-rolling 

Never go over 80 in your main damage stat. 70 can work. If you weapons scale with two stats sometimes 60-60 works better than 80-40, you need to see how is your weapon scalling and decide which attributes makes sense to raise 

Instead of upgrading endurance and other damage stats, see if you have enough faith to use a sacred seal and use buffs.  The boost in defense and damage done is often bigger than what you could get investing directly in stats damage or investing in endurance to use heavier Armour (clawmark seal only needs 10 FAI)

My build was 40 vigor 40 endurance and 94 INT (4 from talismans) for my duel blade Moonviel and Magic uchigatana then I use a seal to spread rotten breath if I need serious help. I also used the talisman that greatly enhances HP which I thought might account for the some vigor. 

I'm now at 50 vigor 50 endurance and 74 INT with the same build. Feels a lot better for the DLC. I had no issues in the main game, my philosophy is that you only need one estus keeping the vigor around abouts the size of a fill makes sense but I agree, for difficulty like in this DLC that is not worth it. There was a time when I used to be able to play souls games with nout much of a health pool at all but those days are passed. 

I have the faith allright but at 15 I only use it for Rotten breath, comet azure and madulas moonblade not sure if buffs will work with that. Now that I'm thinking on it, my build kinda socks but it feels really good to play and it's really nimble and agile. 



LegitHyperbole said:
IcaroRibeiro said:

Were you not even at 50 vigor? I'm curious, how did your build looks like? 

Rule of thumb: 50 to 60 vigor ALWAYS. Forget about being a glass cannon, it's not worth it. If you still not feeling 60 vigor is enough try Morgotts Rune. Otherwise use defensive talismans

Survivability comes before damage. There are too many flasks and recover options to save your ass if you know how to recover in the right moment. In practice you have very good health options to kill bosses slowly in attrition battles. It's safer than going for higher damage but getting killed quickly before getting the opportunity to use flasks to recover 

50 endurance is way too much unless you're using strength builds with very heavy greatweapons, in any case if you are one-handing a strength weapon don't go past 54 strength, single handing gives you a 50% boost in str and the soft cap past 80 strength makes the returns minimal 

Don't wield great weapon if you main stat is not strength, this kind of weapon needs big endurance investment which imo is not worth it 

If you're not doing strength build, use whatever endurance you need to equip a good armor (target 51 poise), wield your weapon(s) and still mid-rolling 

Never go over 80 in your main damage stat. 70 can work. If you weapons scale with two stats sometimes 60-60 works better than 80-40, you need to see how is your weapon scalling and decide which attributes makes sense to raise 

Instead of upgrading endurance and other damage stats, see if you have enough faith to use a sacred seal and use buffs.  The boost in defense and damage done is often bigger than what you could get investing directly in stats damage or investing in endurance to use heavier Armour (clawmark seal only needs 10 FAI)

My build was 40 vigor 40 endurance and 94 INT (4 from talismans) for my duel blade Moonviel and Magic uchigatana then I use a seal to spread rotten breath if I need serious help. I also used the talisman that greatly enhances HP which I thought might account for the some vigor. 

I'm now at 50 vigor 50 endurance and 74 INT with the same build. Feels a lot better for the DLC. I had no issues in the main game, my philosophy is that you only need one estus keeping the vigor around abouts the size of a fill makes sense but I agree, for difficulty like in this DLC that is not worth it. There was a time when I used to be able to play souls games with nout much of a health pool at all but those days are passed. 

I have the faith allright but at 15 I only use it for Rotten breath, comet azure and madulas moonblade not sure if buffs will work with that. Now that I'm thinking on it, my build kinda socks but it feels really good to play and it's really nimble and agile. 

Your build is terrible 

The Tasliman which greatly increases HP only increases 10% of HP on its +3 version (and that's assuming this is your version). It goes without saying if the increase is in percentage it benefits from having higher vigor

At 40 Vigor your healthy is 1450, with the Talisman it goes to 1595

You get the same effect by leveling up Vigor by 5 points (45 vigor is 1581 HP) so, imo, it's a wasted tasliman at 40 Vigor. Go for 60 if you want to use it, but imo you are better off using a defensive Talisman 

You did right removing this useless 14 points in Intelligence 

Why do you want so much endurance if you are using moonveil? It's a light weapon. Endurance is not good for increasing stamina, the returns are bad. Use something like the turtle Talisman that increases stamina recovery speed, much better than dunping 25 useless points in endurance 

Moonveil don't need dual weilding. Use dual wielding when you want to proc stats effects like bleeding. Katanas are great to do that, but for Moonveil what you want is to spam transient Moonlight while you have some glinstone staff for ranged options. If you want to dual wielding katanas for int builds the best options is dual weilding Uchigatanas with Cold infusion (use Chilling mist) + Magic infusions, it requires you start off as Samurai or a NG+, but in the case of NG+ go for dual weilding Nagakiba for extra range

For Moonveil, use it right hand and put a staff on the left hand for ranged sorceries. 80 INT, 50 VIG, 25 END, 40 DEX must be enough. Don't neglect Mind, target 25 to 30. Don't use the Ceruluan Talisman that increase MP, it's bad

If you want more Magic damage (Transient Moonlight is 100% Magic damage I think) uses the scorpion Talisman you get by finishing Seluvis quest line. If you missed it, you can instead use the Tasliman to increase the damage of skills

You can find buffs to increase defense and aura buffs tends to increase all kind of damage, look what incantations you have and learn how to use them correctly. Although since you're using intelligence I highly advice not going for sacred seals because mixing seals and staffs can make your combat pretty awkward 

Last edited by IcaroRibeiro - on 23 June 2024

IcaroRibeiro said:
LegitHyperbole said:

My build was 40 vigor 40 endurance and 94 INT (4 from talismans) for my duel blade Moonviel and Magic uchigatana then I use a seal to spread rotten breath if I need serious help. I also used the talisman that greatly enhances HP which I thought might account for the some vigor. 

