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shavenferret on 30 July 2025
the-pi-guy said:
shavenferret said:

Finally, your point about the nazis is a bunch of hogwash, and actually what you call a fallacy. 

Because X does this, if Y also does that then that is evil of Y. No, you have to examine each action and it's quite ironic to compare Israelis to nazis. 

The violence, starvation that Israel is pushing on Gaza is by definition genocide. 

It really isn't ironic, unless you think somehow people can't give back. 

Do you think someone who was bullied growing up, couldn't possibly become a bully themselves?

Do you think a black person owning a white person wouldn't be slavery?


You think it's somehow impossible for Jewish people to commit genocide? 

It would be a completely different story if there wasn't this constant threat of terrorism from Hamas and similar organizations.  The only way for the palestenians to get better treatment is to collectively end the hostilities and eradicate these groups.  That would go a long way in getting better services and treatment.  

By any rational person, these issues of genocide and so forth don't really fit the classic model, because you have a low level of conflict that will perpetuate into eternity from what it appears.  So it's not really an issue of a stronger group systematically killing and erasing a subordinate group for its own end, not as a byproduct of hostilities which is what we are seeing here.  You might be trying to redefine what genocide means, is that the case? The stronger group in this case is trying to end hostilities so that they can help the weaker group.  But there is so much bad stuff flying around, that it makes this difficult.  

 



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SvennoJ on 30 July 2025
shavenferret said:
SvennoJ said:

Actually half want to leave, they are not allowed out and no country is willing to take in a million refugees. 
https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/almost-half-gazans-willing-leave-survey-finds-2025-05-06/

Besides that, it's their land. Do you tell Ukrainians they should leave?

It's not like a concentration camp, it's a genocide / holodomor. Bombing starving people locked into 18% of a 141 sq mile area or 25 sq miles.

It was the Hebrew people's land before it was the people that the palestenians came from.  Secondly, Israel is trying to get other countries to accept them according to your link.  T hey aren't just being mean stern jews that won't let them leave, that's just not true Svenno.  Like you said, the issue is that other nations won't accept them, mostly because how many of them are terrorists and such.  If they were wealthy and smart like the israeli's then as well as not problematic (many know how to blow people up or use an AK-47), other nations might want them.  But having a mass of the poor, and unwashed isn't something you want to bring to your country so i get it, however unfortunate this may be.

In 1896, Palestine, then under Ottoman rule, had a population comprised mainly of Muslims, with significant minorities of Christians and Jews. A census from that year indicated 371,959 Muslims, 42,689 Christians, and 9,000 Jews. However, these numbers are likely underestimates, as they don't account for Bedouins, individuals with foreign citizenship, or those evading census counts. It's estimated the true population could be closer to 500,000, with Jerusalem having a higher proportion of Jews due to immigration and charitable trusts.

Distribution in Jerusalem was about 50/50 at the time living peacefully together.

UK occupation promoted Zionist migration to the area, the European Jews are the immigrants. 

And it is Israel's far right Zionist policies (not the Jews) that don't let anyone out of Gaza since the total blockade since 2005. Even aid groups that want to medivac Palestinians get denied.
https://prismreports.org/2025/04/17/israel-prevents-medical-evacuations-from-gaza/

Surrounding nations already have tons of Palestinian refugees driven out by Israel over the past 77 years.

https://www.researchgate.net/figure/Palestinian-refugee-Camps-in-Jordan-Lebanon-Palestine-and-Syria-Created-by-Kittaneh_fig2_350893895

Saying how many are terrorist is pure racist. Hamas fighters number 20 to 30 thousand out of 2.1 million people, including all that fired rockets during oct 7, estimated 7,000 of those participated in the attack. A large scale attack as a last resort after all non violent options (like the Gaza border protests 2018-2019) didn't lead anywhere. That doesn't excuse the terrorist attack, for which the ICC rightly issued 3 arrest warrants against Hamas leaders.
https://www.atlanticcouncil.org/blogs/new-atlanticist/the-icc-has-issued-arrest-warrants-in-the-israel-hamas-war-now-what/

Besides all that nearly half of Gaza's population are children. 

