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As a Consumer Would You Rather?

Traditional Console + Everything Exclusive 20 42.55%
 
Xbox/PC Hybrid + Access t... 27 57.45%
 
Total:47

Too many Japanese titles coming to Game Pass. Jk

BlazBlue: Cross Tag Battle shouldn't be too far behind and Ghostwire Tokyo this month as well.

Last edited by Ryuu96 - on 03 March 2023

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Next Week - Adding on Not Xbox Specific Stuff.

  • Monday 6th - Sea of Thieves 5th Anniversary & Season 9 Preview | Paradox Interactive Show in Partnership with Xbox.
  • Tuesday 7th - Halo Infinite Season 3 Launch.
  • Thursday 9th - Nacon Connect | The Super Mario Bros. Movie Direct | Capcom Spotlight

Unknown Exact Date: Redfall Preview Event (Rumoured 7th).

Looks like a busy week, everyone is shoving their news into next week.

Could be where Starfield's Direct announcement is as well.



If Fable has gone into full production that probably means holiday 2024 is it's target, Entering full production can sound like it's barely started development but it's one of the final phases other than the final polishing.





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Ryuu96 said:
Machiavellian said:

Well I am going to provide my disagreement.  While Forge is a staple of Halo, it has not produced any more sales or actually added to the player base.  In order for Forge to be as pivotal as you say, we would need to see significant uptick in Halo player base due to forge or its just a fancy tool for a limited few that use it.

I would say the first and primary thing Halo need is new heads that can craft a story and produce a high quality AAA experience.  Forge is one of those tools that is great to have and gives better scope to the game but Forge has been with Halo for a while and I just do not see where it has made a dent in the decline of the game and its audience.

Eh? Did you miss this?

"Earlier this month, we featured four amazing community Forge creations in the Community Collection playlist, which has been the most popular Halo Infinite playlist since the game’s launch."

Forge is arguably a significant reason why Halo Infinite is still alive right now.

As you said, Forge is a staple of Halo, at this stage it's a very important aspect of Halo, hence why the first thing they're doing when moving over to Unreal Engine is seeing if Forge works with it and the sheer amount of effort/resources they have invested into both Halo 5 Forge and now Halo Infinite's Forge.

It's not like that map editor on Doom that nobody cared about, Lol. Forge was fairly popular in Halo 3, exploded in Halo Reach and has since then remained a very popular staple of Halo, to the point where any slight delay to it such as Halo 5's Forge delay causes the Halo fanbase to lose their shit.

Halo sells because of all of the parts added together, a great Campaign and a great Multiplayer suite which includes Forge. You're missing the point that Forge isn't just for those who create with it but those who play those creations, even so, Forge is very user friendly which means a lot of creations are made.

What Forge does is add to the longevity of a Halo title, it allows for people to go from the sweaty Multiplayer to just having pure mindless fun and taking a break from the more competitive side of Halo, without Forge, you would lose a lot of this wacky fun that Halo has given us since Halo 3.

It also now, as of Halo Infinite, allows for very high quality arena/BTB maps that can be created a lot quicker than Developer made maps.

I can assure you that if Halo dropped Forge, the Halo community would absolutely lose their shit and I would join them.

No I did not miss that statement but does that statement means it actually brought in new users and increase the audience of Halo and expanded its reach.  Popular playlist does not mean popular Halo.

So until I actually see the game itself become more popular my point still stand.  Yes, Forge make old heads happy but each and every year Halo continue to lose audience.  If the only thing Halo does is keep the old heads its decline will continue.  Forge is a nice tool as I stated but I would not consider it the top priority going into the new engine.  If I have only a certain amount of engineers, I would rather them get the absolute most out of Unreal then waste years trying to replicate Forge in Unreal and come out with a so so product.

Forge is really a MP component but to get people back into Halo, the Singleplayer must be on point.  That would be my biggest focus.  Since the MP is a free to play service now, if we really want to be realistic and forge is this critical to its success, then leave the MP in the same engine.

For Singleplayer use the Coalition expertise to push the engine for the singleplayer and concentrate on crafting the best SP possible.  Keep the MP in the old engine since its a service and when you are able to dedicate enough engineers to replicate it in Unreal do so.  The 2 components actually probably just should be developed separately anyway.



Machiavellian said:
Ryuu96 said:

Eh? Did you miss this?

"Earlier this month, we featured four amazing community Forge creations in the Community Collection playlist, which has been the most popular Halo Infinite playlist since the game’s launch."