I'm now at 50 vigor 50 endurance and 74 INT with the same build. Feels a lot better for the DLC. I had no issues in the main game, my philosophy is that you only need one estus keeping the vigor around abouts the size of a fill makes sense but I agree, for difficulty like in this DLC that is not worth it. There was a time when I used to be able to play souls games with nout much of a health pool at all but those days are passed. 

I have the faith allright but at 15 I only use it for Rotten breath, comet azure and madulas moonblade not sure if buffs will work with that. Now that I'm thinking on it, my build kinda socks but it feels really good to play and it's really nimble and agile. 

Your build is terrible 

The Tasliman which greatly increases HP only increases 10% of HP on its +3 version (and that's assuming this is your version). It goes without saying if the increase is in percentage it benefits or having higher vigor

At 40 Vigor your healthy is 1450, with the Talisman it goes to 1595

You get the same effect by leveling up Vigor by 5 points (45 vigor is 1581 HP) so, imo, it's a wasted tasliman at 40 Vigor. Go for 60 if you want to use it, but imo you are better off using defensive Talisman 

You did right removing this useless 14 points in Intelligence 

Why do you want so much endurance if you are using moonveil? It's a light weapon. Endurance is not good for increasing stamina, the returns are bad. Use something like the turtle Talisman that increases stamina recovery speed, much better than dunping 25 useless points in endurance 

Moonveil don't need dual weilding. Use dual wielding when you want to proc stats effects like bleeding. Katanas are great to do that, but for Moonveil what you want is to spam transient Moonlight while you have some glinstone staff for ranged options. If you want to dual wielding katanas for int builds the best options is dual weilding Uchigatanas with Cold infusion (use Chilling mist) + Magic infusions, it requires you start off as Samurai or a NG+, but in the case of NG+ go for dual weilding Nagakiba for extra range

For Moonveil, use it right hand and put a staff on the left hand for ranged sorceries. 80 INT, 50 VIG, 25 END, 40 DEX must be enough. Don't neglect Mind, target 25 to 30. Don't use the Ceruluan Talisman that increase MP, it's bad

You can find buffs to increase defense and aura buffs tends to increase all kind of damage, look what incantations you have and learn how to use them correctly. Although since you're using intelligence I highly advice not going for sacred seals because mixing seals and staffs can make your combat pretty awkward 

It's not terrible for my play style but it is a bad build on paper. Here's my latest rellana attempt, I don't thiink you can inbue Moonviel with buffs from a seal though...



LegitHyperbole said:
IcaroRibeiro said:

Your build is terrible 

The Tasliman which greatly increases HP only increases 10% of HP on its +3 version (and that's assuming this is your version). It goes without saying if the increase is in percentage it benefits or having higher vigor

At 40 Vigor your healthy is 1450, with the Talisman it goes to 1595

You get the same effect by leveling up Vigor by 5 points (45 vigor is 1581 HP) so, imo, it's a wasted tasliman at 40 Vigor. Go for 60 if you want to use it, but imo you are better off using defensive Talisman 

You did right removing this useless 14 points in Intelligence 

Why do you want so much endurance if you are using moonveil? It's a light weapon. Endurance is not good for increasing stamina, the returns are bad. Use something like the turtle Talisman that increases stamina recovery speed, much better than dunping 25 useless points in endurance 

Moonveil don't need dual weilding. Use dual wielding when you want to proc stats effects like bleeding. Katanas are great to do that, but for Moonveil what you want is to spam transient Moonlight while you have some glinstone staff for ranged options. If you want to dual wielding katanas for int builds the best options is dual weilding Uchigatanas with Cold infusion (use Chilling mist) + Magic infusions, it requires you start off as Samurai or a NG+, but in the case of NG+ go for dual weilding Nagakiba for extra range

For Moonveil, use it right hand and put a staff on the left hand for ranged sorceries. 80 INT, 50 VIG, 25 END, 40 DEX must be enough. Don't neglect Mind, target 25 to 30. Don't use the Ceruluan Talisman that increase MP, it's bad

You can find buffs to increase defense and aura buffs tends to increase all kind of damage, look what incantations you have and learn how to use them correctly. Although since you're using intelligence I highly advice not going for sacred seals because mixing seals and staffs can make your combat pretty awkward 

It's not terrible for my play style but it is a bad build on paper. Here's my latest rellana attempt, I don't thiink you can inbue Moonviel with buffs from a seal though...

Well watching the video I can say I'm 100% sure your build is bad. You're not using this weapons the way they are designed to be used and is not using the correct resources to increase their damage input. Looking to Relanna she doesn't look particularly challenging to me.  Look how your clone is using the Moonveil more efficiently than you making use of its broken Ashe of War

If this is the playstyle you want, dump Moonveil and dual wield Uchigatanas and change them to occult infusion, respect to Arcane and watch this build decimate bosses (literally beat Malenia first try)

(Sadly don't work in bosses with bleed resistance like Radagon and Elden Best)

Last edited by IcaroRibeiro - on 23 June 2024