Enough with your racism and dehumanization of an entire population, you are part of the problem.



shavenferret on 30 July 2025
SvennoJ said:
shavenferret said:

It was the Hebrew people's land before it was the people that the palestenians came from.  Secondly, Israel is trying to get other countries to accept them according to your link.  T hey aren't just being mean stern jews that won't let them leave, that's just not true Svenno.  Like you said, the issue is that other nations won't accept them, mostly because how many of them are terrorists and such.  If they were wealthy and smart like the israeli's then as well as not problematic (many know how to blow people up or use an AK-47), other nations might want them.  But having a mass of the poor, and unwashed isn't something you want to bring to your country so i get it, however unfortunate this may be.

In 1896, Palestine, then under Ottoman rule, had a population comprised mainly of Muslims, with significant minorities of Christians and Jews. A census from that year indicated 371,959 Muslims, 42,689 Christians, and 9,000 Jews. However, these numbers are likely underestimates, as they don't account for Bedouins, individuals with foreign citizenship, or those evading census counts. It's estimated the true population could be closer to 500,000, with Jerusalem having a higher proportion of Jews due to immigration and charitable trusts.

Distribution in Jerusalem was about 50/50 at the time living peacefully together.

UK occupation promoted Zionist migration to the area, the European Jews are the immigrants. 

And it is Israel's far right Zionist policies (not the Jews) that don't let anyone out of Gaza since the total blockade since 2005. Even aid groups that want to medivac Palestinians get denied.
https://prismreports.org/2025/04/17/israel-prevents-medical-evacuations-from-gaza/

Surrounding nations already have tons of Palestinian refugees driven out by Israel over the past 77 years.

https://www.researchgate.net/figure/Palestinian-refugee-Camps-in-Jordan-Lebanon-Palestine-and-Syria-Created-by-Kittaneh_fig2_350893895

Saying how many are terrorist is pure racist. Hamas fighters number 20 to 30 thousand out of 2.1 million people, including all that fired rockets during oct 7, estimated 7,000 of those participated in the attack. A large scale attack as a last resort after all non violent options (like the Gaza border protests 2018-2019) didn't lead anywhere. That doesn't excuse the terrorist attack, for which the ICC rightly issued 3 arrest warrants against Hamas leaders.
https://www.atlanticcouncil.org/blogs/new-atlanticist/the-icc-has-issued-arrest-warrants-in-the-israel-hamas-war-now-what/

Besides all that nearly half of Gaza's population are children. 

Enough with your racism and dehumanization of an entire population, you are part of the problem.

As always true with the world, a few bad apples spoil the bunch, and so the palestenians aren't known for their culture.  They are known for blowing stuff up and firing AK's with the A-lalalalallllaallalal stuff.   If they wanted to change this, then it would be a great idea to tone down the violence.   

20 or 30, 000?  I would call that many.  So, yes, my statement that many know how to use an AK isn't wrong/racists.  



shavenferret on 30 July 2025
sc94597 said:
shavenferret said:

It was the Hebrew people's land before it was the people that the palestenians came from.  

Israeli Jews, Christian Palestinians, and Muslim Palestinians all have overwhelmingly significant prehistoric Levant ancestry. All three groups descend from Canaanites. All three groups even descend (in part) from historic Jewish populations.

Muslim Palestinians are slightly Arab-shifted and Ashkenazi Jews/Sephardic Jews are moderately European-shifted, but the bulk of the ancestry of both groups (and Christian Palestianians) is indigenous, prehistoric Levant ancestry. 

It really doesn't make sense to talk about "more indigenous" when both groups have strong ancestral ties to the Southern Levant. 

You aren't confusing the Hebrews with Jews are you?



sc94597 on 30 July 2025
shavenferret said:
sc94597 said:

Israeli Jews, Christian Palestinians, and Muslim Palestinians all have overwhelmingly significant prehistoric Levant ancestry. All three groups descend from Canaanites. All three groups even descend (in part) from historic Jewish populations.

Muslim Palestinians are slightly Arab-shifted and Ashkenazi Jews/Sephardic Jews are moderately European-shifted, but the bulk of the ancestry of both groups (and Christian Palestianians) is indigenous, prehistoric Levant ancestry. 