Forge is arguably a significant reason why Halo Infinite is still alive right now.

As you said, Forge is a staple of Halo, at this stage it's a very important aspect of Halo, hence why the first thing they're doing when moving over to Unreal Engine is seeing if Forge works with it and the sheer amount of effort/resources they have invested into both Halo 5 Forge and now Halo Infinite's Forge.

It's not like that map editor on Doom that nobody cared about, Lol. Forge was fairly popular in Halo 3, exploded in Halo Reach and has since then remained a very popular staple of Halo, to the point where any slight delay to it such as Halo 5's Forge delay causes the Halo fanbase to lose their shit.

Halo sells because of all of the parts added together, a great Campaign and a great Multiplayer suite which includes Forge. You're missing the point that Forge isn't just for those who create with it but those who play those creations, even so, Forge is very user friendly which means a lot of creations are made.

What Forge does is add to the longevity of a Halo title, it allows for people to go from the sweaty Multiplayer to just having pure mindless fun and taking a break from the more competitive side of Halo, without Forge, you would lose a lot of this wacky fun that Halo has given us since Halo 3.

It also now, as of Halo Infinite, allows for very high quality arena/BTB maps that can be created a lot quicker than Developer made maps.

I can assure you that if Halo dropped Forge, the Halo community would absolutely lose their shit and I would join them.

No I did not miss that statement but does that statement means it actually brought in new users and increase the audience of Halo and expanded its reach.  Popular playlist does not mean popular Halo.

So until I actually see the game itself become more popular my point still stand.  Yes, Forge make old heads happy but each and every year Halo continue to lose audience.  If the only thing Halo does is keep the old heads its decline will continue.  Forge is a nice tool as I stated but I would not consider it the top priority going into the new engine.  If I have only a certain amount of engineers, I would rather them get the absolute most out of Unreal then waste years trying to replicate Forge in Unreal and come out with a so so product.

Forge is really a MP component but to get people back into Halo, the Singleplayer must be on point.  That would be my biggest focus.  Since the MP is a free to play service now, if we really want to be realistic and forge is this critical to its success, then leave the MP in the same engine.

For Singleplayer use the Coalition expertise to push the engine for the singleplayer and concentrate on crafting the best SP possible.  Keep the MP in the old engine since its a service and when you are able to dedicate enough engineers to replicate it in Unreal do so.  The 2 components actually probably just should be developed separately anyway.

Yes Halo Infinite player base is certainly lower than MS would like. Forge didn't seem to help too much. What was once surely the biggest game series on Xbox Live back in the day is currently the 17th most played game on Xbox, behind 6 other Multiplayer Shooters and only 1 place ahead of BF2042. That Halo can be only the 7th most popular multiplayer shooter on Xbox would be a crazy thought a decade ago.

Popular Xbox games — February 27th, 2023

They seem to have a lot of content in the pipeline for it but I don't know whether that will help it gain popularity. Halo seems a shadow of it's former self.



Machiavellian said:
Ryuu96 said:

-Snip-

No I did not miss that statement but does that statement means it actually brought in new users and increase the audience of Halo and expanded its reach.  Popular playlist does not mean popular Halo.

So until I actually see the game itself become more popular my point still stand.  Yes, Forge make old heads happy but each and every year Halo continue to lose audience.  If the only thing Halo does is keep the old heads its decline will continue.  Forge is a nice tool as I stated but I would not consider it the top priority going into the new engine.  If I have only a certain amount of engineers, I would rather them get the absolute most out of Unreal then waste years trying to replicate Forge in Unreal and come out with a so so product.

Forge is really a MP component but to get people back into Halo, the Singleplayer must be on point.  That would be my biggest focus.  Since the MP is a free to play service now, if we really want to be realistic and forge is this critical to its success, then leave the MP in the same engine.

For Singleplayer use the Coalition expertise to push the engine for the singleplayer and concentrate on crafting the best SP possible.  Keep the MP in the old engine since its a service and when you are able to dedicate enough engineers to replicate it in Unreal do so.  The 2 components actually probably just should be developed separately anyway.

What we do know is the Forge Community Collection playlist has been the most popular Halo Infinite playlist since the game's launch.