It really doesn't make sense to talk about "more indigenous" when both groups have strong ancestral ties to the Southern Levant. 

You aren't confusing the Hebrews with Jews are you?

For the context of this discussion I don't see why the distinction between Hebrew (an ethnic and/or linguistic qualifier) and Jew (an ethnic and/or religious qualifier) matters. 

I guess we can discuss non-Jewish Hebrew peoples, like the Samaritans, but it doesn't do anything to the point being made that all modern groups in this conflict have overwhelming pre-historic Levant ancestry and all have a justifiable claim of being indigenous to the region. 

https://english.m.tau.ac.il/news/canaanites

Last edited by sc94597 - on 30 July 2025

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SvennoJ on 30 July 2025
shavenferret said:
SvennoJ said:

In 1896, Palestine, then under Ottoman rule, had a population comprised mainly of Muslims, with significant minorities of Christians and Jews. A census from that year indicated 371,959 Muslims, 42,689 Christians, and 9,000 Jews. However, these numbers are likely underestimates, as they don't account for Bedouins, individuals with foreign citizenship, or those evading census counts. It's estimated the true population could be closer to 500,000, with Jerusalem having a higher proportion of Jews due to immigration and charitable trusts.

Distribution in Jerusalem was about 50/50 at the time living peacefully together.

UK occupation promoted Zionist migration to the area, the European Jews are the immigrants. 

And it is Israel's far right Zionist policies (not the Jews) that don't let anyone out of Gaza since the total blockade since 2005. Even aid groups that want to medivac Palestinians get denied.
https://prismreports.org/2025/04/17/israel-prevents-medical-evacuations-from-gaza/

Surrounding nations already have tons of Palestinian refugees driven out by Israel over the past 77 years.

https://www.researchgate.net/figure/Palestinian-refugee-Camps-in-Jordan-Lebanon-Palestine-and-Syria-Created-by-Kittaneh_fig2_350893895

Saying how many are terrorist is pure racist. Hamas fighters number 20 to 30 thousand out of 2.1 million people, including all that fired rockets during oct 7, estimated 7,000 of those participated in the attack. A large scale attack as a last resort after all non violent options (like the Gaza border protests 2018-2019) didn't lead anywhere. That doesn't excuse the terrorist attack, for which the ICC rightly issued 3 arrest warrants against Hamas leaders.
https://www.atlanticcouncil.org/blogs/new-atlanticist/the-icc-has-issued-arrest-warrants-in-the-israel-hamas-war-now-what/

Besides all that nearly half of Gaza's population are children. 

Enough with your racism and dehumanization of an entire population, you are part of the problem.

As always true with the world, a few bad apples spoil the bunch, and so the palestenians aren't known for their culture.  They are known for blowing stuff up and firing AK's with the A-lalalalallllaallalal stuff.   If they wanted to change this, then it would be a great idea to tone down the violence.   

20 or 30, 000?  I would call that many.  So, yes, my statement that many know how to use an AK isn't wrong/racists.  

The IDF has about 170K active personel and nearly half million reservists. Service in the IDF is mandatory in Israel, nearly everyone is trained to terrorize Palestinians. 

And they are terrorists, posting their war crimes online. (Making it easy for the Hind Rijab foundation to routinely present countries with evidence against spotted IDF terrorists)

Training in the IDF consists of teaching Israelis how to terrorize Palestinians.
https://www.phr.org.il/wp-content/uploads/2020/11/Exposed_Life_Short_ENG.pdf
https://www.972mag.com/trauma-idf-home-raids-palestinians/
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/nov/29/dehumanising-israeli-groups-verdict-on-military-invasions-of-palestinian-homes
https://apnews.com/article/politics-israel-government-palestinian-territories-west-bank-68f7590fe86ca7dc7b37e5775e41d711
That's all before Oct 7 2023.

And has been going on since the Lehi and Irgun were formed (and later folded into the IDF)
https://www.palestinechronicle.com/from-1948-until-today-a-history-of-silencing-israeli-army-whistleblowers/

Israel has always been the aggressor while taking more and more land.



shavenferret on 30 July 2025
SvennoJ said:
shavenferret said:

As always true with the world, a few bad apples spoil the bunch, and so the palestenians aren't known for their culture.  They are known for blowing stuff up and firing AK's with the A-lalalalallllaallalal stuff.   If they wanted to change this, then it would be a great idea to tone down the violence.   

20 or 30, 000?  I would call that many.  So, yes, my statement that many know how to use an AK isn't wrong/racists.  

The IDF has about 170K active personel and nearly half million reservists. Service in the IDF is mandatory in Israel, nearly everyone is trained to terrorize Palestinians. 

And they are terrorists, posting their war crimes online. (Making it easy for the Hind Rijab foundation to routinely present countries with evidence against spotted IDF terrorists)

Training in the IDF consists of teaching Israelis how to terrorize Palestinians.
https://www.phr.org.il/wp-content/uploads/2020/11/Exposed_Life_Short_ENG.pdf
https://www.972mag.com/trauma-idf-home-raids-palestinians/
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/nov/29/dehumanising-israeli-groups-verdict-on-military-invasions-of-palestinian-homes
https://apnews.com/article/politics-israel-government-palestinian-territories-west-bank-68f7590fe86ca7dc7b37e5775e41d711
That's all before Oct 7 2023.

And has been going on since the Lehi and Irgun were formed (and later folded into the IDF)
https://www.palestinechronicle.com/from-1948-until-today-a-history-of-silencing-israeli-army-whistleblowers/

Israel has always been the aggressor while taking more and more land.

At least the IDF has some safeguards and rules in place.  Not every lugnut soldier is gonna follow the proper stuff all the time.  But at least they have rules.  Does hamas?  lmao.                                          

The palestenians made themselves the enemy of the jews a long time ago.  And the jews have been defending themselves since.  Since the jews punch above their weight, the palestenians have to complain about it.  But if they stopped fighting then there wouldn't be a problem any more.  It's like complaining about the other guy kneeing you in the balls which might sound unfair but you slapped him with a weak ass arm first.  Of course, you will get struck with something in that case. 



Ryuu96 on 30 July 2025
shavenferret said:
SvennoJ said:

-Snip-

They can move elsewhere.  Israel should pay for the buses to cart them away if things are so bad that it's like a concentration camp or something.  But this would never work, because they want to stay there, and be angry because they are kept out of control.  If they don't like that, then they should leave.

Why should they? It's their home. Should Ukrainians move somewhere else? Of course they're mad about having to move from their homes because Israel is blowing it to pieces. You seriously have some unhealthy dislike of Palestinians, you ought to have some self-reflection on the matter because you're almost sounding like how Putin talks about Ukrainians.

shavenferret said:
SvennoJ said:

-Snip-

It was the Hebrew people's land before it was the people that the palestenians came from.  Secondly, Israel is trying to get other countries to accept them according to your link.  T hey aren't just being mean stern jews that won't let them leave, that's just not true Svenno.  Like you said, the issue is that other nations won't accept them, mostly because how many of them are terrorists and such.  If they were wealthy and smart like the israeli's then as well as not problematic (many know how to blow people up or use an AK-47), other nations might want them.  But having a mass of the poor, and unwashed isn't something you want to bring to your country so i get it, however unfortunate this may be.

Dude, Israel is literally bombing the shit out of their home indiscriminately, to Israel they either leave or they kill them, at the end of the day it's the same thing to Israel, they remove Palestinians from Gaza and steal their land dead or alive. Other countries aren't accepting them because they don't want to accept hundreds of thousands of refugees, especially a country like Egypt which is in a fragile state lately.

How many of them are terrorists? We're talking millions. Gaza's population largely skews towards children and women. Do you think the children in those images are terrorists? They aren't wealthy because they've spent the last 30+ years being beaten down with no support. They only know how to fight precisely because Israel has been attacking them for years.

shavenferret said:
the-pi-guy said:

The violence, starvation that Israel is pushing on Gaza is by definition genocide. 

It really isn't ironic, unless you think somehow people can't give back. 

Do you think someone who was bullied growing up, couldn't possibly become a bully themselves?

Do you think a black person owning a white person wouldn't be slavery?


You think it's somehow impossible for Jewish people to commit genocide? 