That's not a stat that you can just ignore, it tells us that the Forge playlist is more popular than any other Halo Infinite playlist it has ever received. It's safe to say that Forge has not only stemmed the bleeding but also likely brought back some Halo players who dipped out. Over 1m Forge creations as well is because it is user friendly for a map creator and Custom Games Browser (linked to Forge) is very popular on both Master Chief Collection and Halo Infinite, a feature requested by many for years.

Halo's fanbase is large enough on its own, I mean, the title had 20m players when it first launched, likely a huge amount dipped out because of content issues and Forge plays a part in that just as much as stuff like extra developer made maps and based on the stat above, Forge is more popular than anything 343 has ever put out for Infinite.

Forge appeals to a large portion of Halo's traditional and large fanbase. Another extra stat is how healthy Halo content creators videos became again when Forge finally launched. Halo lost its audience because its post launch was dreadful, it's as simple as that, it's not complicated and requires Halo to massively revamp itself. Halo Infinite had a huge launch but they couldn't keep the players satisfied long term because it was missing a ton of features, such as classic game modes, no PvE, no Forge, a lack of post launch maps, etc.

Forge in Halo 3 & Reach was huge. Forge was also great in Halo 5 and helped to contribute to a healthy post launch support. Coincidentally, all of those 3 titles are labelled as having the healthiest Multiplayer user retention and Forge was either at launch (3/Reach) or launched a few months after (5) for all 3. Forge meanwhile was awful in Halo 4 and 343i received a lot of criticism for it...Coincidentally...Halo 4's Multiplayer user retention cratered not long after launch. Coincidentally, Infinite's Most Popular playlist is inherently linked to Forge, hmm.

There is no guarantee that focusing on Campaign will bring in new users either, especially when it's the 7th entry in a long running story, Lol. Infinite by all accounts was the best chance at bringing in a ton of new users, it was a story soft rebooted with a huge changeup to formula (open world) and yet by all accounts it looks like Infinite's Campaign kinda flopped and I say that as someone who prefers Campaign way more to Multiplayer.

At the end of the day as well, the Forge team is separate to the core Multiplayer team and largely developed out of house by Skybox Labs.

Appealing to new users shouldn't come at the expense of pissing off millions of your traditional audience, Forge provides a large part of the "fun" aspect of Halo and has done since Halo 3. Look at Halo 2, it was an incredibly sweaty Halo but Halo 3+ became a perfect blend of competitive & fun and sold a ton, as did Halo Reach. Forge plays a huge part in allowing Halo players to go from competitive to just sheer mindless joy.

As I've said as well, Forge allows the community to get maps out quicker, a lot faster than internally developed maps and due to how good Forge is now, it allows maps that are almost indistinguishable from internally developer made maps. Forge tools nowadays are incredibly good and it would be completely pointless and stupid to throw that all away.

Infinite's MP won't last forever, definitely not that "10 year" plan, it's almost certainly going to be replaced by Certain Affinity's Unreal Engine Halo Multiplayer project when it launches or shortly after, if that happens, I don't see 343i juggling two engines (Slipspace and Unreal Engine). They'll most likely dump Slipspace and move everything over to Unreal Engine because that would be the most efficient way, especially since Slipspace is a major reason why their content feed is so slow.

I could see the next Halo going back to a traditional Campaign/Multiplay paid suite, whilst Certain Affinity's project is likely the F2P project. Similar to how CoD operates, they've still got Campaign/Multiplayer as the paid entry but they also have Warzone sitting alongside it as the F2P entry, I think Certain Affinity's project will be the Warzone and 343 will likely abandon core F2P Multiplayer.



WoodenPints said:

If Fable has gone into full production that probably means holiday 2024 is it's target, Entering full production can sound like it's barely started development but it's one of the final phases other than the final polishing.

That is my hope. If it recently entered full production that was probably like January or December. December 2022 or January 2023 through maybe November 2024 should be plenty of time, considering the game entered pre-production in 2017 or 2018 (depending on whether or not their first game when the RPG team formed in 2017 was Fable or a cancelled new IP, we never heard) and probably entered partial production by late 2020. They have surely gotten quite alot done during those 2+ partial production years, and now they'll have nearly 2 years of full production with what seems to be about 170 devs at Playground RPG studio and probably at least 100 devs at Eidos Montreal, possibly more. 



It seems Amazon is censoring Namco Bandai's MMO Blue Protocol for the western release, smh. I will never understand this whole western push to censor Japanese games, Blue Protocol features adult playable characters and is rated T for Teen in the US, and the outfits I have seen censored would not have effected that T for Teen rating in the slightest.