It would be a completely different story if there wasn't this constant threat of terrorism from Hamas and similar organizations.  The only way for the palestenians to get better treatment is to collectively end the hostilities and eradicate these groups.  That would go a long way in getting better services and treatment.  

By any rational person, these issues of genocide and so forth don't really fit the classic model, because you have a low level of conflict that will perpetuate into eternity from what it appears.  So it's not really an issue of a stronger group systematically killing and erasing a subordinate group for its own end, not as a byproduct of hostilities which is what we are seeing here.  You might be trying to redefine what genocide means, is that the case? The stronger group in this case is trying to end hostilities so that they can help the weaker group.  But there is so much bad stuff flying around, that it makes this difficult.  

Okay, Hamas is a terrorist organisation, you don't fight a terrorist organisation by slaughtering innocent people and trying to genocide an entire population though. Take a look at Ukraine, do you see Ukraine who is in a far worse position than Israel, Ukraine who is weaker than Israel, fighting a country far more powerful than Hamas, do you see Ukraine casually and purposely bombing the shit out of Russian citizens? Do you see all the rules Ukraine places on itself? Do you see Israel doing the same? Because I don't. They bomb what they want. Whenever they want. Using whatever they want. They don't give a single fuck. Hamas is a terrorist organisation. So is the IDF.

How are Palestinians meant to get rid of Hamas when Israel is blowing the same Palestinians to pieces?

Deliberately trying to displace an entire population and at the same time killing as many as possible is genocide.

Last edited by Ryuu96 - on 30 July 2025

shavenferret on 30 July 2025
Ryuu96 said:
shavenferret said:

They can move elsewhere.  Israel should pay for the buses to cart them away if things are so bad that it's like a concentration camp or something.  But this would never work, because they want to stay there, and be angry because they are kept out of control.  If they don't like that, then they should leave.

Why should they? It's their home. Should Ukrainians move somewhere else? Of course they're mad about having to move from their homes because Israel is blowing it to pieces. You seriously have some unhealthy dislike of Palestinians, you ought to have some self-reflection on the matter because you're almost sounding like how Putin talks about Ukrainians.

shavenferret said:

It was the Hebrew people's land before it was the people that the palestenians came from.  Secondly, Israel is trying to get other countries to accept them according to your link.  T hey aren't just being mean stern jews that won't let them leave, that's just not true Svenno.  Like you said, the issue is that other nations won't accept them, mostly because how many of them are terrorists and such.  If they were wealthy and smart like the israeli's then as well as not problematic (many know how to blow people up or use an AK-47), other nations might want them.  But having a mass of the poor, and unwashed isn't something you want to bring to your country so i get it, however unfortunate this may be.

Dude, Israel is literally bombing the shit out of their home indiscriminately, to Israel they either leave or they kill them, at the end of the day it's the same thing to Israel, they remove Palestinians from Gaza and steal their land dead or alive. Other countries aren't accepting them because they don't want to accept hundreds of thousands of refugees, especially a country like Egypt which is in a fragile state lately.

How many of them are terrorists? We're talking millions. Gaza's population largely skews towards children and women. Do you think the children in those images are terrorists? They aren't wealthy because they've spent the last 30+ years being beaten down with no support. They only know how to fight precisely because Israel has been attacking them for years.

shavenferret said:

It would be a completely different story if there wasn't this constant threat of terrorism from Hamas and similar organizations.  The only way for the palestenians to get better treatment is to collectively end the hostilities and eradicate these groups.  That would go a long way in getting better services and treatment.  

By any rational person, these issues of genocide and so forth don't really fit the classic model, because you have a low level of conflict that will perpetuate into eternity from what it appears.  So it's not really an issue of a stronger group systematically killing and erasing a subordinate group for its own end, not as a byproduct of hostilities which is what we are seeing here.  You might be trying to redefine what genocide means, is that the case? The stronger group in this case is trying to end hostilities so that they can help the weaker group.  But there is so much bad stuff flying around, that it makes this difficult.  

Hamas is a terrorist organisation, you don't fight a terrorist organisation by slaughtering innocent people and trying to genocide an entire population though. Take a look at Ukraine, do you see Ukraine who is in a far worse position than Israel, Ukraine who is weaker than Israel, fighting a country far more powerful than Hamas, do you see Ukraine casually bombing the shit out of Russian citizens and purposely trying to starve them?

How are Palestinians meant to get rid of Hamas when Israel is blowing the same Palestinians to pieces?

Deliberately trying to displace an entire population and at the same time killing as many as possible is genocide.

Then Hamas should back the f off and quit hiding amongst civilians so that war doesn't come to the normal people.  That's the problem with terrorism, it sounds like a lot of fun until it isn't anymore and army comes for you.   Besides that, the only thing that we are going to agree on with this, is that the situation is very complex with neither side looking good.  It's not a one sided beatdown at all, and the israeli's want safety.  They are being hard noses, and to ensure that, they respond the way that they do.  Finally, i can like or dislike anyone, just as i can support or withdraw my support for any cause.  It's my life, correct?  If i support one side or the other, it won't matter at all because both parties usually support israel.  It's just opinions on the internet, just a bunch of air.  

Last edited by shavenferret - on 30 July 2025

SvennoJ on 30 July 2025
shavenferret said:

At least the IDF has some safeguards and rules in place.  Not every lugnut soldier is gonna follow the proper stuff all the time.  But at least they have rules.  Does hamas?  lmao.                                          

The palestenians made themselves the enemy of the jews a long time ago.  And the jews have been defending themselves since.  Since the jews punch above their weight, the palestenians have to complain about it.  But if they stopped fighting then there wouldn't be a problem any more.  It's like complaining about the other guy kneeing you in the balls which might sound unfair but you slapped him with a weak ass arm first.  Of course, you will get struck with something in that case. 

The IDF has no safeguards in place, they ignore there own rules which are pretty much symbolic at this point. Just look at all the testimonies of IDF soldiers.


https://www.cnn.com/2024/08/01/middleeast/israeli-soldier-alleges-serious-misconduct-gaza-intl

Destroyed homes, looting, and a desire for revenge. A former Israel Defense Forces (IDF) reservist has alleged serious misconduct by Israeli forces in Gaza, and a lack of discipline in the command structure, in an interview with CNN.

https://www.opensocietyfoundations.org/voices/israeli-soldiers-break-their-silence-gaza-conflict

The group’s most recent report presents testimonies from the 2014 Gaza War. Collecting stories from over 60 soldiers, the report reveals discrepancies between what the Israeli Defense Forces (IDF) and government spokespersons told the public about what happened in Gaza, and the reality described by the soldiers that took part in the operation.

On June 22, the UN Independent Commission of Inquiry on the 2014 Gaza Conflict published a report highlighting the unprecedented scale of devastation caused by the operation with hundreds of civilians dead and the leveling of entire neighborhoods. Thanks to Breaking the Silence, we understand how shifts in Israel’s military doctrine towards more tolerance for civilian harm contributed to this, as Breaking the Silence’s report on the war concludes: “systematic policies that were dictated to IDF forces of all ranks and in all zones … led to massive and unprecedented harm to the population and the civilian infrastructure in the Gaza Strip.”

https://www.middleeastmonitor.com/20240403-gaza-out-of-control-israeli-troops-do-what-they-want/

And so on and so on. 

Of course Hamas has rules, that's beside the point.

The Jews Israeli Neo-Zionists (stop conflating all Jews with terrorist Zionists) are defending themselves? Who is the aggressor?



Who has taken more and more land since invading the area (not showing the land Israel occupies in Lebanon and Syria)





The Palestinians have made themselves the enemy of the Jews Neo-Zionists because they are the people in the "Land without a People".

The Jews Neo-Zionists punch above their weight because of US military support

They have stopped fighting before, made no difference. The Oslo accords were a sham, Israel never adhered to them.
They have tried peaceful demonstrations, made no difference.

It's mostly the international community to blame for that as it takes a large terrorist attack followed by a genocide for the world to even pay attention to 77 years of occupation and ethnic cleansing. 

shavenferret said:
Ryuu96 said:

Why should they? It's their home. Should Ukrainians move somewhere else? Of course they're mad about having to move from their homes because Israel is blowing it to pieces. You seriously have some unhealthy dislike of Palestinians, you ought to have some self-reflection on the matter because you're almost sounding like how Putin talks about Ukrainians.

shavenferret said:

It was the Hebrew people's land before it was the people that the palestenians came from.  Secondly, Israel is trying to get other countries to accept them according to your link.  T hey aren't just being mean stern jews that won't let them leave, that's just not true Svenno.  Like you said, the issue is that other nations won't accept them, mostly because how many of them are terrorists and such.  If they were wealthy and smart like the israeli's then as well as not problematic (many know how to blow people up or use an AK-47), other nations might want them.  But having a mass of the poor, and unwashed isn't something you want to bring to your country so i get it, however unfortunate this may be.

Dude, Israel is literally bombing the shit out of their home indiscriminately, to Israel they either leave or they kill them, at the end of the day it's the same thing to Israel, they remove Palestinians from Gaza and steal their land dead or alive. Other countries aren't accepting them because they don't want to accept hundreds of thousands of refugees, especially a country like Egypt which is in a fragile state lately.

How many of them are terrorists? We're talking millions. Gaza's population largely skews towards children and women. Do you think the children in those images are terrorists? They aren't wealthy because they've spent the last 30+ years being beaten down with no support. They only know how to fight precisely because Israel has been attacking them for years.

Hamas is a terrorist organisation, you don't fight a terrorist organisation by slaughtering innocent people and trying to genocide an entire population though. Take a look at Ukraine, do you see Ukraine who is in a far worse position than Israel, Ukraine who is weaker than Israel, fighting a country far more powerful than Hamas, do you see Ukraine casually bombing the shit out of Russian citizens and purposely trying to starve them?

How are Palestinians meant to get rid of Hamas when Israel is blowing the same Palestinians to pieces?

Deliberately trying to displace an entire population and at the same time killing as many as possible is genocide.

Then Hamas should back the f off and quit hiding amongst civilians so that war doesn't come to the normal people.  That's the problem with terrorism, it sounds like a lot of fun until it isn't anymore and army comes for you.   Besides that, the only thing that we are going to agree on with this, is that the situation is very complex with neither side looking good.  It's not a one sided beatdown at all, and the israeli's want safety.  They are being hard noses, and to ensure that, they respond the way that they do.  

Spreading more lies. Hamas is not using civilians as human shields, the IDF does however.
https://apnews.com/article/israel-palestinians-hamas-war-army-human-shields-80f358dd2c87a1123f26ffada159701c
They even have a name for it 'mosquito protocol'
https://www.democracynow.org/2025/5/29/israeli_soldiers_using_palestinians_human_shields


The situation is not complex at all. We're not going to agree on that either. That's deflection, refusing to see the real problem. Continued occupation, apartheid and ethnic cleansing now resulting in genocide.
https://www.palestinechronicle.com/israeli-governments-use-of-toxic-deflection-to-justify-annihilation-of-palestinians/

Is Russia's continued occupation of Crimea complex? Should Ukraine enter some form of the Oslo accords and give up land to Russia while living in fragmented areas with Russian settlements patrolled by Russian soldiers?


In the end Israelis are not getting any safer, they are making more and more enemies and are on the way into turning Israel into another North Korea. A pariah state surviving on forever war.
https://www.jewishvoiceforlabour.org.uk/article/israels-forever-war-of-permanent-vengeance/
https://www.timesofisrael.com/against-core-principles-israel-is-leaning-on-reservists-to-fight-its-endless-war/
https://www.securityincontext.org/posts/merchants-of-death-israels-permanent-war-economy

It's not a war, it's a genocide which is a one-sided beat down only much worse.

If the Israelis want safety they need to learn how to live with their neighbors without occupation, apartheid, oppression
https://www.btselem.org/topic/apartheid

Or in your words, leave the county. As many of the more wealthy are doing.
https://www.timesofisrael.com/war-spurs-brain-drain-outflow-of-israeli-high-tech-employees-report-finds/
https://www.middleeasteye.net/news/israel-exodus-over-82000-2024
https://www.newarab.com/news/israeli-exodus-through-taba-sparks-anger-egypt


Israel is turning itself into an extremist society, they're already there but it's only getting worse.
https://www.cnn.com/2025/03/28/middleeast/israel-young-people-extremist-views-intl-cmd

There is no future in that.